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Original poster

Thefts, arson and abuse: The Archers - it's an everyday story of cuntery, folks.

987 replies

PseudoBadger · 31/03/2016 09:55

Thanks to Lancelottie for the title Flowers

OP posts:
lljkk · 02/04/2016 20:40

Thanks Augusta, I am guilty of not hearing the whole episode, oops!!

glowfrog · 02/04/2016 20:53

Good luck, Gherkins. Flowers

EBearhug · 02/04/2016 21:04
LillianGish · 02/04/2016 21:09

Jess told Helen "You don't know what you are getting yourself into".

EBearhug · 02/04/2016 21:09

I heard it as Jess saying he raped her - not that either she nor Helen would name it as rape, but Jess did say, "he doesn't like to take no for an answer" - and we heard him doing that with Helen, too.

I think Helen and Jess would have probably got on really well, under other circumstances, though of course, under other circumstances, they'd have probably never met anyway.

I thought Jess was considerate in a lot of ways, once the initial meeting was over - like suggesting that they go for a walk, and then Helen wouldn't have to lie to Pat about what she'd been doing anyway.

SmallLegsOrSmallEggs · 02/04/2016 21:14

I'm also confused by Jess's assertion months back that Rob had slept with her on Valentine's day (2015). If he had raped her as well, why would she have told Helen in such an ownershippy kind of way?

It isn't always that obvious.BlushSad

Scenario:
Knob goes to see Jess. Woos her with champagne. Tells her he wants her back.
Makes a move on her. She's not wild keen. But he 'doesn't take no for an answer'. So she goes along with it.

In the morning he says it was just sex.
He's with Helen now.
And Helen is better in bed.
As far as we know, she didn't even know about Hellin up until this point.

Jess is so used to being sex being 'taken' from her rather than volunteered that she doesn't even see it for what it was until much later.

Pride hurt by finding about the OW she sleeps with an old flame.

Then she decides fuck it two can play at this game and turns up at BHC on Velnetine's night to woo Rob. Remember she was surprised H had moved in and that Rob was out. The bed was barely cold from her moving out.

Then she realises that not only has Rob moved in with OW he isn't even with her on VD so clearly there is another other woman.

She tells H about last week as an act of revenge on the woman who has stolen her dh and who is also allegedly better in bed but who is also obviously being duped by Rob.

The only bit that doesn't make sense is if she did know about H before VD but didn't know she was at BHC then presumably she'd have expected them both to be out or both on togetherConfused

SmallLegsOrSmallEggs · 02/04/2016 21:17

*in together.

PinaGrigio · 02/04/2016 21:20

I suspect, like CuttedUpPear, there has been a leetle bit of rewriting to make the situation more consistent. My memory of Jess turning up on Helen's doorstep before was that she was a lot more dramatic, shouting at Helen that Rob had spent Valentine's 'In My Bed!, whereas last night she was a lot quieter and pretty much admitted he'd raped her. This might be down to the gap of months and the ability to see events in perspective once she'd escaped, or down to rewriting of scripts. Take yer pick.

I did also find Rob creepy and controlling when he first turned up, though, and he was a total wanker to Jess over the party when she wouldn't do as he wanted, so I think the signs were there for the SWs to work with, even if they first saw him as the new Brine.

LillianGish · 02/04/2016 21:30

SmallLegs I find your insight into this really enlightening, but also heartbreaking. I hope you are alright now. Flowers

SuffolkNWhat · 02/04/2016 21:43

I also think at the time of the doorstep confrontation Knob was still firmly entrenched in Jess' mind (like a drug) and so she acted out as someone who was used to doing everything Knob told her (perhaps the thought of being on her own was more frightening than the abuse?)

She's now had time away, time to heal, to realise what she was in was abusive and very unhealthy I genuinely think she pities Hellin more than she dislikes her for what she did.

redshoeblueshoe · 02/04/2016 21:50

SmallLegs I totally agree - what seems obvious as an observer is not how it feels when you are in that position.
When I was with my XH - I didn't see that he was an abusive bastard, when he left I would have done almost anything to get him back.
Time healed me. I saw what he was.
One of our DC saw through him and completely cut him out of her life, she is the strongest person I know.
Our other DC has been very damaged by him.
I don't know if they will ever understand a healthy relationship.
That breaks my heart.
That makes me feel very guilty.

Gruach · 02/04/2016 21:56

My memory of Jess turning up on Helen's doorstep before was that she was a lot more dramatic ...

Or possibly drunk? (I'm sure that was the thread diagnosis.)

PinaGrigio · 02/04/2016 22:00

Yes, possibly that as well Smile

BYOSnowman · 02/04/2016 22:02

Jess is a terrible actress and always came across as deranged. I hope she has done her bit and we don't hear from her again (except as a witness)

bakeoffcake · 02/04/2016 22:12

I too think Jess is a terrible actress. It's as if she's reading the script for the very first time, in a very dark room.

pasbeaucoupdegendarme · 02/04/2016 22:32

redshoe Sad

I can, sadly, absolutely understand going back to the arms of a gentle old friend after being raped. The idea of being with someone on your own terms would be very appealing.

Amnesiac · 02/04/2016 22:59

Yeah Jess actor is absolutely awful.

I genuinely thought they hadn't booked anyone and had asked perhaps the woman who was delivering flowers for someone's birthday, or maybe someone techie "come on Edie we're desperate, please just read this out for a minute then you can go back to checking sound levels ...yep that'll do fine"
'Cept it doesn't, we all know she's shit.

I have a sheet of paper in my head, on the left are all the voices I could listen to all day and on the right the profoundly irritating ones.

SmallLegsOrSmallEggs · 02/04/2016 23:42

redshoe Flowers time may yet heal your dc.
I have marvellous friends who lived through similar as kids who assure me there comes an age when things become clearer and from observing my lovely dsc (now adults) it seems this is true. They cope with knowing who he is but don't let it change who they are. But it took time.

My own dc have a bit a growing to do before they can see him and themselves clearly but I think/hope they will be ok.

We did what we thought was best with the information we had at the timeFlowers

Lillian I am fine now and the stronger for it. It taught me a lot and gave me 2 beautiful dc. The funny thing is though that one day he was just a bit difficult/messed up/needed more patience than other men and then next I realised it wasn't difficult it was abuse. Like a switch. Snd I yhrew him out. The awakening is hard to explain but not as hard to explain as why you slept through it in the first place. It's the weirdest thing.

When Helen said I always said the minute he hit me and Jess agreed I thought that was briiliantly done. I thought that too and who doesn't? Who actually thinks yeah, sure, I'd stay with a man that hits me. (Or does whatever...mine wasn't a hitter)

SmallLegsOrSmallEggs · 02/04/2016 23:43

*and I threw him out

Putthetulipsthere · 02/04/2016 23:49

💐💐 for Gherkinsmummy, Smalllegs & Redshoe.

I think Jess has been brought back in to explain the Valentines evening last year and to push the story forward, ie to encourage Helen to see that she and Henry need to get away from Rob, and indeed expose him as an abuser & rapist.

I hope Helen makes contact with WA again as the only conversation she's had with them so far was quite short. Not sure if Kirsty suggested it already but she needs to have bag ready ( & hidden away ) for a quick exit. I'm hoping she'll make the call soon. She has the spare phone & as pp mentioned, she must get finances sorted. Yes I am now well & truly over invested in Helen & Henry's plight.

SmallLegsOrSmallEggs · 02/04/2016 23:55

putthetulipsthere GrinGrin at your ncWink

One thing I am glad of is I never had to 'escape'. The fear must be immense. My ex was a flouncer so it was just a matter of him flouncing and then letting the door stay firnly closed behind him.

I did wonder/hope Rob might be a flouncer and that was how he and Jess came to be living apart at the start. He flounced and she said she was staying near her dad.

We can but hope.

SuffolkNWhat · 03/04/2016 00:11

He doesn't strike me as a flouncer. He has put too much ground work in to throw it away that easily.

AnnieNoMouse · 03/04/2016 00:44

I'm confused, and wasn't a listener in Feb 14.
The night Jess was talking about on Friday to Helen - I don't think she said it was Valentines did she? Although it was around the time she conceived Ethan and I think he was born around 11/14.
Valentines 2014 - was that the night Rob went off and Helen was visited by Jess, implying he had an assignation with someone else?

AnnieNoMouse · 03/04/2016 00:57

Lowfield has the answer.
Jess turned up at BHC on 14/2/14. Helen was alone and told Jess that Rob had gone to a machinery conference. Jess told H that Rob had spent the previous Thursday night with her.
www.lowfield.co.uk/archers/daily.phtml?20140214

EmilyDickinson · 03/04/2016 05:56

So, is Helen convinced now? Kirsty has told her the relationship is abusive, WA have told her that there's never any excuse for violence, Rob has started emotionally abusing Henry and Jess has made it clear that Rob behaved similarly with her. Is it enough to convince Helen to leave?

I can't imagine that Rob would ever leave by consent so Helen's escape would probably involve her leaving the house with Henry. The most obvious thing to do would be to return to her parents house, but with Pat convinced that Rob has Helen's interests at heart would she actually be safe there or would Pat collude with Rob to get them back together? I could see Rob presenting Helen's flight as further evidence of her mental instability and the need for him to control her more tightly.