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Original poster

Level 3 sats targets in year 2 - why haven't the school told us?Why do some schools hold back able kids?

122 replies

earlycomputers · 09/11/2010 11:32

My dd is in year 2 and at a recent parents evening her class teacher gave me a list of the year 2 attainment levels for maths. There was no mention of sats or anything. I then discovered she has sats in May and so looked at what she needs to know for these tests. I am truly shocked at how little she has been taught so far just to get through the level 2 tests. She is a bright girl and she could easily be taking the level 3 tests but she hasn't been taught anything for the level 3 standard and very little for level 2 - both in English and maths. For example she's never covered division in maths or the digital clock or fractions. She's barely covered any joined up writing or using punctuation. Is this a cop out for the schools so they dont have to work as hard (ie it's less work to teach level 1 and 2 than it is 3?) Dont they have a duty to try and extend able pupils? Needless to say I have been introducing her at home to the stuff she needs to know (taking her out of school to do so so she doesn't have to do stuff in the evenings).
They wont even allow her to read harder books even though we have proved she can read to a certain level with almost 100% accuracy and comprension. Why do some teachers do this? I am seriously thinking about moving her out of the state schooling system. sorry for the long rant!

OP posts:
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QueenGigantaurofMnet · 09/11/2010 16:53

I just hope that the local LEA take her to court for the poor atendance of her child.

let her stand in front of a judge and explain that she broke the law because the outstanding school her DD goes to isn't good enough as it is only teaching her.

you are bonkers dear

piscesmoon · 09/11/2010 16:57

I feel so sorry for the poor little thing!
If she is reading well go to the library, let her pick her own books. Reading for enjoyment is the best thing for her, there is no point in decoding if you don't want to read for pleasure. Play games, like chess in the evening, let her help you cook the evening meal- make it all fun.
If you have serious issues go into school and discuss them and :
a, get the school to address your concerns
b, change schools
c, Home Educate

but don't do what you are doing-it is very damaging for her.

mrz · 09/11/2010 16:57

My first thought is that the targets given out on parent's evening are for a term (or perhaps even half a term) certainly not for the whole of year 2 so perhaps the OP has completely misunderstood the situation.

I would also echo what Feenie said that SAT tests can take place at any point in the year not necessarily at the end and could possibly have already been completed and used by the class teacher to set targets for the term.

Finally I can't see any advantage to be gained keeping a child off school one day a week unless you know exactly what has been taught every minute of everyday.

piscesmoon · 09/11/2010 16:58

Schools do not hold back bright DCs-why would they?

lovecheese · 09/11/2010 16:58

Good post piscesmoon.

piscesmoon · 09/11/2010 17:04

Thanks lovecheese!
I think that OP will find that the brightest DCs are not 'hothoused' they have lots of interests, go to Rainbows, dance, run around outside, play and co operate with friends, dress up and use their imagination, act out little plays,cut up cardboard boxes and make things, learn to knit, write stories etc.
OP's DD could do with benign neglect-allowed to get bored and follow her own inclinations. What she doesn't need at 6 yrs old is a mother who thinks she needs a higher lever SATs result-education isn't a race- and if it were 'slow and steady' often wins!

piscesmoon · 09/11/2010 17:08

If you start doing division and fractions before she has a very solid base she will get completely muddled-I have just taught yr 6s on a one to one basis where they had all sorts of misconceptions e.g. not knowing that halving was dividing by 2.

Simbacatlives · 09/11/2010 17:13

Why do so many parents feel that because they went to school they have the expertise required to make them education experts.

I went to the doctors as I child- do I feel that I can now tell the doctor how to diagnose me? No.

The extent of ignorance and arrogance displayed in the opening post must surely indicate that it is a wind up.

If not maybe they like to pop round and do open heart surgery in my dining room later as I am sure they know best about that bas well.

NoahAndTheWhale · 09/11/2010 17:16

DS is in year 2 and pretty good at maths. At parents evening his teacher said he is likely to get high level 2 or level 3 in maths.

He hasn't done the things you mention in your OP but I know he is learning a lot at school and that he is learning appropriately for his needs.

I think you are going about this in a somewhat misguided way tbh

Byblyofyle · 09/11/2010 17:19

Are you sure she's "bored" and "being held back"? It sounds like you're having a bit of a panic.
Speak to the school about your concerns, but judging by the messages above, you might come across as a bit over anxious. If you're finding SATS so stress-inducing, you're going to explode by the time you get to GCSEs!

ShrinkingViolet · 09/11/2010 17:28

and SATs results are nothing to do with how bright or otherwise a DC is - they're all to do with how well the school is teaching them the things they are being tested on. DD3 is in top sets for everything (apart from spelling which is wayward in need of some improvement) despite not having done SATS in Year 2. Her teachers have been perfectly able to teach her without having a SATS level.

DD1 used the KS3 SATS to work out how well she could do in a formal exam without any revision whatsoever, in preparation for GCSEs. (I didn't have the courage to tell her teachers that was what she was doing Wink).

FreudianSlimmery · 09/11/2010 17:52

I'm so confused. I don't understand the OP really.

Firstly why care about SATs? They do not benefit children, quite opposite IMO but that's another thread altogether.

Can you write down exactly what your concerns are and why? (ie in a clearer way than in the OP as it was a bit jumbled)

I don't really get what you're doing taking her out of school, do you pretend she's ill?

I think if she's really flourishing on her days off you should just homeschool her, if you have such negative views of her school then she will really suffer.

piscesmoon · 09/11/2010 19:05

It would be interesting if OP came back and explained what she thinks division, digital time and fractions consist of at level 3. I think that she has a list and is in a panic-it sounds to me as if she is trying to cover the sort of thing that they need in the Yr6 SATs.

stoatsrevenge · 09/11/2010 19:08

No-one's taking any notice of you Feenie. Grin

Dare you to tell them again.

Feenie · 09/11/2010 19:10

Grin Am used to it. It's around about now that I give up!

FreudianSlimmery · 09/11/2010 19:11

I'm confused, why isn't this thread on the g and t board.

mrz · 09/11/2010 19:16

Should I do my SAT tests next week and get them out the way?
What do you think?
I've not taught my Y2 class digital clocks yetHmm

SoupDragon · 09/11/2010 19:17

I cant believe people get so het up about KS1 SATS!

FGS, she's 6! Let her enjoy life and learning without picking up on your stress. you are giving her the message that school is not important and that you know better than the fully qualified teacher

Feenie · 09/11/2010 19:22

Grin @ mrz!

spanieleyes · 09/11/2010 19:25

If the OP is expecting her child to have covered all the end-of-year objectives by November, what would she be expecting them to do for the rest of the school year?

MrsVincentPrice · 09/11/2010 19:37

I do hope the OP isn't trying to teach her DD punctuation.

cat64 · 09/11/2010 21:02

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn

Cortina · 09/11/2010 23:54

Agree with what everyone has said the advice given to OP.

A few of my concerns about KS1 SATS - not sure if these may be any reason why the OP is worried though:

Used to set next year and our sets have a history of not being terribly mobile

Biased against the youngest in the class

Used to predict what a child should achieve in Y3 at KS2 etc (fine if used to flag any worrying signs that a child is possibly not achieving potential though)

Used as evidence in 11 plus appeals (for example, if a child fails by a narrow margin academic history may be tracked as far back as KS1)

There is a feeling that an average or below average result, even at this early stage, indicates a child isn't suitable for Grammar school. That they are not going to be 'Grammar school material' if you like. This can lead to negative labeling and negative self fulfilling prophecy going forward. It may be the case that Grammar school is not the best place for this child and not a place where they would thrive but I would argue 6/7 is far too early to tell. This view isn't helped by some teachers telling me they can gauge a child's ultimate academic potential whilst they are still in reception.

These are my personal concerns which I hope are sincerely unfounded. I wonder if these concerns are heightened by those of us who may be considering a Grammar school going forward?

FreudianSlimmery · 10/11/2010 07:08

Op not been back yet?

gorionine · 10/11/2010 07:40

earlycomputers, I see where you are coming from and am surprised that people do not seem to think more able children need more challenging work. The last ofsted the school my Dcs go to picked up exactly on that: not challenging enough for more able children so it is a concern in some schools and you are absolutely right to raise it.