Archers thread #204: Is Vince mince? Discuss The Archers here.

[Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g]

Thank you, @PseudoBadger, for kicking off this long, long series of Archers threads.

All views on The Archers welcome here! New blood welcomed, and of course we are always delighted to welcome back former or occasional listeners/posters. We don't all agree on all points, although we do mostly try to be civil about it. Most of us are posting tongue in cheek a lot of the time, so don't worry about revealing that you'd have liked to hear more of Pip's and Stella's wedding vows, or other unusual views.

Spoilers: not on this thread, please! We don't wait for the omnibus to discuss the weeknight episodes, but we do try our best to avoid cross-contamination from https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/radio_addicts/4636789-the-archers-spoilers-thread-12-cant-wait-for-702pm-join-us-here, where spoilers are positively welcomed!

For newer listeners, lurkers or those who just have no idea what we're talking about, @DadDadDad has created this useful thread: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/radio_addicts/3557323-For-Archers-fans-a-guide-to-acronyms-on-the-long-running-discussion-threads-and-any-other-meta-thread-questions-you-may-have - BOOP point for him! (See thread for explanation.)

Several people on the previous thread, and probably the spoilers thread, have rhymed Vince with mince, so credit to all of you! As I start this thread, we don't know what's going to happen to Vince, and it's looking as if Sunday night is going to last all week, or a good chunk of it. Ah well. We have to put up with this kind of thing every few years. I cling to my belief that the SWs aren't going to kill off another of Elizabeth's partners in a horrific accident - but of course they could be toying with us!

Josh has returned from Patagonia sounding strangely changed by his time abroad. (Angus Imrie is presumably too busy, or perhaps fed up with the limited storylines given to Josh up to now, so the part has been re-cast.)

Will the Brookfield inheritance row start up again now? I do hope so. Josh has been very badly short-changed by his parents' decision to leave the farm to Pip (and Stella). Surely they could have taken the same approach as Pat and Tony and involved both children (with separate provision for Ben, who's not interested in a farming career)?

Over to you!

Though, in truth I don’t understand your question / request. Surely speculation is 90% of the thread? And given how widely we range beyond the perimeters of Ambridge I don’t understand what I’ve said that so offends your sense of TA thread appropriateness.

The SW raised the speculation through their script. Why would one not comment on it here?

I wouldn't. Far too contentious at the moment and too politically charged.
It would also ruin these threads as people would start discussing the rights and wrongs of the issue.

(Though i agree we do do a lot of pointless speculation, but this topic is too 'hot' here I think.)

I rather like Storm. It's not perhaps as unusual as Amber thinks though. There was a Storm - and a Tyger - (both male) in my son's class at school and he's now in his 30s.

I wouldn't worry about Vince's feelings. After his appalling behaviour when Chelsea was pregnant, I'm surprised anyone has ever worried about his feelings again. Plus, if the poor man has lost the ability to walk, he's hardly going to forget about the storm whatever George and Amber's baby is called.

I was listening to TA when Shula and Kenton were born but I was only 4 at the time and wasn't paying as much attention as I might have been. Do we know why Jill chose such odd names? Hardly typical names in the 1950s.

I do know someone who was born in 1958 who has Kenton as his middle name, but his mother always swore it was nothing to do with TA and she chose it because it means "Man of Kent" (where they lived). That can't have been Jill's reason for choosing it though, can it?

Bit long, but scroll:

https://alan001946.wordpress.com/tag/names/

Storm isn't that unusual a name for boys or girls. A gender neutral name needn't have anything to do with trans issues but could have other benefits like people not making assumptions. It just seems like introducing a controversial issue for the sake of it when theres no actual indication this is likely. I'm not discussing it any more because I really don't care what little Storm may or may not do in 10 or 15 years time.

I was listening to TA when Shula and Kenton were born but I was only 4 at the time and wasn't paying as much attention as I might have been. Do we know why Jill chose such odd names? Hardly typical names in the 1950s.

I didn't start listening until the 80s but I think I read that Phil and Jill picked out random Scrabble letters to make names, although that sounds a bit mad so maybe it was a fever dream I had 🤔

But @CaptainMyCaptain the scriptwriter introduced the topic. Not me.

The scriptwriters did not introduce the topic of a baby being trans.

I completely agree with this.

Many thanks to @TottersBlankly and @LaMarschallin for the Scrabble explanation. It does indeed sound very far-fetched. If the hands I often seem to get at Scrabble are anything to go by I would have expected their names to be mostly vowels with the odd 'w' or 'x' mixed in.

Neither did I. Amber used the words ‘gender neutral’ and that’s what I was responding to. The implication was that Storm Grundy might one day prefer to be / identify as ‘they’, rather than ‘he’. I didn’t mention ‘trans’ anything, at all.

The SW made it clear that Amber was open to (if not encouraging) raising a gender neutral child. So it’s possible the story might unfold in that way.

It’s equally possible that Storm might find his name much too … Instagram, and might choose something else. 🤷‍♀️

I think Storm is a nice name, but paired with Grundy it does sound like an actual storm coming in from the Atlantic, causing mayhem. My dog's half brother is called Storm, a good name for a cocker spaniel, but……..
My first name can equally apply both sexes, and I've always hated it, it has at times caused confusion. I really wish my name was feminine.

I have a gender neutral name in real life. It seems that most people default to the masculine if they don’t know.

Storm is a terrible name. I was guffawing along with Eddie - it’s not often we’re on the same page.

Imagine being saddled with a name like Storm if you have a disposition like Brad!

It is an excellent name for a black/grey (working-breed style) dog.

if you're an incel or a ferengi. otherwise women is fine. It is a noun.
Female is an adjective. (often used, ungramatically as a noun)

yes, done well it could be awesome. Done with one kind of activism in mind (on either side) it would be a dog's dinner.

Jill "chose" Kenton and Shula's names by throwing those little baby blocks with letters on. My mother told me this when I was pondering baby names. She said they got some howlers before they settled on Kenton and Shula. I remember we had a go ourselves but never landed on anything remotely feasible, no matter how "unique."

Agree. That's why I assumed Storm to be a girl's name.

Agree. I think that imposing that name on the child of the previously volatile/sometimes bad boy and now miraculously reformed George is asking for trouble.
I used to volunteer as a dog walker and the amazing people at the sanctuary were always looking for better names for dogs ubiquitously called after famous boxers and aggressive or evil characters.

Storm is a name for a horse, I think.

I wouldn't.

I didn't hear it that way. Some people prefer to avoid names that make it crystal clear from the off that a child is male or female. Pointless really, as the stereotypes and gendered expectations kick in as soon as people meet in person or hear each other's voices (once adult). It may be that Amber is thinking about the experience of growing up with a fairly girly name and wants to avoid that. I doubt it's anything very deep. A lot of these nature names have been very little used as baby names until recently so have no male/female connotations.

For what it's worth I think the baby will end up being called Joe.

@Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g For what it's worth I think the baby will end up being called Joe.[

Or Bartleby.

That would be good! Bart for everyday.