The Archers #93: The Flower and Produce show - who's going to get their just desserts. Freddie? Ellis? Russ? Pass judgement here.

[DadDadDad]

No, that's not a jokey exaggeration, this is really the 93rd thread in a series started by PseudoBadger five years ago! In fact, post number 90,000 in the "official" count will be made on this thread.

Lovers of The Archers welcome (along with the rest of us who have a more complicated relationship with the "TA" ).

One rule we try to stick to: No mentioning of future episode plotlines published in the Radio Times etc. However, once an episode has aired, say what you like!

What is going to happen to Freddie? And are we ever going to hear from Lily again?
I also am wondering what it will take for Kenton to apologise to Fallon...

So parenting is just cause and effect?
Would that it were so simple.

Elizabeth has evidently failed.

Campion I have never thought that a child getting amazing A levels (or failing, or even flunking ) is totally down to the parenting.

Youngsters often do the opposite of what they think is expected of them especially if there is a great deal of pressure. They're not robots.

I like Elizabeth generally, but I'll tell you what she has failed at and that's making one fun day out activity last a whole day. Blimey, she and Freddie got a whole two weeks' holiday worth of days out yesterday and they didn't even set out until the afternoon!

I'll cut her some slack on the grounds that this might be the last day out they have for a while, but I was glad DD wasn't listening yesterday or she might have started getting ideas above her station!

Nor me ppeat
Many years of secondary school teaching (and being a parent!) has taught me that some do well,some don't and not always totally predictably.Native intelligence,ability, tenacity, perseverance etc may all play a part.
Parental support ditto. Teaching obviously.

But they're all individuals and any and all of the above is no guarantee of anything. Lily has managed the stellar A level results yet is, potentially, going to mess up her university career big time. I'm not sure where Elizabeth is supposed to have gone wrong.

Well Elizabeth has both high-flying, sensible (well until Russ) Lily and low-flying, criminal Freddie. So her parenting can't be that much to blame unless she has a clone. I'd say they have dealt differently with losing their dad and Lilly naturally has more intellect which has helped her choose the overachiever path.

Elizabeth's a bit of a mess but I'd rather have her as a parent than any of her siblings!

Yes campion DH and I both had very chequered educational journeys. So we decided to be there for our children but not to try and push them in any particular direction. DD1 got a good degree at a good uni. is doing very well at work dd2 was not so academic she took a couple of fashion courses at colleges , which didn't suit her . She is working for herself on line successfully.

Ds who is G&T was often in trouble at school, I HE him (well he's an autodidact), an inspector said he'd take his qualifications when he wanted to , which he didn't! He is now a popular musician, on line and live, teacher of guitar, yoga etc. in the circles he moves in, works hard. It's a harder life but he has chosen it.

I’m not saying it’s all the parents’ fault! And of course the unexpected happens.

As you were ...

I think upbringing has a massive impact but it’s not a matter of blame - if you were blaming parents then you would logically have to blame their parents before them, and their parents before that. It would imply that we’re capable of making conscious decisions about every aspect of parenting which is completely unrealistic - most of a parent’s minute to minute interactions with their children will be reflexive and that will have as much, if not more, impact as the conscious decisions about things like education. And it will be affected by whatever underlying tendencies and sensitivities the child arrives with at birth, plus all the incidental things along the way like illnesses, accidents, losses etc.

Bit of a nippy sweetie Elizabeth.

Elizabeth seemed unnecessarily nasty to Alistair: 'technically, you're no longer family.' In her position, I"d be extremely grateful for Alistair's wish to stand by Freddie. Awful, and Alistair was rather fabulous in rising above it.

Elizabeth was very mean - blaming him for the petition thing (and it was Shula who wanted out!). Loving Alastair more each episode.

Do all Shula's siblings/relatives hold a grudge because of the gambling?

Agreed - single Alastair is excellent. Shula did him a favour! That said, thought I listened to Friday and confused - what happened with Freddie? Did he break down?

So Peggy liquidates her assets, remortgages her house and gives it all to Brian. She then dies and moany Helen and her other inheritors get nothing.

Well the Ambridge money fairy was bound to pitch up at some point.

They are not going to move are they - who would have thought it? It’s just too Northumberland for words. Is that the real reason Brian has been spending so much time with Peggy - buttering her up under the pretence of improving Jenny’s chances at the Flower and Produce Show? Peggy has unspecified wealth, true Jack was loaded, but his years in The Laurels must have eaten up a large chunk (unless care home fees in Ambridge are a particular bargain). Peggy’s already ridden to the rescue of Aunty Cardboard. She is quite literally the Ambridge money fairy. Not sure how the rest of the family will feel about her bailing out its richest member who is only in that position because he did something criminal and is selling the house because his spoiled daughter refuses to pitch her yurts in an alternative spot.

I also thought that Lizzie was horrible to Alasdair. It was also out of character. As for him rising above it, well he’s a saint. I suppose he was giving her some slack because of her current situation, but I’m not so sure I’d have been so generous.

She was horribly ungrateful, given that we’re supposed to infer (though it hasn’t exactly been shown over the years) that Alistair has been an exemplary uncle to Freddie throughout his life. But I guess her attitude was partly based on the divorce petition misunderstanding. And needing to take out her own misery by kicking someone she saw as sliding rapidly down the food-chain. I’m glad they made up. (And very sick of the loss of paragraphs. )

She was inexplicably horrible - in a way it was good she was so far off the mark because I think that made it easier for Alistair to rise above it.

Typical of Shula’s special kind of meanness not to put her straight in the first place.

So nice was their making up that I had a naughty sneaky thought! What if THEY go together!!!!! sorry I get my coat...

Actually ... the same thought occurred to me. So I assume that’s what they intended to imply. Whether with true intent or just to provoke us - who knows? I’m still waiting to find out why they’re keeping him in the village. But just imagine - Alistair moving into LL, steadying Freddie, being Elizabeth’s soul-mate, finally revealed as a million times the man he was with Shula. It would be mega!

Dirty Great minds Quater Oh yes and think about Shula's reaction!!!!!!

Lizzie could do a Lily.....it was meant to be

And not without precedent - after all Nigel was Shula’s boyfriend before he and Lizzie got together.

Quater! oooh! Alistair as lord of Lower Loxley!! (Squeals with excitement at brilliant plot development)

That would be amazing! Shula would finally totally implode. After all she's done for Freddie too!