DH's religion & children - should I just give up?

[WhyIsTheSkyBlue]

DH is a muslim (non-practising - or so I thought), I am an atheist. We have been married for seven years and are still very much in love.

DH has wanted children for a long time but I never felt quite ready in the past. However, I am now at a point where I would very much like to become a mum.

Although DH was initially delighted to hear this, he is now saying that we must get married in an islamic ceremony before having children. He says it would be wrong to have "illegitimate" children and wants any future kids of ours to be brought up as "proper" muslims.

I would be prepared to go through with something like this for his sake (it's not as though it would affect me legally). As a muslim, however, he can only marry another muslim, a christian or a jew - not an atheist. DH was apparently unaware of this until he enquired about the ceremony. He is now begging me to convert and seems to think that unless I start following one of these faiths (preferrably islam, of course) our marriage might not survive at all due to it being "sin".

(I should point out that DH really isn't that religious, i.e. doesn't fast, pray, eats non-halal meat, drinks occasionally, ...)

On the one hand I feel sorry for DH as this appears to be some sort of an identity crisis for him. On the other hand, however, I also feel very hurt and angry for myself and very much taken aback at the notion that as an "infidel" I should somehow be inferior material and not suitable as the mother of his children.

DH also seems to think that my (lack of) religious belief is some kind of a lifestyle choice, and that the only reason I don't believe in any sort of a deity is because I'm simply being stubborn.

I love DH very much (and I'm very confident that he feels the same way about me). However, I also do want to have children at some point in the not so distant future and I want a partner who accepts me with all my opinions and personal (non-)beliefs.

Is there any way this can end well or should I just give up on this relationship?

The wish to regard his wife as his property, maybe?

what so wanting to regard his wife as his property makes him a muslim

it would make him a twat - whether he believes in fairies a the bottom of the garden, Allah, God, Aliens or nothing.

Riven: I'm fully aware of that (and you are quite right about 'honour killings' by any other name in Western culture). But in the OP's specific case, her H is using his newly found 'Muslim faith' to justify his attempt to control her.

The husband's friend with "a massive crush on him " has probably had some influence here and is no doubt jealous of their present close relationship, which would hardly continue if DH returned to his "roots".
Yet another anti-female influence to consider.
I do feel sorry for you (apart from having a future as an independant graduate with a family and probable new husband)
All the best, whatever you decide.

Oh Bugger, I missed this "He's also recently started to criticize my (not our!) housekeeping, saying that I'd need to shape up if I wanted to be a mother.

I've been wondering whether he may have made some new "friends" that are influencing him in this direction. Have tried snooping a little but so far to no avail (only result of interest being that one of his colleagues seems to have a massive crush on him )"

This is how it starts!!

Set him DAMNED straight! NOW!

He doesn't like it? tough, cos I can guarantee YOU won't like the life HE has in mind for you.

OP - I don't think he sees you as married, not really.

Why registry office and not a full civil ceremony? Was it just the two of you or did your families attend?

All the SAHM, housework, 'you need to do X if you want to be a mother', suggests that until now he has viewed you as a girlfriend, but now it is time for you to become his wife and have his children.
You say you are studying atm, what is his view on that?

If I were you, I would be running for the nearest solicitor.

Riven - do you think your marriage would work if it was the other way round - your DH Muslim and you not? I mean in terms of the compromises that you have to make? Do you think that as a man you would be less willing to compromise on things than you are?

Sorry I've worded that really badly, brain isn't working well today!

He's either cheating on you or trying to get rid of you.

Whichever it is it doesn't matter as you sound like a lovely person

Consider leaving.

Why - it isn't looking good is it.

He can be in loce with you but doesn't want his future daughters to be like you.

Start thinking about your future. It sounds better than he's offering.

OP,
please have a look at this

It is categorically not allowed to abuse your wife or children in islam. The prophet (pbuh) never raised his voice to his wives or berated them, or emotionally abused them, or isolated them from their families. If your husband wants to be a good practicing muslim, he is supposed to model himself on the prophet(pbuh).
In fact there were many accounts of the wives arguing with Muhammad(pbuh) and some of them hitting him on his shoulders,and he(pbuh) never ignored them. He never ordered them about. He(pbuh) never interfered in how they ran their households. Yes, the women ran their households, and made decisions.
They were not his domestic slaves either, he(pbuh) often ironed his own clothes, and cooked his own food or cooked for his friends. The wives had their own horses, indicating that they travelled where they wished and when they wanted.
Please don't let your husband treat you like this, and do not allow his family fool you as to what is islam.
Take care
x

Erm... sorry, what's "pbuh"?

"Peace be upon him"

Doesn't the Koran say in 4:34 that a man can beat his wife? Admittedly some translations add the word "lightly" but I don't think that is in the original text. Indeed, there seems to be a lot of revisionism debate over "context" and "what that passage really means".

And wasn't there more than one Hadith that say that Mohammed hit his very young wife Aisha hard enough to cause pain and leave a mark? (And, yes, I know that citing Hadith is inconclusive as it depends on whether you believe that one or not. But then it's not unusual for people to pick and choose which bits of their religious texts they wish to follow).

If my dp didn't want my kids to turn out like me 1) I would be hugely insulted. 2) I would run for the hills.
Major alar,m bells would be ringing. Religion ins't an excuse.

My first husband was (still is, probably) a Muslim. Islam encompasses every part of your life, and if you convert, you can't pick and choose which parts of the religion you'll follow because you'll have to justify yourself forever more to others and yourself, particularly if you choose not to wear the hijab. It doesn't matter whether or not he is devout; it's a cultural thing, too. I strongly advise you to get in touch with women who have converted to Islam so they can tell you how it has changed their lives - are you prepared to go swimming in a women-only pool, for example, or buy a more 'modest' wardrobe of clothes? Please, please think very carefully about this. I really wish you the best, but reading your dilemma, Skyblue, is like seeing my own situation 17 years ago.

For many people with a strong religious belief it goes way beyond the right path to live for 70 years, it is also the gateway to eternal life - and getting it wrong can mean a path to hell.

In times of crisis people can rediscover their faith and take it seriously again, becoming parents can cause the same refocus. Now it's not just your own eternity you are risking it is also your children's. Some people see bringing their children up 'right' as making amends for their own 'youthful sins'.

OP: you need to make a list of what you would and wouldn't accept about the way any children would be brought up because it sounds almost certain that he would want things a particualr way. DON'T imagine that he will change his mind: he won't. Given that you (rightly) don't want to convert, you'll likely not want any children you have to follow the religion and why should you? Both DH and I are atheists and agreed on no church wedding or christening for dc. I knew pretty well what his position on this was and he knew mine, but we made it really clear in the beginning becuase it's so important to both of us. It would have been a deal breaker for me. Luckily we still agree, but I've found that the older we get the more militant we get. You DH probably will too so be wary.

A very fundamentalist Christian boyfriend of mine, bless him, made it clear that he would only ever marry me, if I converted to his faith. I ran a mile. He did not accept me the way I was, and wanted me to be somebody else. Bu then I have not lived with him or married him, so I could easily leave him.

I second MrsColumbo. Before you agree to conversion, could you get in touch with women who went through with it?

OP, you can inbox me if you like, I am a convert and became muslime over 20 years ago.
You can ask me any questions you like, I will answer all of them.
However, I don't think this is about you becoming muslim. The ironic thing is that if you became muslim, not for your husband, but for yourself, you would then realise the kind of man he is and most probably want nothing to do with him.
Islam does not require from a woman that she should be some sort of angel, never making mistakes, that she is pure, and should be extra 'good' to have children. He has an idealistic and extremely unrealistic view of muslim women.

"He has an idealistic and extremely unrealistic view of muslim women."

I agree with you entirely squashi, but this view is held by many, many men raised in this culture, and actually it's not just muslims either.

christian women in egypt are held to the same standards, and suffer the same expectations.

It's about the upbringing, it's about the man. The religion is only a weapon to beat them with.