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Pregnancy

Talk about every stage of pregnancy, from early symptoms to preparing for birth.

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Original poster

Having a girl will divide us

476 replies

CrunchyCrump · 15/01/2022 06:52

I realise this is going to polarise a lot of people and I’m not sure what I’m looking for by posting, everything feels pretty dark at the moment so reaching out perhaps.

I’m expecting a DD in Spring after a DS. Because of my husbands religion, which I don’t share, she isn’t going to have the same freedoms in her choices that I’ve had. Having to marry into the religion for instance or conforming to religious dress.

Yes this was a discussion before we even married, but I’m now struggling with the lived version of an abstract thought. There’s no wiggle room either, if she doesn’t follow her father beliefs he will be punished for it.

I’ve spoken to DH, he does understand to an extent but when I ask for compromise he can’t meet me halfway on this because it’s so clear in his religion.

I’m so sad, it feels like this baby will cause us to separate and I don’t want that but at the same time I don’t know how I can accept a future where she doesn’t have a choice.

It’s my fault completely I accept that, I feel like I’ve screwed all of our lives up but I just can’t see a way forward.

OP posts:
LactoseTheIntolerant · 15/01/2022 09:10

@CrunchyCrump

I’ve seen this is now trending which is what I didn’t want given how biased and uninformed many peoples views are.

Thank you so much to those of you have given me links for further research. I do need to learn more, we all do. I’m incredibly grateful for those of you who’ve had similar experiences and for sharing them. I’ll leave the thread now, many thanks again.

Why do you think it is 'biased and uniformed' to want equal rights for women!!
Ploppy1322 · 15/01/2022 09:11

Ah hon I feel for you, you signed up to this without fully understanding what you were signing up to, that's not your fault. How you handle this is. The only person your baby daughter is going to have in her life to advocate for her, be her champion and make sure she has every opportunity in life, is you. If your husband and his community want to stop you from doing the above, it's hard but you know what you have to do, good luck xxx

RussianSpy101 · 15/01/2022 09:11

@Ploppy1322 she said she knew before she got pregnant.

Policyschmolicy · 15/01/2022 09:11

Yeah, I wouldn’t be able to cope with this misogynistic bullshit. It would be a dealbreaker for me. As a parent his role is to protect and nurture, not force her into some archaic rules laid out in an ancient text.

hoomae · 15/01/2022 09:13

I would leave.
Easier said than done, but if he is not willing to budge on this then I don't see how you could stay with him.

When you say your husband would be punished if he didn't do what his religion expects, what does that mean exactly?

I would expect my partner to understand my beliefs also. Why is it that he gets to make the full decision and not take your beliefs in to account?

If he loved his Daughter enough, he would do what is right by her.

Original poster
CrunchyCrump · 15/01/2022 09:13

@YouWereGr8InLittleMenstruators thank you for sharing your experiences, I’m in a similar situation but I can the older children and it’s similar to how you’ve said. I think being pregnancy isn’t helping me at the moment and I’m catastrophising unnecessarily

OP posts:
Policyschmolicy · 15/01/2022 09:13

And to clarify, I don’t think Islam is necessarily inherently misogynistic; but some of the cultural overlays and expectations are. They are also not the only way one can adhere to a Muslim faith.

SocialConnection · 15/01/2022 09:14

Excuses. He's using religion as a front for his own attitude to women. This won't change, and her childhood and adolescence are going to be very different from yours. There will be conflict for this British born child, with a mother who lived the life she'll be denied by her father. Unless you feel strong enough to hold to and keep up your position and battle to provide the same freedoms you enjoyed. Do you have a network of friends in your position?

Turtletotem · 15/01/2022 09:14

You've had some good advice and I'm sorry if it's already been said but you also need to think about later down the line, what happens if either of your children are gay? Also possibly not recognised/illegal in the religion...

Frostine · 15/01/2022 09:14

Ignore my first post. I see you now say which religion .

Fraternaltwin · 15/01/2022 09:15

I totally agree with you.

I wonder whether you knew this would be the case OP when you married this man and had your first child with him. I suppose really I’m wondering if this is what you expected.

Has he misled you into thinking his interpretation of the religion was more relaxed than it actually is. Your poor little daughter, not even born yet and already being marginalised. It’s tragic.

I hope you’re safe and have people in real life that you can talk to.

Riapia · 15/01/2022 09:16

So, because god doesn’t appear before us.
He sends men to convey his messages.

What could possibly go wrong.

3scape · 15/01/2022 09:16

Imposing a religion is abuse. If the religion has any merit or value it doesn't require threats and punishment to follow. You need to leave this person who has made threats to your unborn daughter.

WorriedGiraffe · 15/01/2022 09:17

[quote CrunchyCrump]@YouWereGr8InLittleMenstruators thank you for sharing your experiences, I’m in a similar situation but I can the older children and it’s similar to how you’ve said. I think being pregnancy isn’t helping me at the moment and I’m catastrophising unnecessarily[/quote]
It’s not unnecessary, you are forcing your unborn daughter to live a life without choice of who she marries for fear of her father going to hell, or being cast out by her family. You are right to be trying to work at this issue right now with your husband rather than letting her be forced into things that you don’t agree with. I’m glad you are trying to find a way to make your husband understand he can make another choice for his daughter, I hope you can make him understand OP

WorriedGiraffe · 15/01/2022 09:18

@Fraternaltwin

I totally agree with you.

I wonder whether you knew this would be the case OP when you married this man and had your first child with him. I suppose really I’m wondering if this is what you expected.

Has he misled you into thinking his interpretation of the religion was more relaxed than it actually is. Your poor little daughter, not even born yet and already being marginalised. It’s tragic.

I hope you’re safe and have people in real life that you can talk to.

She said in her OP that they discussed it before they married, it was an informed choice, it’s only now the baby is real that she’s concerned.
CayrolBaaaskin · 15/01/2022 09:18

I think you can bring up a daughter or a son to think for themselves have good moral values and ultimately they will choose to follow religion or not themselves.

My family have some within it who are very religious Jews which is restrictive for women. But there are many wonderful things about Judaism as well and many Jews who dont live an orthodox lifestyle but are still Jews (me for example).

Equally many women all over the world are Muslim but choose not to cover their hair etc. Probably the vast majority of Muslim women choose that in fact. Your daughter will ultimately choose how religious she wants to be herself and you can only guide her the best you can.

Best of luck op. I gain a lot of strength from my religion but don’t feel the need to follow the more draconian parts. When I was living a more orthodox life, I was part of an orthodox feminist group.

I am sure given how many Muslim women there are in the world there will be Muslim feminists too of all kinds. If you’ve agreed to bring your daughter up as a Muslim I think you must develop your own understanding and appreciation of the religion.

Hoppinggreen · 15/01/2022 09:20

[quote CrunchyCrump]@BurntToastAgain it’s not cultural when it’s explicitly stated in their text that women should cover their hair. Not sure how that can be misinterpreted?[/quote]
I am sure you know far more about this religion than me BUT if it IS Islam my understanding from Muslim friends is that the Quran says that everyone should dress modestly - and many Muslims interpret that to mean not being too ostentatious or similar.
Like all religions and religious tests it’s usually the (men’s) interpretation of the religion and/or texts that oppressed women rather than the actual tenets of it
Anyway OP if you really do believe that staying with your DH means your daughter will be oppressed then you have to leave him

LittleMG · 15/01/2022 09:22

If you leave him she won’t have to conform? So why don’t you threaten that, then surely he can meet you half way? Say it’s half way or nothing.

Darbs76 · 15/01/2022 09:24

My children father is a Muslim but I am not and so our children don’t follow any of the religious teachings of any faith. I certainly wouldn’t allow my daughter to be oppressed, I’d leave

StoatMilk · 15/01/2022 09:25

@girlmom21

I'd leave. Your daughter is going to live an oppressed life. Your husband could choose to step back and give her more freedoms but he's using his religion as an excuse. You should have an equal say in her upbringing.
This

Religions ‘punishing’ bloody hell Hmm

saraclara · 15/01/2022 09:25

[quote CrunchyCrump]@BurntToastAgain it’s not cultural when it’s explicitly stated in their text that women should cover their hair. Not sure how that can be misinterpreted?[/quote]
Again, not all Muslim women (assuming you're taking about Islam) cover their hair. I worked with Muslim colleagues who were devout in other ways but who did not cover their hair.
Unless you live in Iran, there is room for manoeuvre in that.

What the religion is, where you live, and whether your DH is particularly fundamentalist in his interpretation are important points here. Religion and culture are highly intertwined.

Lemonlettuce · 15/01/2022 09:31

You’re welcome OP. I do hope things work out for you and your children. I’ve seen it too often where and it’s almost always men, push and push the parts of the religion that suit them and conveniently choose to turn a blind eye to the areas that don’t suit them. I have two young sons and the understanding I have of my faith is that they also need to know how to dress modestly and appropriately. This is a principle which exists for both sexes not just females. Unfortunately you only ever hear one side of the story.

Please talk to your husband and make things clear before baby comes. Enjoy the rest of your pregnancy.

surreymum89 · 15/01/2022 09:31

@CrunchyCrump My OH is a Muslim from a very religious family, is your husband a practising Muslim ?

Once upon a time my OH would have had set ideas about how his children were raised and how religion would have played a part in this , but in reality he chose me and chose a different way of life to the one he grew up in and he knew this really, once our children were born and were actual humans with feelings he could see and raise it became clear I think that he could actually do things differently , our eldest is a teenage girl.

RobotValkyrie · 15/01/2022 09:33

Don't be gaslighted (gaslit?), OP. This isn't about religion (which for some reason, we are still brought up to "respect", no matter how vile their teachings might be)
This is about your controlling husband and his dysfunctional family.

Leave while you still can, and take your children with you.

FrancescaContini · 15/01/2022 09:33

I’ve only read the OP but obviously you have to leave him.