Archers thread #165: Bridge over troubled waters! Discuss The Archers here.

[Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g]

Thank you, @PseudoBadger, for kicking off this long, long series of Archers threads.

All views on The Archers welcome here! New blood welcomed, and of course we are always delighted to welcome back former or occasional listeners/posters. We don't all agree on all points, although we do mostly try to be civil about it. Most of us are posting tongue in cheek a lot of the time, so don't worry about revealing that you believe Rochelle exists, or other unusual views.

Spoilers: not on this thread, please! We don't wait for the omnibus to discuss the weeknight episodes, but we do try our best to avoid cross-contamination from https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/radio_addicts/5071889-the-archers-spoilers-thread-9-cant-wait-for-702pm-join-us-here, where spoilers are positively welcomed!

For newer listeners, lurkers or those who just have no idea what we're talking about, @DadDadDad has created this useful thread: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/radio_addicts/3557323-For-Archers-fans-a-guide-to-acronyms-on-the-long-running-discussion-threads-and-any-other-meta-thread-questions-you-may-have - BOOP point for him! (See thread for explanation.)

This thread may well fill up as fast as the last one, so let's just get stuck in!

@Alwaysdieting

"Talking of Neil, how did he end up with someone like Susan? Was she pregnant so in those days they HAD! To get married? Or was it true love?."

According to the TA website "When Susan told Neil she was pregnant, Neil immediately proposed and a month later they were married on 24 February 1984."

It's funny, I didn't remember them having to get married, but did think they seemed genuinely in love. They met when Susan won a pig named Pinky who escaped and Neil helped rescue it and gave Susan advice on how to care for Pinky.

I remember, the public named them Butch and Sundance 😃

I’ve always thought Neil is devoted to Susan. In fact contrast with how Harrison is ‘devoted’ to Fallon and it’s clearly very different.

Neil is a very different sort of man. Kind. Prepared to take responsibility. Genuinely strong, down to his core, has principles and lives by them, doesn't need to bluster and bully to prove anything. And has a sense of humour.

Teenage Neil's relationship with his two older male role models, Jethro and Phil, was a pleasure back in the day. I'm not sure there is anything like it now.

I think, when I address my mind to it, Neil is my consistently favourite character. He's a wise old owl.

Agree with the comments re Neil. Steadfast, kind, reasonable and principled.

He was an absolute hero when poor Susan was convicted and imprisoned and her evil ‘friend’ slithered into the picture.

And I loved his acknowledgment that Susan’s pushiness ambition and determination was what drove him on.

(But then he was brutal about her being a vicious trouble making gossip!)

I like Neil, but his love for Susan brings him down in my estimation. Judge someone by the company they keep!

I don't think the SWs will have enough experience of religion as it is actually lived to do this SL, but it would be interesting to set up a contrast between a character whose faith is genuinely integrated into their daily life (Neil) and one who professes a faith but it amounts to nothing more than Sunday church attendance (Harrison in this case, but could easily have been Peggy).

I don’t think it’s the Sunday church attendance but people who refer back to being religious as some sort of trump card when their behaviour doesn’t seem particularly informed by it

i think Neil nd Susan are good characters precisely because she is flawed and he is able to tell her that but also accept her with her flaws

He doesn't even know that "they" were pregnant. I really want someone to point out to him that it's possible and even likely that the pregnancy had become non-viable before that point.

Last night Freddie was labouring about George being a hero and how awful prison is (really Freddie, would never have guessed) George did actually ask him what prison was like. What was he supposed to say?

Is Rochelle a bit like Maggie in the Simpsons? Always there/ stories about but never speaks, even in an episode where Maggie was all grown up
and stopped from saying anything

No, I think Maggie is more like the Buttons - silent but definitely there. There have been lots of silent like this over the years. Whereas we don't know whether Rochelle actually exists.

“We were pregnant” had me howling at the radio, much to the bemusement of passers-by. Get a bloody grip, Harrison, or had you forgotten that your poor wife didn't want children? I sense an unfortunate dose of reality coming.

Talking of getting a grip, Kirsty dancing around and counting down to sticking a needle in a pig was ridiculous. I haven’t missed an episode for nearly 15 years but must have skipped the bit where previously-capable Kirsty had a lobotomy. Needle in, syringe on, press plunger. The faster you do it, the less likely you are to get kicked/bitten/flattened. Stop fannying around!

Ah, those were the days. Nowadays they’d have been named PiggyMcPigFace…

I don’t think it’s the Sunday church attendance but people who refer back to being religious as some sort of trump card when their behaviour doesn’t seem particularly informed by it

I recently had the misfortune to be in the company of a violent bully - who declared that they pray for me every day.

I really, really wish they wouldn’t …

I'm embarrassed for Kirsty. Why would Rex entrust his livelihood to her? Of all the people in the village to ask.

Also why is nobody suspicious that Rochelle doesn't have a phone number? Or rather Joy doesn't have her number? Who is writing a letter to an adult in 2024 and not thinking it's odd??

Who is writing a letter to an adult in 2024 and not thinking it's odd??

I wrote a couple last week...

Yeah me too @EBearhug - sorry @BovineUniversity !

Tbf I only have addresses in my address book because the numbers are stored on my phone

@BovineUniversity - of the two people he’s presumably closest to in the village:

Pip - his sister-out-of-law and mother of his niece,

and

Kirsty - his Ambridge Preservation Trust colleague,

I imagine he would have preferred the first for this particular task but had to settle for the second?

I agree Kirsty is suddenly being written as a rural ignoramus rather than someone who had a lucky escape from becoming Mrs Pork Based Ready Meals …

I think Neil and Susan have a good marriage. They're both devoted parents. They are both hard workers. They both like "chili"

Susan nags, but without Susan's nagging, would Neil be living in such a nice house? She may nag, but Susan always supports Neil.

Susan and Neil have worked as a team through the years.

(That should have been ex-sister-out-of-law, of course. But Rosie’s existence means Pip and Rex will have a family connection for a lifetime.)

“We were pregnant’. !.*

no Harrison sperm (presumably yours) fertilised an egg in your partner so she was momentarily pregnant (but not necessarily at the time of the accident and even if she was, loss not necessarily caused by the accident - with the coil possibly the more likely candidate)

In fairness to Harrison he did acknowledge they did not want children. I get the impression from that chat that he absolutely knows what is going on and how unreasonable he is being, but does not want to face it, holding on to the comfort of blaming others for the destruction of his dream.

I am a bit confused because given these characters are totally made up anyway, are we for our chosen favourites just going with the bits we like and excusing the bits we see as out of character no matter how heinous. And if others do the same for characters we don’t like can we deny such an excuse for them?