Glendower vs Pembridge vs Ken Prep vs Falkner

[Ddbrightmoon]

Hi all

I wanted to ask how people would decide between these schools. We want our daughter to have a well rounded education but also go to a very strong school academically for 11+.

All schools have something going on (FH: uncertainty of the future with changing Headmistress G:Headmistress change although she seems to be doing a great job, pembridge: news of teacher departures and shift to Bute/G/KP at 7+. KP seems most stable and best facilities but G/FH seem a step ahead academically?

There are lots of threads but keen to get the latest view from the group!

@MMmomDD just cheeky comment. I am referring to Victoria Beckham's daughter and her school run. There is a lot of wealth floating around these schools, so locality is less of a factor (despite Glendower saying the prefer local girls, the counter example is there for everyone to see).

Majority at the kids in these schools don’t have a chauffeur. Some parents drive, some take public transport.
But of course - people who can afford to live in the area, and to pay for private schools are wealthy. 🤷🏻‍♀️
And Notting Hill, as well as Earl’s Court and even Knightsbridge are all ‘local’ to a Kensington school.

Why should a child living walking distance be prioritised over the one who takes a bus - if they pass an academic selection?

I agree on the priority should not have to do with distance. Not sure the schools in question say that though!

@MMmomDD also you hit it on the nail - if you live nearby, you are more deemed to be wealthy and from same social background, and able to afford fees too, the more far out from Kensington on average the more different you will be to the main set. The schools know that

Girls in my daughter’s year at FH come from all over by bus, tube and on foot. There was (pre-Covid) a school bus offered jointly with the boys’ school starting in Hammersmith coming via Fulham and SW6.

Gloucester Road being on the Piccadilly, Circle and District Lines is very handy, and with the boys’ school being right next to Earl’s Court, they’re very well connected.

Yes, the majority live relatively locally, but there are families who travel from much further afield for a number of reasons, e.g. it’s conveniently located on the way to work, or they simply think it’s the best school for their family.

Not everyone lives a stroll away on The Boltons! Please don’t be put off by that impression!

@Coronateachingagain

I think you are trying to imply some sort of social injustice in the school selection - which I am not sure is the case, apart from the fact that the schools do select among the people able to pay the fees. (But this isn’t a thread on private vs state)....
But I haven’t seen quite what you are implying.
Ok, FH’s headmistress does tend to select a specific type of child/parent to an extent. It is a selective club. For example, she does not like families where English isn’t the main spoken language; she also doesn’t like summer children, etc.
But FH/KP, etc - they select kids more based on their assessments.
People who apply are presumed to be able to pay the fees.

If your address on application is over an hour away - the school will probably want to talk to you and see if there is a good reason why you want to have such a long daily commute for a small child.
It happens, there are some kids with longer commutes - but it’s a small minority.
So It isn’t some sort of a face control you are implying - when kids from far away aren’t admitted much to the school - it’s more a practical consideration.

And, btw - selective secondaries also look at where kids are coming from. Their radius is wider, but does exist. No one wants tired kids spending hours on getting to/from school.

@MMmomDD
Sorry I have to disagree with you on the Falkner House and distance thing. I live a good 30 minute commute (with traffic) and turned FH down because of the drive - and Mrs Griggs didn’t understand that at all and quite literally said “no one turns us down” - what a put off.
But I do concur with your other assessments of FH in terms of a certain type of family, english as main language. We were referred by a former pupil, my husband has a name that can be googled and she referred to him by his title when we toured (I certainly didn’t give it) and, as he is French, she was very clear that she preferred “english as the main language in the home”. My daughter is also a September birthday.

C’est la vie!

@Mommy77

MrsG does have that attitude, and - to be fair to her - she does deliver great results and the kids in the school are quite impressive. And - despite the results the school isn’t some sort of a pressure cooker.
However - that school is sort of a marmite. You need to trust MrsG and not get in the way. Or not - and then it’s better to leave to not be constantly frustrated.
This is the reason FH doesn’t have PTA - she simply doesn’t want it to be in the way. Or have parents unite in any way.
It is a family founded/run private institution, and she is running it the way she believes is the best.

However - 30 min with traffic isn’t a long distance for a school run. It’s about the time it’ll take to get from, say, Kensington Church St to FH by bus/walk in the morning.

FH it’s a challenging set up with both the head teachers of the 2 schools (boys and girls) being her daughters, if you were unhappy then where would go?

Also I just looked at the staff list and the lack of any type of diversity would really put me off. You are bringing children up in London, the great think about London is it’s diversity. Do have a staff list comprised of just white people really does not sit well with me.

@Jsku
Sorry, perhaps I didn’t phrase my thoughts that well.
I absolutely don’t think that these schools are humourless pressure cookers. My interactions with them and with current parents have been generally pretty positive. There is a lot of talk about a rounded education and a work hard play hard ethos. However, as has previously been mentioned, we do start formal schooling very early in this country. As a result, I am finding making this choice at 4 tough. Leaving it until 7+ feels more ‘right’ for us, but it’s a riskier decision.
Of course, you can find competitive parents anywhere and there are more/less nurturing schools across the spectrum. However it is true that there is a lot of talk about which school is ‘best’ and thus is often judged on its exit results rather than the experience the children will have throughout there time at the school which is rather narrow.

@Mommy77 and @MMmomDD

Funny I also don’t live next to FH, have had the same discussion with Mrs G about people not turning the school down (even though a couple friends have) and I have not been put off. Reality is that she’s probably not wrong (it is likely a small minority of people who turn a FH girls offer down) but after discussing with my 2 friends in that minority almost every comment boiled down to not liking the “Family / their way or the highway” mantra. And better that they recognised that and walked away from the onset than suffer later? And it’s likely that parents who have signed up to the school basically get what the deal is with sending their girl (or boy) to FH (as MMmomDD bluntly explained) and just get on with it.
As for the English comments we are a trilingual family and Mrs G said they loved that and love having bilingual / trilingual families. Only comment at all was that they were impressed with my child’s english. Years ago friends had told us to not worry about children learning our mother tongues immediately because at the end of the day they will be assessed in English, so we may as well focus on that and then get their level up in other languages (DD fully understands us but speaks back in English mainly). So it would make sense that the school wants to make sure kids’ English is at a certain level?
Anyway we are choosing FH vs G or KP for a few reasons a) have a boys school for my younger son and b) we really do like the family and c) if nothing else, DH thought it was the “toughest” to get into and having had that mantra for his own education, this is what made sense to him (although I don’t fully agree, I like to see the bigger picture etc etc).
I would just note that this is completely personal to us and totally get others who would chose G or KP as these are all great schools, we are splitting hairs here.

I am slightly amused by how much Mrs Griggs features into the parents' decisions making. The people that I interact with at FH are my daughter's main class teacher, the head of lower school and the music teacher. I have polite and very short conversations with Mrs Griggs about once a month, when I happen to run into her at the school. However, the people who have and will continue to influence my daughter's education are her main teachers. And they are exceptional. What has impressed me the most has been just how quickly they understood my child's strengths and potential and have been working with her as an individual since the early days of Reception. @londonsbmum it sounds like we will be Reception parents together in 2021 (for my youngest daughter).

@RaspberryCake fantastic! Will send you a PM. Indeed, I agree it’s a bit ridiculous to dissect conversations with headmasters / headmistresses but along with the tour it’s about all we have to go on to get a “gut feel” from personal experience with the school. Rest is hearsay from friends or mumsnet (lol).
You raise a good point as well about how quickly the school got to know your daughter .. a small side note but in the whole assessment circus we really did appreciate the effort from schools who still managed / deemed important for parents to have visits in 2020 and more importantly still made the effort in January lockdown to take the girls in physically to meet them. It is a sign of them wanting to know you and your child. I’m not from the UK and the assessment of a 3 year old blows my mind but then reducing that to a 15 min Zoom call takes it to a whole other level ... !

@RaspberryCake

The amount of interactions with HM in the early years is quite similar in many schools. Unless there are issues - your main point of contact is the immediate teacher.
It does change if anything of worry/disagreement pops up.

And it changes in the later years, especially in the run up to the 11+.

@londonsbmum
The assessments this year were difficult for all. And the only schools that were legally able to do them in person were those also registered as ‘nursery school’ - which FH is. Others didn’t see your daughter in person not because they were less personal - but because they were not allowed.
15 min zoom calls are of course not great - but neither is assessment at 3yo in general, obviously....

Not sure which one is more strange - this is one of the consortium schools - who has to cancel their exams - and instead had kids make letters with marshmallows and pasta, as part of 11+ this year...

@Jsku
Indeed, that is true about the registered ‘nursery school’. I however know that a couple of non registered nursery schools sent their admissions/early years teachers to our nursery to assess our DD as well as have either a Zoom chat or in person coffee off the premises with us parents and I include them in the more “personal” camp. So while they didn’t take in children on their grounds they still looked at the kids in person (and frankly probably in the best possible setting). But perhaps there are rules preventing all schools to do same? One school did none of that - only one 15 min zoom assessment ... and is a super coveted school. One non-assessment school went as far as no visit, no video, no interaction and “go talk to parents/headmistress to understand about us”. How arrogant - that was an absolute no-go for us ... but again, another coveted school ...

@londonsbmum I can't imagine the Admission team you just praised going around all the nurseries they got applicants from in London and doing same job. You must be in one of the more favoured nurseries and if so other people did not have access to the same privilege. Just to keep in mind, they may or may not be what they look at this point in time.

@Coronateachingagain
I was actually referring to 3 schools that did that, so I was not singling out a single admissions team vs others. It probably helped that there were several children being assessed, so perhaps schools doing this weren’t doing it based on favourite nursery or privilege but practicality while assessing a child in person? In one instance I know that there were at least 6 children being observed at the nursery.

@londonsbmum well what you just said proves the point - they probably went to the feeders, that doesn't make them any better. Just a tad smarter

Are you really trying to argue that FH isn’t privileged?

At least recognise it for what it is

Are we discussing how privileged are the private schools in Kensington?
🤔

@MMmomDD that goes without saying but there is privileged and privileged. Some posts below have offered hints and even evidence that the criteria for selection is also influenced by other factors. For example where you live, or if your name can be easily recognised. Tells you something about the family or management behind the schools.

@Coronateachingagain
This is a small public school in the middle of a wealthy part of London. It’s not a public resource.
The HM/owner selects the way she choses - and it’s really her prerogative, as it’s her business. She does chose fall/winter families; well educated/connected families; mostly English, with some exceptions for select foreigners. It’s an academically selective privileged club.

It’s not some new news.
It is splitting hairs though. Because just a stone throw away are all the other privileged clubs of Kensington private schools - just of slightly different flavours.
Glendower - where other local bright girls who didn’t quite pass Mrs.G’s face control or whose parents didn’t like the HM; Queensgate - where less bright/precocious girls end up; Thomases - a local ‘happy’ school for the largely international parents who don’t want academic pressure and segregated system...
And so on.

If you have a bright girl who doesn’t make it to FH - there are other paths to get to the top secondaries in the area and have a great education. There is really lots of choices for preps. And there is always Bute.

Could we discuss pastoral care? It’s not all about the academic work. Are the children happy, REALLY happy?

KP is the happiest school I know. We chose one of the others, we now wish we hadn’t.

@Silkvale

In any of the schools you will find happy and less happy parents.
No school has universally happy population. And grass often appears greener.
I know people at KP who have unhappy children there.

But - if you don’t like where your daughter is - and it’s not getting better - you don’t have to stay there. Unless she is in Y5/6 and then it’s harder and you just need to support her and get her thought the final stretch.

@MMmomDD I think your post is very good, I would agree generally with all of that. I would add that in the case of FH the family is the school, so there is no forum above to reach out in case it is necessary like in other schools which have either a governance board above or are part of a bigger group.