Archers thread #142: Kill Jill? Is Ambridge heading for a Tarantino-style bloodbath on Stir Up Sunday? Discuss The Archers here!

[Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g]

Thank you, @PseudoBadger, for kicking off this long, long series of Archers threads.

All views on The Archers welcome here! New blood welcomed. We don't all agree on all points, although we do mostly try to be civil about it. Most of us are posting tongue in cheek a lot of the time, so don't worry about revealing that , or other unusual views.

Spoilers: not on this thread, please! We don't wait for the omnibus to discuss the weeknight episodes, but we do try our best to avoid cross-contamination from www.mumsnet.com/talk/radio_addicts/4636789-the-archers-spoilers-thread-7-cant-wait-for-702pm-join-us-here, where spoilers are positively welcomed!

For newer listeners, lurkers or those who just have no idea what we're talking about, @DadDadDad has created this useful thread: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/radio_addicts/3557323-For-Archers-fans-a-guide-to-acronyms-on-the-long-running-discussion-threads-and-any-other-meta-thread-questions-you-may-have - BOOP point for him! (See thread for explanation.)

Well, things have taken a turn for the better in the last few days! The SWs have re-discovered their form and the actors and directors have risen to the challenge. I won't say much more than that for fear of jinxing things. Over to you!

(Thanks to @JanglyBeads for the thread title idea!)

Does George fancy Fallon??

Yeah, it definitely sounded that way. He really is an irredeemably awful character without a single decent bone in his body, isn't he?! She's 20 years older than him and married. He sounds like he's on the way to full-on incel extremism.

Yes, that sounds about right. Yuk.

I only hope that Clarrie doesn't live to realise what he is. But I don't want her gone in the next year so I somehow doubt that wish will be fulfilled.

He's managed to inflict his pain on Beth as well though and everyone else around him.

Its not even remotely a normal set of reactions so either Ben is going to be the centre of an underlying MH issue story in which Chelsea and Beth are collateral damage or he is a true allaboutme Archer.

I don't know . She always hated the Grace Archer memorial in the church but now she is the arbiter of Archerness she might only be annoyed that their isn't one for Rosie.

Jill and Peggy catfight report?😆

I was thinking about Kentons reaction to having Jill stay at the Bull. He is quite selfish and even though I have called Jill an aged flying mammal she is his mum too and it wouldnt hurt him to have her for a little while. I lived with my MIL for 15 years and she very rarely was asked to stay with other close relatives so I was a bit annoyed with Kenton.

I think you're being too harsh on Ben. Isn't he only 20? Chelsea had a choice whether or not to become a parent, Ben didn't. Sensitive young man that he is (and I see that as a virtue), he no doubt went through several scenarios in his head, possibly imagining co-parenting a child that he loved but might only be allowed a small role in their life. The impact it would have on Beth, his parents, his gran.

He'd already been put through the wringer by Beth and finally thought they were settled. He had so much to look forward to and then it was thrown into disarray.

I hope Ruiari, Josh and Paul form a supportive network as lads often do and help him through his MH crisis. I don't have a son but I know some lovely young men and don't think crying is a sign of weakness in either sex even though my DD and I rarely cry.

Listening again, I have no idea why Ruth told Jill that termination was a decision Ben and Chelsea made together ("their decision, their bodies, their lives!"). If she'd pointed out that Ben had completely left it to Chelsea to decide (and how that was right) Jill might have begun to understand how he was feeling.

she is his mum too and it wouldnt hurt him to have her for a little while.

There's no way I would have ever survived having my mother stsy for more than about a night. Just being someone's Mum isn't always enough.

Pinched from FB page - did Jolene just happen to have all 20+ ingredients for Jill's Christmas cake in her store cupboard (unlikely!!), did Jill pack them when she left (also hard to envisage), or had Kenton had to take her for an emergency shop??

Ben's decision was to support Chelsea - in that sense it was a joint decision. I think Ruth was right to make it clear that both had made their decisions about their lives.

If Ruth had let Jill get a sniff of "poor Ben's mini Archer was murdered by the common Chelsea" we would never have heard the end of it.

I never had the impression Ben wanted to keep the baby, the upset for him was more around the situation with Beth (which was largely of his own creation).

Yes, I think your first two points are fair @C8H10N4O2 (chemical formula for what?!) but don't agree with the last one.

Caffeine - intravenous for preference 😁

I had the impression Ben was uncertain, I never felt he actively wanted the baby. Its possible that knowing Jill's likely reaction might influence him but he always seemed genuinely uncertain to me.

Jolene always sounds like she's doing an impression of a pirate.

I got the impression that once he'd begun to get his head around the idea of a baby existing, he wasn't agin it. It had kind of worked for Toby and his big sister.

But yes, not actively wanting.

I would say the most likely was that Jill brought them with her from the Brookfield kitchen. She took the time to pack a proper case so she didn't just up and leave in 5 minutes. And she knew stir-up Sunday was coming so she would already have the ingredients ready (unlike me, who will have to go shopping this week and make a late pudding, despite working in the church and knowing full well where we are in the liturgical calendar).

@JanglyBeads , either because she said it in the heat of the moment, or that if she'd said, it was Chelsea's decision (which it was), it would have made it sound like Ben had no interest, and that Chelsea was the 'bad guy'.

I wondered this! Christmas pudding, I think. No problem procuring stout and rum for it at The Bull. I use Delia Smith's recipe and the other ingredients are breadcrumbs, SR flour, suet, muscovado sugar, Bramley apple, eggs, raisins, sultanas, currants, candied peel, ground almonds, zest and juice of lemons and oranges, mixed spice, nutmeg, cinnamon. Probably all purchasable at the village shop or even from an online supermarket (although nobody in Ambridge appears to have heard of this useful service). The pudding bowl might be the biggest stumbling block.

@JanglyBeads , maybe she popped into the corner shop, or maybe the pantry in The Bull is well stocked with christmas cake ingredients, or she had them delivered.

The Bull does food, so it should be fairly well-stocked with mixing bowls etc.

I have no issue with men and boys crying. I think they should do it more. I read something thought-provoking a while ago, along the lines of the only socially acceptable emotion for men and boys to show in public is anger (in some circles). I cry a lot, ridiculously easily, so can't think any less of anybody for doing it. Having said all of that, I do find Ben a bit me me me. Hardly surprising, given his parents, brother and sister. I feel sorry for the lad, but (selfishly) don't want to hear too much of his travails first-hand. I do want to hear the odd remark that reassures me that others are looking out for him and he's gradually getting back to what passes for normal in that family. That will be quite enough.

Good to hear Kenton stressing about the fuel bill. About time somebody did. I'd like to hear a lot more about the way the current economic problems are affecting farmers. Now we seem to have settled down a bit politically, perhaps the production team could risk putting in a bit more farming content.

Yes, in Freda's day there were probably steamed puddings on the menu. It's years and years since I had steak and kidney pudding. Nobody else would eat it here, sadly.

I would say the most likely was that Jill brought them with her from the Brookfield kitchen. She took the time to pack a proper case so she didn't just up and leave in 5 minutes

Now I’ve got a mental image of Jill stomping doggedly down the farm track away from Brokefailed with all the pudding ingredients, including china basin, tied up in the steaming cloth in a stick over her shoulder à la Dick Whittington (cat optional).