Told my 4 year old is behind at school

[dual90]

So yesterday we went to parents evening at my DD school. I kind of knew it wouldn’t be all that positive because a week before we had been invited into the school to view one of the classes. My DD was not her best that day, crying and clingy. I noticed she was being placed at the front of the class which I know isn’t a good sign! I come from an education background- so I’m well aware of certain words like ‘interventions’ etc.

My DD is one of the youngest in the class, so she’s on the bottom 5th age bracket as she is a summer baby. The teacher just seemed to focus on the negatives, but threw in she plays well and is happy! But then launched into she’s struggling with the learning and is not ‘retaining’ and information! I did challenge her on this as at home she makes all the sounds for phonics and recognition letters. She’s also been deemed as bright in nursery and counting to 20 since she was 2! She’s interested in numbers and counts a lot and she’s been doing this for a while. She then says she didn’t recognise numbers, again we challenged her on that too as she does recognise them at home. She seemed a little baffled and kept saying she was ‘behind her peers’.

For a start I thought most learning in reception was play based and we would t have this kind of pressure this early only 4 weeks into term and being told she is not matching up! I did say to the teacher that developmentally there is going to be huge differences in learning just by the sheer difference in age for some of the children, she firstly agreed with that then contradicted it by saying she has other kids the same age who are coping fine. But we still said she seems to be doing fine with these things when she’s at home. We also have no idea what it is she is supposed to be learning. She says she’s in a small ‘intervention’ group. I find this concerning that this is already happening and quite worried she will be pigeon holed straight away and this young age. She had never had a problem learning and nobody had flagged this before, in fact I’d say the opposite. Her speech is better than some children that are 2 years older than her. I had reservations about sending her this year anyway, I felt she may not be ready but she really wanted to go. I also am slightly dissolution ed with whole school system anyway, so for me it’s sadly confirmed many reservations I’ve had. I do not want her to be off as a 4 year old and she’s already had a very tough start in life.

The teacher says if she doesn’t catch up now the gap will get bigger, I found this a very negative thing to say. I know in other countries they don’t even start this stuff until 6 or 7? And they do just fine. But straight away the pressure is on. We will try and help her catch up, but just this morning after the teacher said she didn’t recognise numbers we nearly filmed her doing it as she recognised them all!! And she has done for a long time. I did point out to the teacher that she just doesn’t know the name of the game yet and that she needs to know these things, so it’s more immaturity than anything else.

any thoughts or advice

No. You’re missing the point. The stuff this child isn’t doing in reception is not reception age stuff. It’s nursery.

I'm a TA in EYFS. No one is "behind". They've been at school for 7 weeks, it's mainly play based for the first term. It's very unusual for a teacher to say a child is behind before year 2.

That’s absolute nonsense. It’s more than possible to hit reception and be noticeably behind.

Now you are claiming they are asking her to do things that aren’t reception based stuff? Utter nonsense.

I absolutely dispute my daughter is noticeably behind. I absolutely dispute that and do not accept that at all.

I think it's good to do baseline assessments early on so they are ready to meet the children where they are at. My DS started overseas and the assessment was before his first day.

Questions may be asked differently to how you may ask at home, the teacher asked my DS the difference between 4 and 6, he thought about it and said 6 was bigger. She meant arithmetic difference. He would have understood 6 take-away 4 or any word problem that meant the same. Or she may just be shy or not settled in yet.

I'd ask for a follow up a couple of weeks after October break.

No I’m not. I’m saying the stuff you’re describing is not reception based stuff, what the school is describing is stuff she should have mastered by now. Children should understand concrete numbers. What you’re describing - counting on rote and recognising numbers - is below reception level. She should be able to do what I’ve described previously. Confidently.

I didn’t say she was. I disputed the statement that no one is behind at nursery level.

No. That is not what I said. The teacher says she did not recognise numbers. She can. She says she could not count. She can count. She has mastered these, this is what mean and my husband have disputed. In fact she’s always loved numbers. In fact that very morning we showed her things and she counted them, correctly. She has been doing this for a long time. The reason for my post is I’m disputing this, I do t agree with this. If I really felt my child had not mastered these very basic things, I’d be very aware of it. Apparently all of a sudden the teacher knows my child better than I do.

I did not say she can just count on rote. She has mastered all of these things. The teacher has done an assessment and has not even made us aware.

I will dispute this. Maybe you wouldn’t. If I knew my child was behind and not doing these things I’d have nothing to gain from any of this.

it seems like a pretty big judgement to make do soon, and the judgement she has made is completely different to my judgement.

I should’ve added. Is this your first ? You’re worrying way too much about this. If she’s behind she’ll catch up. If she’s happy and healthy that’s all I’d be worrying about. The nursery told me. As long as my boy can sit and listen and share he’ll be fine. Everything else is learned and learn she will. Some children will never learn the basic art of empathy it cant be taught.

I don’t understand why you are being so defensive. Your initial post was half saying that she is behind and why aren’t they doing something and then she isn’t and you don’t want them to pigeon hole her or make an intervention.
If you work in education you will know that this isn’t true. A child that is struggling at age 3 will not impact her future education!
If she is capable of counting why are you so concerned? They will realise quickly and if it’s a confidence thing then maybe the intervention may help. It can’t hurt.
You also can totally tell if a child is behind. My youngest niece is bit behind in her speech but apparently she has been behind in all her milestones and is slowly catching up. Dedicated education will not be detrimental.

That is ridiculous ! Of course they can be! Sad thing is that this sort of comment stops action being taken into they’re even further behind. I’ve taught nursery children where it’s clear within the first day or two they are struggling, we monitor, give help and encouragement, have gentle conversations with parents and offer ideas for home. Unfortunately it’s not uncommon for these same children to struggle in other years.

The assessments are based on age in months. Keep that in mind.

No. They are not based on age in months. That’s completely untrue.

Which assessment did they do?

Your absolute fixation with the fact that you child cannot possibly be behind is clouding your judgement.

One of two things is true.

They either can’t do what they should be doing.

or.

They can but aren’t in their school setting.

Both indicate an issue. Schools do not raise concerns with parents unless there are actual concerns. They just don’t.

I worked with a teacher like this ! She would infuriate me when telling parents their child was struggling or behind, these are young children adjusting to school life , rules and routines and often 29 other children in the class . Ignore her and let your child enjoy school without feeling you should be doing more at home with her to “catch-up”. Children develope at different times and that teacher cannot make you feel uneasy after 4/5 weeks in school 😱

My eldest found learning to read very, very hard in year R. He has a serious speech delay and reflecting back, of course couldn’t understand phonics as he couldn’t say the sounds. He had always seemed a bright boy and as a fairly young mum, I felt a lot of stress and pressure in year R as he seemed to be falling behind so much and I worried about this. His teacher was quite dismissive, and just seemed to say that some kids are much slower than others etc. Beginning of year 1, his lovely teacher said to me, don’t worry some kids never learn phonics. We’ll be reading whole words this year, he’ll be fine.

And he was. It all clicked in year 1. He got 12 GCSEs, including 8 A* and A grades, A levels and a degree in a humanities subject. He is now working and studying for a masters degree.

I don’t know if this helps at all? Interestingly he didn’t end up with dissimilar grades to his siblings who did not have any issues in year R.

I'm a reception teacher, and I wouldn't be making such harsh judgements against a child in the first 4 weeks, many children need to settle in to show their true abilities, and this can take a term or so. I would take photos or videos of her doing the things at home she isn't supposedly doing at school as evidence. If you don't want her in the intervention you can request she doesn't take part, perhaps until after Xmas when she has had a whole term to settle in. It is very common for summer born children to take a little longer to show their skills. Carry on supporting at home, and monitor. If your not happy with now teacher is managing this situation I would seek a meeting with the year group lead or sendco to share concerns. I also have an inkling this decision may be based on the government baseline test children have to do now, and I can tell you from first hand experience, alot of children don't perform well in those, the test isn't child friendly and is actually very challenging in some areas, testing on skills I wouldn't expect until the end of the year!

OP the teacher can only comment on what she has observed. If your DD is doing all of these things at home, then great, nothing to be upset about.

She isn't against you, she's trying to support your child.

No, neither of these things might be true if it is too early for the teacher to be able to judge accurately, why aren't you understanding that? The school may have raised something THEY see as an issue, that might not actually be an issue, as can be seen by the numerous comments on this thread from professionals agreeing it is premature. It indicates the school have different priorities than some parents might like. The OP is questioning their approach which is perfectly legitimate.

This is what schools are like now. It’s all data. So her teacher will be talking in terms of how she sees her class and their attainment so far. She will have pressure to get a certain percentage up to a certain standard. Is she a young teacher? I would expect someone older and more experienced to not share all that with you and focus on the positives at this stage.

There is a standard test based EYFS baseline now. She probably came in low. Either she is behind and needs support or she isn't and does it matter. I F she is having problems communicating then her prime areas need work. And do it isn't months any more its broader definitions in years now. Its pretty much the same though. Maths is easier.

Hello, teacher here. I think sometimes parents find it hard to understand when teachers say their children ar behind, as they don't realise the level the other children are already learning at. The teacher will have experience with children at this age and will have a very accurate assessment of whether your child is behind the rest of the class. They will be trying to tell you gently by giving you examples, but they wouldn't be saying it if it weren't true, and giving them examples of things she can do at home doesn't make a huge amount of difference, because as parents you don't know whether what's she's doing at home is below or above the expected standard for her school age, and it won't trump the teachers knowledge of the curriculum and her experience teaching children of all different abilities. If she's in interventions already that's good, and your right, some children who are very young in the year do struggle more because of their age and may catch up at a later date. It's a tricky one as some kids who are born in August are the brightest in the class and you wouldn't be able to tell they are young in the year, whereas for others you can see it really impacts them and they are always just a little bit behind. Your daughter is who she is and it seems like the school is putting things in place to help her already which is positive, just help her as much as you can at home by reading with her every day. It doesn't matter that she's not the brightest child in the class, were all different and if she's happy and enjoying school then at this point that's the most important thing. I wouldn't be stressing her out by making her do extra phonics and things at this early age, just let her enjoy school and being with her friends!

I hope you’re not talking about my comment?

It’s not too early.