Desperate. Dh sex addiction.

[torninpieces]

namechange test

Have obviously namechanged, though have been more of a lurker than a poster for a while. But I really really hope that someone (WWIFN? SGB?) can offer me any advice. I am in so much pain.
So I have been with dh for nearly 18 years, and and love him so, so much, always have.
Some history; we'd both had some slightly unconventional sexual history; occasional threesomes etc, and tbh it was lovely to find someone who felt like an 'equal' in that regard. It didn't feel like a big deal to me.
Within a year or so we'd had the v occasional 'thing' with a couple he knew, who were lovely, but we saw them rarely, and certainly not always for sex. Dcs came along after a few years, and there were several years of nothing like that at all, which was completely fine, not even on my radar.
then we did do it again with some other dear friends, again they were in the main just regular friends, the sex was maybe 0.5% of our relationship, but dh was clearly keen for more, and at his instigation we met up with a couple of others that he'd found on the internet.
At this point I decided this wasn't for me. I really liked having sex with people I liked/ loved anyway, but these weren't even people Id normally be friends with, and I was clear with dh that I wasn't up for anything like that again, unless with people I knew and loved.
I knew he was disappointed, but seemed to understand. He certainly didn't seem to feel it as a huge deal, or say that it was really important to him.
I'm torn between trying not to drip-feed and not making this the longest post ever, there may be other details but this is the gist of the history.
I'm aware this might sound like we were crazed swingers, but truly, we were together for years and this felt like such a rare, small part of 'us' to me.
we got married a few years ago, and we've always got on really well, never really argued much, very loving respectful, honest relationship, I thought, though dh has always been more 'stressy' than me, about work etc, and can be quite grumpy.
Last spring he was clearly v v stressed, and wouldn't have sex with me; this has never happened before. He broke down and said that he wanted to tell me everythoing, that for years, since the dcs were tine, he'd been meeting men in saunas for sex, not often, but regularly. He'd had a safe sex scare and was waiting for results. He was going to stop, didn't really consider himself gay/ bi especially, had seen it as a weird stress release thing, wanted to now be honest, finish it. Also said that he'd always thought I knew!!!???!!! Which baffled me; he'd never been especially 'with' the men when we'd been together, and how on earth would I have known? I'd always completely trusted him.
There'd also been a bit of an angry response a few months before when I'd expressed some misgivings about his porn use (not keen on porn for many reasons, but never said DO NOT USE IT); I HAD had a feeling there was 'something' I wasn't party to and had asked him that if there was something he was thinking of/ looking at a lot, could he let me know, because I was feeling a bit as though I was being excluded, or something, couldn't put my finger on it. He was, looking back on it, ott defensive. Said he hardly ever looked, and what did I want, a report or something? I let it go. I still believed him. And we did a lot of taliking, both did some self-developement courses, made a lot of time for each other, decided we could deal with his together.
And since the stuff came out in the spring we've been great, really better than for years, loving, just lovely. Just over a month ago I told him that I really felt like it was over, that I trusted him again.
About a week after that he told me he'd been looking at some sexy photos of us from years ago on the computer, and I asked where they were, hadn't looked at them for years myself and knew they'd be very well hidden in case the dcs were ever to be on that computer (unlikely). He told me where they were hidden, and there was a flash of something across his face that just made me think 'shit, there's something else there'.
He went away for two nights with work and I looked, and my fucking world came crashing down in pieces.
There were pictures of quite a few women, some explicit, with names attached to the files.
I couldn't phone ( he was abroad) but sent him an email saying wtf? and don't bullshit me. He rang that night to say that they were women he'd paid for sex.
This may not be the case for everyone, but for me that is a fucking huge, huge, dealbreaker deal in a way that even sex with men in saunas wasn't. I would never never dream that I could be with a man who uses prostitutes, sex workers for me are women who are at least likely to be vulnerable and what kind of scummy bastard wants to have sex with someone under those circumstances.
And yet, this is my darling dh, and I've love dhim for so long and I can't just stop. I can't believe any of this is happening.
This was a month ago. I'm just becoming able to eat and sleep and function. I never knew anything could hurt so much.
He kept lying about details for the first 2 weeks, which felt like it would kill me as new stuff came out.
the porn was amassive part of it, and he found these women on a website.
He now says I know everything. I believe him, but I believed him all the other times too.
He believes he has a sex addiction, which makes sense as a model. He is attending sex aa 12 step meetings 3 times a week, is seeing a specialist counsellor, is doing everything 'right', is desperate not to lose us, but I am in pieces and can't think straight or make any decisions. we've slept seperately from the day it came out, and he's moving out for a couple of weeks to give me head space.
What on earth can I do? can I live with a addict; but I can't imagine life without him, esp as we have a dc with a challenging disability, but also I just love him, I just want this to stop.
Shit this is so long, thank you so much for getting to the end. If anyone can give me thoughts, please, be kind. Especially if you have any experience of sex addiction. Thank you.

Sorry I dont have any advice really as this is all way out of my sphere of experience but I didnt want to read it and say nothing.

Maybe you need to accept this is going to take a long time to recover from but that you want to stay with him and he is doing all he can to address his actions and cure his addiction. I f you have been together a long time and love each other then I am sure you can come through this but it will take lots of time so be kind to yourself and be patient , sadly we cant make the pain from these things " just stop"

Good luck

thank you

WHile I have no direct experience of sex addiction, I do believe it exists (a person can develop an addiction to just about anything, when the thing (whether that's sex, gambling or drugs/alcohol) becomes so much more than what it actually is to another person - the addiction is about stress-release that increases the stress, self-loathing, the whole vicious cycle. So it is possible that he can recover with help and therapy.
However, that doesn;t mean you just have to accept whatever he does and forgive him just like that. You are a person too, and your feelings matter just as much as his - it's very common, when one partner in a relationship has an addiction or other MH problem, that the other partner ends up finding the whole relationship and the whole of the non-addict's life becomes all about the addiction and the addict and his/her feelings: this isn't very healthy.

I would say take your time, think things through, maybe talk to a counsellor yourself. It's a good idea that he is leaving for at least a while to give you time to think. You may be able to sort this out and continue as a couple, you may not. But you don't have to simply put up and shut up when you haven't done anything wrong.

What does he/you mean by sex addiction - that he really couldn't help himself? Or was it more that he has some other emotional/psychological problems and the sex is a symptom of that? Could it be that actually he just enjoys sex and got away with whatever he could regardless of the impact and consequences for his family.

Calling it an addiction makes it sound like an illness he's not entirely responsible for.

Thanks. I was kind of hoping you'd be around, sgb, really because I know for some people our history puts us in the 'asking for trouble' bracket, and I still don't see it like that, I still don't judge what we did. But then I didn't become/ am not an addict.
I am going to see a (different) counsellor too.
I knw this is like other addictions in so many ways; it does make sense to me to see it like that; but by our agreed ( I thought)standards it's also infidelity and the pain is so so great.

I think he's seeing it as addiction for a few reasons, and i think that it's just a model, a word to describe behaviours; he did feel it was out of control, had a real relief ' thank god i never have to do that again' after each time, actually has trouble remembering details, it was so compartmentalised for him.
I'm ok with it as a description, (though I do have a 'lets him off the hook' thing too,) really because there are tried and tested structures (the 12 step thing) which he's really clinging to and at the moment seems committed to. He feels like he sexualised other emotions, bored, angry, etc, and got into a habit of making anonymous sex the only answer.
but that does also imply he's an addict for life, always in recovery. Which is so scary

ANything which becomes a compulsive sort of behaviour that the person wants to stop doing and hates him/herself for doing is an addiction (shopping is another one for instance). It is also possible that he is bisexual and ca't shut off that side of himself - some people see affairs with a person of the opposite gender to the 'official' partner as a lesser infidelity or indeed something they are happy to agree to a partner doing, but that;s up to the individual.
TIP: I would suggest looking around for support groups for partners of sex addicts (though it's possible that you may find some judgemental mundanes who make you feel worse) or a properly open-minded counsellor to talk things through with.

Looking around it seems that there aren't many support groups for partners and they seem to be a bit 12 step themselves, as if I have an addiction just because I love him. Which considering I knew nothing about it feels a bit rich and not very useful. Websites I've found seem to be american and very Christian, which again is not likely to be helpful for me I think.
the counsellor I'm planning to see looks to be good though.
If he's bisexual, if that were it, we could actually work round that. When the first lot of stuff came out last year my best friend's response was 'but why didn't he tell you? He must have known you'd be ok with that!'
which is not completely true, it would take some adjusting to, but paying for sex with other women is so so so much worse.

What you seem to be saying though is that this isn't just about a sex addiction. It's about years of secrecy, lies and then more lies even after discovery. I think what this also shows is that you have changed - and perhaps he has too.

You developed a political conscience about porn and could no longer bargain it away and it seems that while you were prepared to experiment with other partners at one time, you don't want to now and never did want to, if deceit and lies were involved.

Your H's addiction however, might be all the more powerful because of the secrecy and lies.

Then you confronted what was the dealbreaker of them all for you personally; that you are married to a man who pays people for sex.

Therefore, I'd be inclined to stop focusing on the sex addiction, to the exclusion of the other behaviours that have actually diminished your marriage for years. There is a sense that pathologising his behaviour runs the risk of ignoring what was probably always there, in terms of his character, personality and views of women.

You might want to PM a poster called Mrs.Jellicle who when last heard of, was staying in her marriage while her H had therapy with a BASRT qualified therapist. I would also suggest you get some counselling on your own to process the many conflicting emotions you've got.

But just like any infidelity, don't isolate the acts from the character and personality of the person hurting you.

yes. this is true. Sigh.
I think I've seized on the addiction description as a way of making sense of what seems so impossible for me, that my lovely, kind dh could lie and lie and lie to me.
I really was one of those people who thought infidelity would NEVER happen to me, never ever.
what do you mean by your last line, wwifn?
And thank you for all the replies. it's such a relief to 'talk' about it

Please don't get caught up thinking this is something to do with your past. Just because you have ahd what many people would see as an unconventional sex life, doesn't mean you should be in some way ok with this.

What happened in the past was consensual and open between you. Not lies and secrecy.

thanks Alistair. That is what I think too, but I am very wobbly and feel like I don't know anything any more.

I think the sex addiction question is his to address himself.

What is yours to address as a couple are his unfaithfulness, dishonesty, and willingness to put you at risk. None of those things is excused by sex addiction, whether he has such an affliction, or not.

What is yours to address alone is whether his willingness to pay vulnerable women for sex to scratch a sexual itch is still a dealbreaker.

shit shit shit
I need to hear this

Yes, this is the main point. I'm not in the least bit judgemental of people who make informed choices about their sex lives and are transparent and open with eachother about those choices. I am however judgemental about deceit, lying and using prostitutes. As I see this, your choices have been denied for years, because of the lies and secrecy you have been exposed to.

Your former sexual choices have got absolutely nothing to do with any of this.

What I meant by the last line in my previous post was that infidelity never happens in a vacuum. The behaviours that lead someone to believe they are entitled to lie and deceive were always there and it is a mistake to treat one incident as an aberration. In your case, this has been going on for years, with multiple partners.

So I suspect there are some behaviours and character flaws in your H that you have been bargaining away for years, in the belief that at least he wouldn't be unfaithful.

Is there something in this about a shocking chasm between you about the reason for having sex in the first place? Historically, as you say, your sex life involved only people you were fond of/loved. Whereas paying for sex seems a negation - the complete opposite - of a loving relationship. Like a perversion of the loving act you have shared with him: and that the illusion of a kind of shared "language" or understanding of what sex actually is, has been torn apart.

I'm so so sorry and I don't have any direct experience of this. Just didn't want to avert my eyes, as it were.

I think your sexual history is relevant actually.

You've told a story of a sexual relationship where acceptance and honesty were a central part of the deal. He has utterly betrayed that.

You've also been clear about your boundaries when it comes to the ethical question of paying for sex. He has done just that knowing your strong feelings on the matter.

You have been fair and consistent all along. You didn't "invite" this treatment.

So am I just deceiving myself if I put this all down to the 'addiction', do you think? I know it sounds completely stupid but 'apart from this' he's so lovely. God I sound mad.

It's true, I did think that. I've read so much of your (great) advice to other people, esp you, wwifn, and I always felt smug, tbh, that whatever else that would never happen to me.

It never occured to me that he could lie, I was never suspicious.

I never knew him at all. My whole life with him has been a lie, it feels like. I don't feel like I have a single untainted memory. I'll never know if anything I remembered as happy was the day he did/ planned something. If it wasn't for my lovely children, who so don't deserve this, I would not want to be here at all.

I have no direct experience but I have a close friend who made the same discovery as you- H has used prostitutes for years unknown to her. She described it as an addiction. Despite counselling and trying to save the marriage, they did split. She felt she could never really trust him again.

They are both now with other partners.

I think in your case youhave to decide how muchhe can ever change, and if you can rebuild things.

Just so I get some clarity on your thinking, didn't you view the sex with men as infidelity?
Or were you referring to feeling smug (I'd reframe that as "trusting" by the way) before those infidelities emerged?

I agree with Spidookly.

Whether or not he has an addiction is a red herring. He has cheated on you more than once. That's what you need to concentrate on.

Have you had an STD check and looked into some counselling for yourself?

melezka there's definitely something in that.

that's my fear, cabbageroses. that whatever he does, even if he stays 'sober' I'll never trust him, and as well, how can I ever have sex with him again, let him touch me? Some of the photos were, btw, taken by him and were close ups of him actually having sex with them. Close up enough that I wasn't sure till he told me. couldn't be more brutal. I think he was somehoew telling me to look and find them I think he wanted to get caught and end this, but I don't think I can ever get over it

and yet sometimes I find myself thinking 'when this is behind us, when we can just love each other and get back to normal'
I'm a mess

Somehow I didn't feel the same about the men. God knows why. I didn't appreciate the scale of it (how frequent etc), and when he told me, rather than me discovering it, it felt like an opportunity to get a new level of honesty about what we both wanted/ felt we needed.
sounds stupid now. Btw he was initially shocked that I saw it as infidelity at all. He said he'd deliberately never had an emotional 'affair' to avoid infidelity. But he obv knew it was because he didn't tell me, for YEARS. He does see it very differently now

Yes he has lied and lied.

I had a full std check straight away, bloody horrible experience that was, thankfully all clear. He had had an HIV test only earlier in the year.

Yes, trusting, not smug. Thank you. And you know, I don't really feel stupid for that, though obv with the benefit of hindsight...; I'd never want to be any other way in a relationship.

My worry for you is that he is going to somehow one day try to blame you too. In so far as, you 'premitted' the opening of a pandoras box with multiple partners and he just got carried away. Of course that's not true, but do you think it's possible he is going to use this?

I am so sorry for you, the shock must be immense.