Independent schools while on UC

[Luluace]

Hi all,

I have have two boys (7 and 3) whom I would like to try for independent school. Youngest will be starting reception in Sept and he is a bright spark. Oldest also. There are a couple of schools I have looked into ( Dulwich prep/college and St Paul’s). I have seen that these schools offer scholarships/bursaries.
Recently been made homeless due to DV and have had to sign up for UC for the first time in my life, and so have missed and entrance exam assessments to schools. Has anyone had any chance of being offered a place after assessments and places offered? How straightforward with the school offering scholarship/bursary?
Specifically asking to those on UC or other benefits? How did you liaise with the school to inform them and how did they respond?

To those whose kids made enters to these schools, how was the process, especially if you are either on low income or on benefits?
What prep and for how long? I am not familiar with the system and just need to understand and both my kids will benefit from the challenge of private. State school my first was in never challenged him and they wanted every child to be on the same level which is impossible. A small class size is another thing of interest.

please advise/suggest.

You're absolutely wrong. Bursaries are provided by full fee paying parents or charitable donations from the parents. You're also insane if you think you can get your children into a fee paying school without paying a penny, x2, outside of the normal assessment schedule. Seriously, your only chance here is to take the exams at 7+ and 11+ and see if you're awarded a 100pc bursary at that point.

OP as others have said you need to look around the schools, your DC sit the entrance exam/interview and then you find out if you have been awarded a bursary.
You need to manage the expectations of your DC if they pass the exam but aren't awarded a 100% bursary. You will have to declare your husband's/ex-husband income too.
You really also need to ask what the school's plans are with VAT looming and whether the bursary follows your DC through school. I would be very twitchy relying on a 100% bursary at this point.

I think you misunderstand what sort of "work" children benefit from at home. NOT "supplementary" school work. What is the point? School work is for school. The role of the parent is to enrich their child's education by conversations, experiences and interests OUTSIDE of the curriculum. Or to reinforce the curriculum content by practical applications BEHIND the place they currently are at school.

Why would you be working with your child on academic work beyond what he is covering at school? Where is the pleasure or the value in that? There is none.

Children benefit from shopping, talking, political engagement, travel, camping, gardening, cooking, visiting museums, galleries, exhibitions, voluntary work, hobbies, languages, music, conservation, sport, hiking, trips and trip planning, sewing, craft, community service, films, photography, family life with relatives of all ages, etc etc etc

What they don't benefit from is doing more school work at home with parents, beyond where they are at school. By all means work on weaknesses and support with problem areas, a little bit, in a non threatening way.

But you keep saying your son is 2-3 years ahead - not unusual in state schools, and now you are saying you have taught him at home, so that 2-3 years ( which you have assessed in a home setting, where he will inevitably perform better) is not down to natural ability, but to cramming, so I take back what I said earlier about him possibly being in the top 10%. He might be, but there is no evidence of that. Maybe top third? Might not be grammar school material.

Nothing you have said makes it likely that your child would qualify for any sort of funding for a private school.

I know you want the best for your child, but I am still advising that supporting him through state school with a varied and interesting programme of family activities and hobbies outside of school, plus academic support in weak, behind areas, is the way to provide it.

My DC are at an indie similar to the ones you mention but a different area. The school offers a great bursary programme for new students without means to pay, I believe some more than 100%. With the likely changes to VAT and the uncertainty of the financial impact on paremts, the school bursary fund will be available for EXISTING pupils of the school.

As the change is made I would assume many funds are less readily available than previous years. If it was challenging before, I believe it is about to get a lot harder to get one for the next few years.

OP

I am going to believe that your boys are as bright as you say. Great! My two are also at a competitive private school (not London) and one has a small scholarship, meaning he had one of the top ten scores on exam and interview.

Let’s call the school you want X. X (and every other school) has hundreds of boys each year who are bright enough to get in. It cannot offer a place to all of them. Even the waiting list is selective - if a space comes up because a boy moves, the first boy asked will likely be the next best performer in the exams (his parents may say no if he is settled elsewhere at that point, and then the school will work down the list)

Of those hundreds of boys, let’s say 30 are among the highest scorers but do not have the means to pay full fees. The school has set aside funds for perhaps 10 full bursaries. There is then a complicated juggling act by the bursar, assessing the financial situation of the 30, deciding if any could pay eg 50% fees or 75% fees or 30% fees, meaning the bursaries can go further. Is it better to have 20 able boys on 50% bursaries or 10 on 100%, when that means 10 other boys aren’t able to go.

All these calculations will be done within 1-2 months of the main entrance process, so that parents can make decisions. Perhaps a boy with a 50% bursary offer will take a 100% offer elsewhere and the bursar can move down the list, or bump others up to 60%

This sort of process is why it is very unlikely, even if your boys are Einstein and Newton in waiting, for you to get a 100% bursary at a non-standard entry point. Bear in mind that the bursar may also need to retain some funds for parents who have a large change in circumstances part way through the educational process.

Hence posters saying “focus on 11+ or possibly 7+”

Getting a bursary for the fees would be great if possible but in my experience there are a lot of other expenses that need to be considered. Uniforms are usually a lot more expensive. School lunches are more expensive than state, paid in advance and no refunds if your child is off sick and doesn't have them. School trips and equipment needed should also be taken into consideration.

Let’s remember the OP has just been through an extremely tough time, and will still be feeling the trauma of it all.

She doesn’t need kicking down.

Wouldn’t anyone here want something positive to focus on in such circumstances?

Her eldest child is 7. The OP will probably have plenty of time to begin to navigate the choppy waters of entrance exams and bursary applications They’ve already faced considerable disruption in their life and the OP is trying to do her best for them in difficult circumstances. Maybe posters are finding her tone insufficiently humble? Whatever.

I’ve never used the words ‘be kind’ in my life. 🤮 But, y’know … Easter Sunday an’ all …

I think of myself as being quite empathetic but I’d struggle to have empathy for a non working person not being able to the fees for a top school. It is something that the majority or the population, working or not, don’t have the means to do.

But that is exactly what bursary funds are for, @Morph22010.

I know it’s sometimes a surprise to people to discover you can send your child to even the most famous school in the country - without having two pennies to rub together. It’s one of those things where either you know the system or you don’t. And on every single MN thread about bursaries a poster will pop up and confidently state that no such system exists and only the very wealthy have access to independent schooling.

So the majority of the population don’t actually know what’s possible.

(Full disclosure - our current undergraduate had several years of prep school and all of senior school - boarding - courtesy of 100% bursaries. So I do know what I’m talking about.)

No-one is kicking her, what some of us are doing is saying to be realistic in her expectations and manage them accordingly. She is looking at highly prestigious and therefore competitive schools. When doing this you should always prepare yourself for the "what if" of your child not being accepted, let alone be awarded a 100% bursary for the full length of the school ie Yr 1-Yr 13.
OP asked for advice and has recieved it. No-one has kicked her while she is down.
It would be irresponsible to not give the advice that has been given ie even if considering private you should always have a state back up irrespective of whether you want a bursary or not.

I know there are bursaries but they are still quite few and far between, and very rare at age 4, if the entire population suddenly became aware and wanted to send their kids to independent there would still only be enough for a tiny minority

No-one has kicked her while she is down.

They have. They clearly enjoyed doing it, too.

(And of course it’s right to give realistic advice. As I have done here myself.)

No one is saying there are bursaries for 4 year olds, @Morph22010!

But there’s clearly a feeling that ‘poor people’ don’t deserve nice things …

I had a friend who was a maths teacher who would teach her son advanced maths - so in year 3 he was the level of a year 5. His free gov school just put him in the year 5 maths class for maths lessons.

But it’s something the majority don’t have therefore I cannot feel sympathy for someone not being able to afford. In the same way I would not feel sympathy for someone who couldn’t afford yacht or a Ferrari as the majority of people can’t afford those either

In your opinion "They have. They clearly enjoyed doing it, too". That isn't a statement of fact, it is your opinion and I can't see any evidence of anyone enjoying kicking the OP.
In fact 1 poster apologised for having misunderstood UC.

I would prepare yourself for the fact that your children are going to have to sit the exams and then see from there.

I found math easy at school - state school - I did my maths GCSE 2 years early. States schools usually have a gifted & talented programme too to nurture kids who are academic/advanced. I know my school did and the school my DC went to did

If your child really is that gifted, talented and advanced I would suggest that they will do well in most state schools particularly given your own ambition and support. There are plenty of excellent state schools in your area that you should investigate. You sound rather naive and unrealistic. But then again if you have such a child prodigy the sky is the limit.

Perfectly put.

Gifted and talented was scraped as part of Tory cut backs

I would also look at moving into one of the Grammar areas in London. I think there are some postcodes around Worcester Park that would mean you are in the inner catchment to Tiffin, Willsons & Wallington. You probably wouldn't want to travel to St Paul's or Dulwich from there but independents such as KGS or Hampton should be accessible.

@Morph22010 my dds school still has it - but we are in wales so perhaps funding is different as we are devolved?

I was a full bursary kid from year 6 onwards, with a single mum, living in a 2 bed council flat in a "bad" part of town.

I was never bullied. My friends lived in beautiful huge houses with parents who drove fancy cars and took expensive holidays while we went to the lakes and Blackpool and got public transport as my mum didn't drive.

My friends all still talk about their favourite sleepovers at my house and how my mum made all of my birthday cakes every year.

I will say though, you do need to consider the cost of things like uniforms, school trips, etc. my mum still had to make huge sacrifices to pay for them

It’s possible of course, but there are limited numbers, and it is also a good idea for OP to investigate state options as a backup plan.

Yes Eton etc do give out full bursaries, but not to everyone who applies - OP should get her children into decent state schools (which, if they are bright, will give them just as good an education as Dulwich) and if they get a bursary that is a bonus.