Is this a normal sex life???

[whatisnormality]

My husband and I have just had an argument about our sex life.... again

It has got to the point where we are on the verge of splitting up. He does not see that there is a problem and I feel like I'm going mad so wanted other people's thoughts.

Our sex life:

• Always initiated by me
• 90% of the time it is me pleasuring him with no reciprical action and he 'thanks' me afterwards
• Crunch time came at the weekend when I'd spent 50 minutes on foreplay (on him) and he suggested we go upstairs. Rather than have sex me, he got on all 4's so he could have some bum action?!
• Last night we were cuddling and although I knew he was up for it, as he knew I was upset by the weekend incident I refused to acknowledge it so he asked if (whilst we were cuddling) it was ok if he played with himself as he had a stiffie (I was gagging for it, as always but wanted him to initiate it just for once)

It's been like this for the past 10-11 yrs and we always talk about it and it's always my fault and I just end up mystified. Apparently I don't know what normal is and I patronise him.

He says that everything has to be perfect for me to want to have sex and if I go to bed wearing knickers or pyjamas it means I don't want it (even if I subsequently spend 50 minutes playing with him, I'm clearly not interested)

Is this really remotely normal???

Larrygrylls,

I can see that you are under the impression that an anonymous army of women with an agenda (what agenda?) on MN is trying to split the OP?s marriage up. Now, why would that happen? Perhaps if you read the whole thread, you would understand, but since you are reluctant, I thought I could summarise the issues for you.

Abuse happens. Whether or not the word itself is used too often on MN is another matter, but it does exist in real life. Normal relationships have their low points, but there are also plenty of abusive relationships where abuse is the day-to-day reality, there is no other way to describe it and there are no caveats and no qualifications. 1 in 4 women and 1 in 6 men in the UK will suffer domestic abuse at some point in their life and 2 women a week are killed by their partners (source: Women Aid).To put the word itself in inverted commas and be dismissive towards the phenomenon as such is insulting to everybody who suffers or used to suffer from domestic abuse.

You point out it is impossible to be objective about one?s own relationship, since one?s outlook is always determined by one?s position. Indeed, I quite agree. Whatisnormality?s posts are a one sided account of emotional abuse from the perspective of the victim. What leads me to that conclusion? Her accounts of being forced to have sex in distressing circumstances against her will and while crying, of being physically attacked by her husband, of being constantly criticised and made to feel inadequate, of having her pets tormented and of having her needs deliberately ignored in what is meant to be a partnership. You may beg to differ, but I see no room here for caveats or qualifications.

Moreover, you should not be worried that she is now considering splitting up with her husband despite the fact that she previously thought she was in a loving relationship. That is called cognitive dissonance, a coping mechanism most victims of emotional abuse develop in order to survive in unbearable circumstances, as congruence is not an option.

I also hope the OP gets RL support ? she will be amazed how many people will understand and want to help her.

With your logic Larry, there would be no point in any mumsnet dicussion forums. If the op should speak to her own friends and follow her own opinion, what does that say about her need to vent here?

Larry. It's not about you and it's not important if you keep posting on here or not. This thread is in relationships, not AIBU, and the poster needs support. She is already being told by her (clearly abusive a.d manipulative) husband that she is unreasonable, hysterical and at fault. She has been taught her whole life to look after the needs of others first. This is a real person who is reaching out to strangers online precisely because, as she has stated, she feels she cannot talk to anyone IRL about her situation.

She is a real person and she is going through an awful time right now. She is not just words on a screen.

I don't think this particular interjection from Larry was the crime of the century or anything. But I would say to any poster, if you have wandered into a sensitive thread, please don't feel the need the go against the consensus merely for the sake of providing "balance". Sometimes people don't need that, they have the opposing argument coming at them all the time from inside their head/from a partner/family member. MN support is the balance.

I'm also wondering how Larry has managed to absorb the sense of consensus of MNers on here, while simultaneously not reading down the thread and thereby picking up the later even more disturbing posts. Either he's read it or he hasn't.

Am also intrigued about what any of us have got to gain from the OP being safe and happy, other than relief on her behalf. But this is probably not the place to discuss it.

I think we risk being sidetracked now.

'yes, let Larry have his opinion, we don't need to enter into a discussion about it and let's just on with supporting the op

How was your day, OP?

He sounds like a selfish arse. Get yourself a red hot lover fast lady!

Whatis, this stage is the hardest i think, as you are leaving your coping mechanism (he loves me deep down etc).

Remember that sometimes you need to get through a rough stage before you get better.

You know whenever i have to face a scary situation it really helps me if i am physically in good form and fit. Exercise does a lot for your self esteem, even your posture changes. I know this sounds very simplistic in this thread but can you make a plan with good nutrition (and zinc) and gym or swimming?
I'm not saying that this will solve your problems but might support you with the baby steps that have been suggested.
Just a thought...

Stay strong x

Laquitar speaks sense.

That's a point whatis - quite often, when you come out of the fog of realising that your relationships have been abusive, you start to feel much much worse for a while as you go through a phase of grieving for the little girl you were and the woman you might have been. Sometimes, you feel much owrse than you did when you were actually living in those abusive relationships.

And then as Laquitar says, you get through it and you come out the other side.

But be prepared for the grief.

You WILL get through it OP.

How are you doing today Whatis?

I've been thinking about you and hope you are ok.

I have sat and read the whole thread, and I really feel for you whatisnormality

I have no better advice than anyone else has given you.

Just look after yourself and take pleasure in the fact that you now know this relationship and your husband's behaviour is not normal and take small steps in improving the situation for yourself, nobody else.

This is the saddest thread I have ever read :(

Thinking of you and I will keep up to date :)

Hi WIN, so glad you're beginning to get this clarity about your situation. Keep watching your life with your ex as if you're an outside observer, as if you're seeing it on tv. Keeping a diary was a great way for me of seeing how relentless the misery was - otherwise, it seemed like isolated incidents that I kept 'forgetting'. I'm glad you were even able to laugh when you watched how predictable his behaviour was, because that's a great way to reduce your fear of him.

When people think of sexual abuse, they think of being forced to have sex. Being rejected and told you don't want sex when you do and made feel 'unworthy' can feel just as bad. My ex both coerced me (only once, really) and rejected me for being unsexy (often) and the latter actually made me feel worse.

He's not going to leave you, because it's going to take him ages to break down another person until she licks his arse and massages his feet and tells him she likes it, all in exchange for nothing more than handholding in public and an occasional bag of crisps. It's going to take him years, probably. (And hey, I've nothing against arse-licking and foot massages when both parties care about the other's pleasure). He struck lucky with you, because your father had done so much of the groundwork.

So, what are you going to do about it? The Women's Aid route is worth considering, because they can help "deprogramme" you. But you're also lucky to have a friend offering you a room. Get out of there, get some counselling (or do it the other way round - both ways work!). You have a huge number of people wishing you well here. You do not have to wake up every morning with a day like this ahead of you.

I have been on MN a long time and have never seen anyone cry abuse where there wasn't abuse.
larry why don't you try reading the thread and seeing what the OP says herself even without the input from other posters.

whatisrnormality, nothing about your sex life is normal, nothing about your relationship is normal. The most unfair thing you could do to any child would be to allow them to have him as a father.

Hi, whatisnormality, just checking in. Thinking of you and hope you're okay.

No certainly not normal and fair play to you for putting up with that for all these years. If I were you I would seriously consider having an affair so that your needs are met as you are being denied a loving mutually reciprocated sex life.

Let's not feed Larry the troll!

Larry, please read up on abuse - enough links on this thread! - and get real before replying!

Please do not hijack the thread from OP!

Or are you the same type of man? and trying to cover your own tracks maybe?

nicky80, have you read the thread??? It is about so much more than her original question now so that advice won't help her at all.

How are you today whatis? Hope all is well.

Hope you're okay whatis

OMG...get down to ann summers...hun...

Whatis just checking back in to see how you are. Please ignore the unhelpful comments of people who haven't bothered to read beyond the first few lines of your OP.

Is anyone getting worried that the OP hasn't been on here for a couple of days now?
Whatis - I hope you're ok. Please let us know how things are going.

asouthwoldmummy I'm with you.
I hope she has been chatting to rl friends and things haven't gone tits up.

whatisnormality I hope you are ok, and things are becoming clearer in your head.

After reading the whole thread I've decided that so many posters have given thoughtful, accurate and inspiring advice and I have nothing more helpful to add.

I hope you have the courage to listen the advice given and slowly process it and come to the same conclusions as everyone else. He is abusing you and you are worth ten of him.

It will be hard. It will be draining emotionally and financially to leave, even to contemplate leaving at the moment will be difficult. But if you stay in this relationship you will regret it. In ten years time you will be your mil, the weak little doormouse.

Keep posting, people care.