Gender disappointment

[HanB7]

I know this is going to sound awful but would really appreciate other people’s opinions. I have wanted a baby for as long as I can remember. My partner and I weren’t trying but knew I couldn’t get pregnant. We decided to see a fertility specialist where I was told I didn’t ovulate. I was put on tablets which she said could take between a year-2years to work. Great lots of time to move and sort out any money problems. I became pregnant on the first go. I felt shocked but extremely lucky. My partner already has a 7yo Daughter and was adamant he didn’t want a boy. It never bothered me But after his constant talking of wanting a girl it made me want one. I felt like I was having a girl. Looked at nothing but girls clothes and names. So when I was told yesterday that it was a boy I felt devastated. I was sure it was a girl so being told it wasn’t felt as if someone had taking a baby from me that I didn’t even have. I felt like I had let my partner down as he told me
He was disappointed and wanted nothing to do with naming the baby buying clothes etc. I assured him
He would love it and his disappointment would soon fade which he agreed with. I felt selfish for being upset as so many people can’t have children and would do anything hing for any baby. He’s healthy and a little wriggler. I look at boys clothes and names and become instantly saddened by all the girl things i’ll Never have. I don’t know what to do with a boy and can find no names I even slightly like. I’m worried I won’t be a good mum because of how I feel even with people telling me as soon as he arrives all of those feelings will disappear which I do believe. Has anyone else gone through this and how did it feel after he/she was born? Would really appreciate any advice.

And who exactly said the two situations can be compared? My exact words were - "The two things are obviously not comparable"...

vile

get a doll to dress up

you don't deserve a son

Let me explain quite clearly and succinctly how real gender disappointment is.

This isn't some bratty ohhhhhh I want a girl, stamp my feet. This isn't a lack of gratitude for not having a healthy baby.

This is a crushing, beyond devastating feeling that you will not love your child, over their gender. It is a mental health issue. It is very real. I had it, and I would not wish it on my worst enemy.

To most of you, you will have looked at DC and felt instant love. I didn't want to look at him. I acted like the new mum idolising her newborn. But inside I wept and screamed for my daughter that this imposter had taken the place of. You can't even imagine how that feels. Unless you've had this illness yourself.

And what makes it even fucking harder is the comments from half the posters on here.

You don't understand how disgusted you are in yourself. You know you're being hideously irrational, but it doesn't stop the feelings.

It took me a few years to accept I had a DS. Not that he's any the wiser. I forced a bond, blindly stumbling along on the "fake it til you make it" road. We have a brilliant relationship, and honestly I wonder how, when I had this illness, he must be truly an exceptional boy. I love him, but there are days when I wobble, even now.

Just don't make out that it's ungrateful or spoilt or entitled if someone ever admits gender disappointment. The worst is from those who are having difficulty conceiving, how dare you feel that way, do you know how lucky you are? Of course I feel for people in that situation, but does it mean that the illness I had should be not spoken of, or is any less serious?

There are of course different severities of this illness. Mine was very severe. But the comments on here, show just how little people understand about this at all.

It's not post natal depression. It's a separate, and treatable illness. And it's fucking awful.

If anyone feels this way, and that they have no one to talk to, please pm me. You are not alone, and you are not a bad mother.

An “illness” in its own right? Really?

Gender disappointment is not a mental illness, it wasn't last time I checked the DSM IV anyway and yes, I am a qualified Psychologist.

Whilst the feelings that accompany it are real, it doesn't mean it's justified. I haven't experienced it, so no, I don't know what it feels like.

Posters that refer to trying to conceive difficulties or multiples miscarriages like me with my 5 are trying to give some perspective on the issue. You'll notice how hardly anybody ever days "you should just be grateful to have kids" to people suffering with post natural depression, because that is a real illness.

We're an entitled generation and it now extends to even feeling disappointment when the child we've conceived isn't the right sex.
Nothing at all wrong with a preference, but to feel so hard done by and to feel disappointed is extreme. A little time needed to get over it would be expected, but the partner involved here wanting nothing to do with naming the child etc is beyond reason.

@GeorgieTheGorgeousGoat funnily enough I felt like this, exactly like this after I found out I was having dd.
I had a 2 yo ds and was desperate for another son and just didn't know what to do with a girl.
It was ridiculous and the moment she was born it became a random silly feeling of the past. She's my world. But it can work both ways.

And can I also point out (not defending ops husband but for op) not everything you feel when you are pregnant is in any way rational, logical or even in your control sometimes. Sometimes it just takes over

Yes it's an illness. And people on this post with no clue are what's wrong with society.

If I were to sit in front of a mirror with depression, (which it's now OK to talk about, this has come on leaps and bounds in the last ten years) it would go something like this :

Person :"what the fuck is wrong with me? I think I have depression"
Society: "let us help you, it's OK to feel this way, you wouldn't expect no help with a broken leg, it's OK to need help for your mental health, it's more common than you think, try this, how can we make things better"

But the reaction you get with gender disappointment :

Person : "what the fuck is wrong with me? I think I have gender disappointment"
Society : "what the fuck is wrong with you?! You vile excuse of a person, you shouldn't have kids, call yourself a mother, it's unnatural, it's a disgrace, how dare you feel that way when I can't even have a child, disgusting entitled inconsiderate human being"

Women try to play it down because of the disgusting responses they get if they even suggest they are suffering with gender disappointment.

People are so fucking clueless and entitled, thinking they can call people those names, when they have no idea how they are suffering internally. Belittling and intimidating people into suffering in silence. Shame on you.

Yes it's a real illness. I'm happy to answer any further questions anyone has, on here, or privately given the abuse they are likely to get if they admit they are suffering.

To the psychologist, please don't ever make the mistake of thinking its not a real illness again or say such horrible things to try and indicate its not. And it's very dangerous to make those statements under the umbrella of being a mental health professional when you are categorically wrong. Phone your GP. You'll see.

Courtney555 has it right.

Gender disappointment can be a truly terrible thing to suffer from and can require psychiatric treatment.

I'm not going to bicker about whether it's "in the DSM IV" as some specially categorised special "mental illness" under that exact name. I only speak as someone who suffered from it and received psychiatric treatment for it from the NHS, for which I will always be truly thankful.

The roots of this may lie very deep and it is agonising to feel that you cannot love your baby as you know (with your rational mind) that they deserve.

It doesn't help that there is STILL such a massive taboo which prevents people speaking out - for fear of the kind of vicious reaction there's been on this thread. Other mental health issues have become more publicly acknowledged recently. Not this one. We are still stuck in the dark on our own, feeling like the only person in the world who has ever been overwhelmed by these irrational feelings beyond our control, and knowing that if we tell anyone we will be vilified and hated.

Sometimes I wonder how many people just commit suicide rather than ever seeking help. Because you feel like you are a worthless human being and your baby would be better off without you, and that's what you would get told by other people, too, if you admitted it. Like on this thread.

Bravo

No proper psychologist would say feelings are not justified.
Total bullshit, either that or you need a new profession.
Who the hell are you to say pnd is rwal and this isnt?

So are we assuming that the OP’s DH is suffering from a phscological illness?

And that the OP is too?

Struggling to see the difference between the illness described above and PND....surely if you struggle to bond with your baby when born thats PND....gender disappoint as I was understanding is a fleeting emotion that goes once your baby arrives.

I'd prefer a boy, then sulking for a couple of days is not gender disappointment. It's a preference, that you're temporarily sad that luck didn't fall on "your" side over. And you get over it.

Which you're entitled too. Some people "don't care as long as it's healthy", some people will admit they'd prefer one sex over the other. This again, is not serious, life ruining gender disappointment.

Can a man get it? I'm not sure, is my honest answer. There's no reason why a man wouldn't be capable of the same feelings, so I would go with yes.

But to repeat, if the genuine feeling is "ohhhhhh, I really wanted a boy" then being pissed off for the rest of the week, this is not gender disappointment.

But then it might not be the true feeling. You'll most likely never know, because no one will admit how they are suffering and that's exactly because of the arseholes that this thread represents.

SoyDora This may or may not be a mental health issue. From the extreme reaction of the OP's partner, it sounds very possible to me. Plus he already has a DD - so it's not as if he's just got some dream of one day having a DD, or wants to 'complete the set' after having a son. This doesn't sound like the common, mild, vague, harmless preference which many prospective parents feel and then forget about. (The OP's own feelings seem to fall more into that category.) His reaction sounds quite irrational and I genuinely think he could benefit from seeking help.

We obviously don't have enough information to decide for sure either way, but I'm amazed - given the behaviour described - by the number of posters who seem to be assuming that he can't be experiencing any mental health issues, and just needs a nice outpouring of hate to put him right.

@onlyfools

I did not have PND. I had gender disappointment.

And it must certainly is not "a fleeting emotion that goes once your baby arrives"

A handful of mothers are fortunate enough that when the baby arrives, they lose the gender disappointment feelings, this means they had a very mild case so to speak. They are the tiny minority, not the rule.

As I, and the poster above have explained, it is a very serious illness, that continues long after the child is born. Years in my case, thanks to absolute cunts stopping me getting the help I needed, by making me feel like scum of the earth for opening up to them. It is also an illness, that, thank God, is treatable.

You didn't know, but now you do. And if any of your friends suggest that they might be suffering with the same (and all they are likely to every be brave enough to offer, is a tiny hint) then take them seriously. Help them.

Courtney555 no need to be so aggressive, Im actually trying to understand the difference. Im not belittling people that struggle to bond with their baby, I would just think therefore that gender disappointment then is a form on PND or leads of PND to put it another way.

Well the Labour Party recognises gender selection as an evil (often chosen because of fear of gender disappointment). It is not an illness. It is foot stamping by those who are used to getting their own way.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-45497454

It's so hard to explain. You kind of categorise yourself as not bonding with your DC, but I think from my personal experience, you feel that it is not your DC.

It didn't feel like he'd taken away the daughter I never had, I wasn't grieving or mourning a non existing child, more just like it was just impossible.

The nearest thing I can assimilate it too, would be suddenly discovering, in three months I was to become a lesbian. I'm not. I've got absolutely no issues with lesbians. But I'm not one. And you then have a count down to this day where bang, I'm a lesbian. And you'd better start acting like one. And the whole world is telling you, yes, you are, but it's just impossible to you. And if you try and tell anyone you're not, they act in outrage. Tell you you're confused.

Now I know that's a bit of a mess of an example for a hundred reasons, but that's the level of wrong it feels inside.

It's just so hard to explain when 99% of people find it incomprehensible that anyone could feel that way. It's not a choice, it's not something you can control.

As the other poster said, we are so in the darks ages with this area.

@mrsmuddlepies

I don't even know where to start with such an offensive post.

If you can't see the difference between this illness and people aborting their child because it's not the preferred sex, then I truly, truly feel sadness for you.

If you actually can not see the difference, I'm happy to take the time to educate you.

Gender disappointment does not mean you want to harm or kill your baby, born or unborn. It is more likely, as the previous poster said, the the parent would take their own life. You can often feel quite fiercely over protective over the child, because you feel you are failing as a mother, so you will not fail in the basics of making sure they are safe, healthy, you almost over compensate trying to give them the best.

Gender disappointment, you are very aware that it is of no fault of the child. You have a startling level of awareness in that respect. You are just very aware that there's something very wrong with you. It is a recognised and treatable illness.

Genuinely, why would you put yourself through the (more than 50%) possibility of having a boy if it’s such an abhorrent thought to you?

If you know you have such a strong preference for a particular sex then shouldn’t you think about that before you get pregnant?

Mrsmuddles
Youre vile-what a nasty post.
Suggest you educate yourself on antenatal depression which can influence gender disappointment. Often issues are very buried, for instance past abuse.
People dont always consciously realise this before pregnancy.
God what nasty judgemental people come on mn these days. Disgusting.

@georgie

That's a good question. I certainly didn't know that I'd feel that way when I found out at my 6 mth scan I was having a DS.

If I knew, pre pregnancy that this was how it was going to be for me, would I have got pregnant. Yes. But only because now I know it's a curable illness. I'm OK now.

My response to that question up until he was 4, and I'd been ostracised by anyone I tried to open up to, and thought, this is how it's going to be for the rest of my life, then my answer then would have been no. That's how bad it is.

It's also half the reason I don't have any more. Now the reason I don't is because I would personally find the age gap with DS not right for our family dynamic. But for years, he didn't have a sibling because I was terrified that the arrival of a DD might be hugely favoured, and make DS feel worthless. I was terrified that another DS, if I didn't get ill again, I would forever beat myself up about whether DS1 would notice any way that I had treated him differently. It's a special kind of self loathing guilt you feel when your DS is begging you for a sibling, and you can't risk giving him one incase this fucking illness rears its head again and ruins everyones life.

Georgie - in my case (though it was having a girl that terrified me, not a boy) because I had no idea I would feel that way. It hit me very suddenly the moment they did the scan and told me it looked like a girl.

I have asked myself why it never hit me before then - obviously I knew that there was a 50% chance of each! - and I have absolutely no clue. I assume that somehow I must have been unconsciously convinced that I was having a boy, but why?!

Anyway, out of nowhere this irrational horror began and I could not get out of the room without crying. I felt terribly guilty because the people in the waiting room must have thought the scan detected some abnormality, and yet I was behaving like this over a perfectly healthy baby. I went to a cafe and cried and cried. My poor husband did not know what to do with me.