Primary School offered, not possible, how likely would an appeal be successful.

[LeeandEmma88]

Hello all,

We have read this forum many times but our situation has led to us feeling the need to create an account for advice.

This isn't the typical "We didn't get our preferred school, but it is a good school so can I appeal" post, so please bear with me whilst we explain.

My family has lived in the area of our preferred primary school now for 10 years, with us being located here for 5. The reason we moved to the area was solely for this primary school. We have had our Son's name on the school list since 2013 when he was approximately 10 months old, he is now 3 years and 8 months old and will be starting school this September 2016.

My wife and I work full time jobs and these jobs are unfortunately located out of the area, my wife working 1 hour from home and myself working 30 minutes away.
We also have a 9 month old baby who will be starting daycare in September of this year. This leads us to a bit of an issue, in regards to dropping off children.

It would not be possible for my wife to drop off our baby at daycare, our son at school and then travel to work. she has tried to go part time and drop morning hours but to drop off both and get to work is just too much, leaving her approx an hour late each day.
It is not possible for myself to drop hours as I am a manager at work and have several employees under my sole responsibility. I have to be at work when they are so to say.

This means we need assistance, which comes from my Mother. She is retired but does not drive, she lives on the same road as us meaning both the preferred school and our house are walking distance (she actually has to pass our house to get to the school).

Now we haven't been offered a place at either of our 2 local and preferred schools, which in normal circumstances I would just put it down to over-subscription and learn to live with it. But since January 2016 when the application process was closed my Father has taken ill in health meaning he requires full care which is provided by my Mother.

My wife's employer has agreed to shorten her hours on 2 days meaning she can drop off and collect (based on the thought we would have gotten our preferred school) leaving my Mother to drop off and collect the remaining 3 days of the school week. Now my mother doesn't drive as mentioned earlier so needs a school in walking distance (she cannot leave my Father for a length of time) this leaves two schools, both which were on our application. The 1st choice is 0.3 miles and takes 6 minutes to walk, the 2nd choice we had is 0.6 miles and takes 15 minutes to walk, now the offered choice which we didn't even know existed is 1.8 miles away and takes 45 minutes to walk (these times are one-way not round trips). The choice given would take 4 hours walking time per day to drop off and collect for my Mother, this is not even a possibility due to my Father's health.

We know the preferred school has 30 placements up for grabs and half of these have been filled with siblings, this leaves around 15 places to fill with other criteria. We live 0.3 miles away and can walk to the school within 6 minutes, not many people at all live closer than us, the reason we chose this address. Where do you lot think we would stand with an appeal taking all of the above into consideration?

We would be taking all my Father's medical history to any appeal, along with work contracts to show hours etc as we really feel we should have been offered a place at one of the 2 schools. We also have to take into account though, that the local council do not know of my Father's ill health as it has all happened 'after' the application process. We honestly thought luck would be well within our side as we live so close to the school (we can just about see it from our house) but this isn't the case obviously.

Any help or advice is appreciated.

OP, I don't think it will make any odds but I'd take screen shots of the incorrect information on the school website. I even if it doesn't achieve anything I think it's worth a complaint to them.

I think it's reasonable to rely on admissions info on the school website. It's probably where I looked it up for my children's schools. Fortunately they are aren't remiss enough to have out of date admissions info on their website, nor give out the wrong info at open day. Pretty poor of this school to do that. I'm wondering if the church was handing out correct info which helped the church attenders get ahead in the queue.

Every school we toured told us we needed to follow latest application instructions from the council. Some handed out council's reprints. The schools that needed additional information submitted did NOT mention this as part of the tour (probably because it doesn't apply to everyone.) parents usually enquired in the q/a portion of the tour.

BTW The fact that the admissions policy on the school website it dated October 2014 wouldn't automatically suggest to me it was out of date. You could easily think it was just the date the document was created. If it had said it was for the 2014/2015 admissions cycle then that would be different.

When i applied via Pan London it was made clear which schools required supplementary info on the online form. In fact I've got a feeling i was chased via an automated mail for a form for my third choice school, even though I'd already submitted it.

I've just tried to put myself in OPs shoes. I looked on school web site. Old policy still there. Dated Oct 14 - I would have assumed that that was just the last time it was up dated. No where at all does it mention a SIF. The comment 'evidence must be provided by the clergy or church officer' is very very misleading if you are not experienced in these things. It's easy to assume that they would hand it in for them, based on what it says. OP may have been naive but it's a minefield.
Holding an 'list of interest' at the school makes this worse as OP then thought he'd sorted it and they had his child down, although it was actually meaningless.
They have not given him a form either by the sounds of it, or asked for anything.
At our local faith schools, if you look under 'admissions' on their web site, it very clearly tells you to fill and extra form in and his to download it or get it from school office etc . If you tour the schools, they hand you one there and then.
I have no idea what info was send out / via LA web site in Bolton but I have increasing sympathy for you OP.
I'd be lodging an appeal based on what I state above.

A mate of mine keeps telling me that she is ok as she put her twins down for the high performing local faith school the day after they were baptised. I keep telling her it counts for nothing really, but she's convinced... The school 'have her name down' ...

Even though the correct information was elsewhere you can understand why someone might not know that they have to cross check it. The incorrect information is there in black and white on the Schools own website. You can just picture someone looking at it and working out they were band 4 and then not being too worried about it.

I'd be hopping mad if I were the OP. Although maybe, if it's possible for them to delay their child's starting date it might work out ok.

OP, what about the second school you put down? How likely are you get into that school, given that you're likely to be in a very low category for your first choice school? BTW, you do know that the vicar will have dozens of parents attending church regularly (and who didn't stop 'two months ago' - i.e., when their application form was handed in)?

Really, this doesn't sound like someone with child care issues, but someone who is trying to play the system (and, to be fair, if it's a school that was in the top 15 primary schools in the country last year, it's understandable) and didn't play it very effectively.

In Manchester everyone used to get a big pack of info and booklets. Now it's all on line which I assume is to do with cost cutting. Nothing was sent out this year expect a letter telling you to apply and how.
On the web site you have to go into each school to look at their individual information as loads of schools have own admissions policies now. It's fiddly and very time consuming. That's where it states about additional forms too.
I can see how OP would just assume he already has that, as he had it from the school web site and was handed it at open day. Why look again to check if it was suddenly different with no warning? The school have his name down as far as he knows and haven't told him any different.
As I said - I have no idea what Bolton LA sent out, but I can now see how it could happen. He may not be the only one caught out.
( I also know of some one who assumed their out of parish faith sibling would get a place as his school never gave him any extra form to fill in, but gave one to the other sibling families. He got a place as he could show he was given wrong info my school)

Really, this doesn't sound like someone with child care issues, but someone who is trying to play the system

What an unkind thing to say. I think if the OP was trying to 'play the system' he would have just attended the Church services. Talk about kicking a dog when it's down......

I am rather cynically wondering if the reason the school does so well is that it carefully filters out all the parents who don't follow the highly complicated maze of entry requirements.

Just thinking that not all parents have the wherewithal or organisational skills to read and understand and follow complex administration processes.
Not unreasonable for the op to have thought the admission criteria on the school website were up to date this is very misleading, although it sounds like the op wouldn't have qualified anyway.
There must be lots of people ( I don't mean the op here) who aren't particularly good at form filling, lack the intellect or reading skills to read the whole set of rules or for whom English isn't their first language.
There is a report today that says poorer children lack access to the better schools, and you can totally see why!
There is a school in a poorer area in our town that apparently is always undersubscribed yet on the day school starts many kids turn up that were not expected. Their parents didn't participate in any application procedure they assumed they could just turn up.
What help is thee available for those with learning difficulties etc to get through this process?

Really, this doesn't sound like someone with child care issues, but someone who is trying to play the system (and, to be fair, if it's a school that was in the top 15 primary schools in the country last year, it's understandable) and didn't play it very effectively.

It sounds to me like the reason the school is "top" is that they make easy to get in by following a set of procedures, but at the same time make the procedures arduous in terms of investment and complicated in finding out what to do. That they strip the kids down to only those with the most committed and intelligent parents. An easy way to ensure "success".

Band 4 on the schools out of date admissions criteria the OPs child only has to have been baptized in the parish so there was no need for him to go to church at all. Attending church only gets you into Band 5.

It would be weird 'playing the system' to be going to church for no reason.

Here is the schools INCORRECT admissions policy. Copy and pasted in full. The OPs DC were baptized at the local 'correct' church. There was no reason for him to think he was anything other than BAND 4

-------
October 2014

Admissions Policy

5-11 No 30

The school has an agreed admission number of 30 pupils for entry into Reception. If no more than 30 applications are received, all applicants will be offered places.

The governing body will admit children who have a statement of special educational needs in whose statement the school is named.

If the school is oversubscribed, after the admission of pupils with a statement of special educational needs where the school is named in the statement, priority for admission will be given to those children who meet the criteria set out below, in the order shown.

Admission Criteria

1. Looked after children and previously looked after children, but ceased to be so because they were adopted (or became subject to a residence order or special guardianship order)

1. Children with exceptional medical and social needs that can be best met at St Saviour. (Must be supported by professional evidence stating why St Saviours is the most suitable school)

1. Children who have an older brother or sister attending school at the time of their admission. (Older brothers and sisters (siblings) include step, or half-brother/sister, foster and adopted brother/sister living at the same address)

1. Children who are baptised who live within the parish of Stoneclough (Evidence of baptism must be provided by a member of the clergy or other designated church officer).

1. Baptised children whose parent(s) or guardian(s) worship at either St Saviour Ringley or Holy Trinity Stoneclough.

1. Baptised children whose parent(s) or guardian(s) worship at a church in membership of Churches Together in Britain and Ireland or those that are associated with the UK Interfaith Network.

1. All other children

Notes:

Priority in all categories will be determined on the basis of proximity to the school from the child’s home address, measured in a straight line on a map.

The faith criteria for worship will only be satisfied by a minimum of 12 weeks attendance at church at public worship for at least a year prior to 1st September in the year before admission to the school. Evidence must be provided by a member of the clergy or other designated officer.

Yes but the op didn't provide any evidence of baptism with the application so he would not have been regarded as band four even if the old rules were still in place. He thought the council would get the information from the church and there wasn't a way of attaching it to the online application anyway.

I do feel very sorry for the op. Putting incorrect admission info on the school website is really not acceptable. A lot of parents will have relied on that.

I really feel for you OP!

It is such a stressful situation to be in. But your son being a summer born, I would defer entry until September 2017 IF it is impossible for you both to maintain your working commitments and the education of your son. So much for the government helping parents get back into the workplace when 'we' are faced with issues like this!!!

Or

Look at schools nearest where either of you work and drop off on the way?

When I was picking my child' three choices I put catchment school as 1st, another school in a different town as 2nd because CM drops off there as well as 1st choice and the 3rd was a school on the way to DH's workplace and had a breakfast and after school club for that very reason if DS wasn't accepted at 1st and 2nd, it wouldn't affect our work. If DS DIDN'T get into either 3 schools, the only option would be would be to find a school close or on the route to either of our workplaces and a CM who could drop off and pick up OR breakfast and after school clubs.

It is silly that children cannot get into catchment schools. I wouldn't want my child going to a school miles away and not being able to form relationships with other children he lives close by too.

I would start by checking how many people got in under your allocated category, and, assuming there were some who did, check that the person who worked out walking distance was aware of the footbridge.