How to broach the subject of childcare with MIL?

[ElleDubloo]

I have a brilliant MIL who I get on with swimmingly. She's delighted I'm pregnant and really excited about having her first grandchild. We live 25 mins away from her (we're actually currently living at her house, because we're having work done to our bathroom). We might move in with her more permanently when I'm due, to have her help with the baby in the early days.

I'd like to broach the subject of childcare, but I'm not sure how to do it sensitively, and without looking like I'm taking advantage of her. TBH, I'd like to take 6 months maternity leave and then return to work full-time, and it would be amazing if she would volunteer to take on all the childcare after that. It's a big ask. She has a part-time job as a teacher, which she has hinted that she doesn't enjoy very much.

Is it reasonable for me to ask her whether she'd like to quit her job so that I can go back to work?
How should we recompense her for the loss of earnings? Could we offer to pay her (because we'd rather pay her than pay a childminder we don't know) but would she take offense?

Would be great to get everyone's thoughts on this :)

"We're" not pregnant. You are pregnant.

Why will you give uo your career to care for elderly family but not young family? Will you really?

Jesus. Massive presumption. Don't do it. She may well ask.

If you are a junior doctor and a corporate lawyer, both working full-time in the sort of hours and patterns expected in those careers, then you'd probably need more than one full-time nanny post's equivalent hours, and (as you said) you'll need to cover some overnights and (as you didn't say) some weekends.

I really think if you would like your MIL to take on some childcare, and she'd also like to take on some childcare, then expecting her to do all of that expecting any one person to do all of that is unreasonable. Given that it's not about the money for you, it might be worth exploring doing a fixed set of core hours with a nursery/nanny/childminder and seeing if your MIL could do wraparound care including the overnights and weekends that you need, or doing some days with a nursery/nanny/childminder and others with your MIL.

I do agree though that you should wait for her to offer. If it's so standard in your culture then surely she's likely to offer, if it's something she really wants to do?

And you really aren't coming across well on here. If people aren't reacting well to the idea of your asking your MIL to quit her part-time job (with NI, pension and employment rights) to take on a more-than-full-time job, including night shifts and 24-hour on-call, that you're not really planning to pay her market rate for (or, I'm guessing, pension contributions or PAYE or employer's NI) then it isn't necessarily because they don't appreciate your career, or they don't like having children, or because the whole national culture is at fault.

I am a SAHM currently on maternity leave, and goodness this is so much harder than full time work! I would never ever expect my mother or MIL to offer to look after my child, and they haven't either.

I think the issue here is you haven't had a child before, so you don't understand how demanding it is! Once you have it, you probably will and will lower your expectations from others.

Btw I am also from a culture where loads of mothers and mother inlaws look after babies for free.

You are in your mid 20s so in your mid 40s if your child/ren have children of their own will you then agree to leave work to look after your grandchildren ? The career that you now think is so important that you can't possibly have a break from it to raise your own child?

Also I adore babies in general, absolutely love them, but no way do I want to look after them full time.

My husband also assumed his mother would look after our baby (as that is what is done culturally) but she hasn't even offered - because it is bloody hard work, and of course I don't blame here!

My mum offered to have ds full time (well, 4 long days) when I was pg - she was newly retired. My reservations, although I adore her were:

What would we do if mum was ill / on holiday / had a doctors or hair appointment?

I didnt want mum to take on the parent role

Would ds get enough interaction with other children?

Would it simply be too much for her?

In the end mum does 1 day, dmil does a day and ds goes to nursery 2 days. Mum loves having ds and it's a massive treat for her. BUT she is shattered at pick up time and admits she'd have struggled to regularly do more than one day

There's a joke that grandchildren are better than children because you can hand them back; it's true.

You don't say how old your MIL is but please consider that leaving her job now could have serious implications for her pension. You would also be asking her to leave part-time employment to switch to full-time, when presumably she has interests / activities / tasks that she does in her non-working time?

Please seriously investigate other childcare options. I don't know where you live but here (a 'nappy-valley' area of London) the competition is fierce for the best nurseries. A friend put her child down for one at her 12-week scan and still hasn't got a place for when he turns one. Perhaps the ideal scenario would be for baby to be with granny a few days, and then in nursery for the rest, if she offers.

I think it's very unfair to expect MiL to give up work for your baby when you your self don't want to!

You cannot ask her, it is up to her to offer. Having her as back up/fill in for nights and weekends childcare would still be incredibly useful.
I have wanted to be a sahm Mum since I was a child and I am really lucky enough to live my dream and my husband has supported me in this. I do love it however it is such a hard job, I honestly don't think you will realise how hard it is until you do it. At 6 months to be honest they are immobile and IMO they are very easy. However our ds is now 20 months and is constantly

I never understand why any GP would agree to regular childcare of a young baby let alone full time. It would change the dynamics of your relationship surely?
Maybe I'm just bitter because no-one was ever prepared to have my DC on a regular basis and still aren't, although I won't ever feel as though I have anything to "repay" as my DM and IL's get older.

Looking after a baby / toddler is tough. it is hard physical work. There is a lot of heavy lifting, twisting, bending, etc and it is hard labour. I understand that in your 20s (and not having had to do it yet!) this may not seem like a big deal to you, but actually it is, especially for an older person.

My mum loves and adores looking after my toddler DS, and before she retired she was a nursery school teacher. She has offered on numerous occasions to be our childcare, and has said she will register herself as a childminder with all the attendant ofsted requirements, etc. to do so. There is nothing she would enjoy more than to look after him full time.

But, and here's the thing you seem to be dismissing out of hand and getting all uppity with people when they say it, looking after a very young child full time is too physically demanding to expect someone to do when they are older. Despite the fact it was my mum's job for years, despite the fact she'd love to do it, it would wear her into the ground in about a month.

Far better to get a full time nursery place or something, and have Grandma on hand to do some pick-ups, overnights and occasional fun days out than have to give up your career a couple of decades earlier than you envisage(!) to care for MiL (and child) because you've driven her to exhaustion point with expectations of round the clock childcare...

Off topic, and I should let it go but you annoyed me so much with your snide comment about putting old people into care homes: as a health care professional you really should be aware that very few families take the heart-rending decision to hand over the care of their loved ones to professionals lightly or because they can't be bothered to care for them. It's almost always because the management of complex medical needs becomes impossible to deal with at home. I truly hope you never end up trying to care for your elderly, frail relatives who no longer recognise you and live in a world full of fear because of dementia, but please, try not to be so vile about the people who have been in that situation and have had to face up to the fact their relatives need professional care.

You asked how to broach the subject sensitively, well could you perhaps ask your MIL now if she would consider covering childcare for the odd long day or late night when you go back to work.

That way you would get a chance to see how she feels about it without her feeling any obligation. She may say that she'd love to and then might offer to give up work/provide childcare for a certain number of days per week, or she might say that she doesn't mind the odd occasion but doesn't want the responsibility all of the time. At least that way you know where you stand. That would be how I would approach it if I were you.

I don't think it's a very reasonable to ask her if she would give up work as that may make her obligated to say yes, or to do more than she actually wants to, and in time that could breed resentment and damage your relationship.

As for compensating her, if she says she'd love to help out, perhaps you could say something along the lines of "of course we're happy to pay you, we aren't expecting you to be out of pocket on our behalf". Then you can see how she responds and play it by ear.

Hope that helps.

Frumious - Based on what the OP has said about their jobs, I doubt a nursery is a realistic option anyway. She is likely to be looking at a full time nanny to cover the core of the time and then maybe, if the MIL offers, grandma for evenings and weekends if/when her husband can't do it. I actually don't see how you do it the other way round thinking about it - if the Grandma does full time child care there will be no one to pick up the random weekends when the OP is on shift and her husband gets called into the office. That kidn of childcare is shockingly difficult to get your hands on on a paid basis.

Just talk to her - you are not dissimilar to me and my dh - I am a city solicitor dh is a policeman. After a couple of years of my dm and dmil being 'emergency nan' and coming down from Manchester/ Leeds to london to help whenever the next illness/ court crisis hit - we spoke to my dm honestly and she admitted she had been waiting for the chat. We moved from our tiny central london flat to a big house outside and dm and df look after dd 2 full days a week and do nursery pick up and drop off for the other three. It works for us - more than 2 full days they found a struggle so we found a balance. I regularly check if they find it a bind and they say it is a joy.

Good point, Penguins.

Kernow, great post

Just to add it was a huge compromise on our part too - dm and df live in our house (split into two) and pay nothing to mortgage/ bills as I thought that was the fairest deal. We wouldn't have done it if they hadn't been struggling to work out finances and retirement anyway.

Anyway - just ask the worst is no and then you can plan accordingly.

Oops pressed send by accident.
At 20 months our son is constantly on the move. Much more than my friends babies (they all comment on it) He is extremely active and is incredibly confident and agile and has no fear. My husband one day turned his back for literally 5 seconds only to find him 6 foot up a ladder he had left out. He is constantly climbing and into every cupboard. He doesn't really listen to no very often and it is enough to drive you crazy and can be extremely stressful. I am 30 but I struggle to keep up with him. However we can't have any more and I am determined to enjoy every minute of our ds, I certainly couldn't do it for anyone's else's children even if they were my grandparents. Neither of our parents could keep up with our ds and on a regular basis it would be wrong too. I have seen my Mum look after my nephew (same age as my son but quieter) and by the end she was so knacked. Oh and my parents are extremely fit, they go to the gym and walk twice a day. My son is 15kg which is extremely heavy and although he is very capable of walking it is often necessary to carry him (often with him struggling as he is refusing to do what you need him to do) I never had problems with my back but now I do it must be a lot worse for an older person. They also have their own lives which would be unfair for them to stop them leading.
Lastly I think grandparents taking over childcare rather spoils the special relationship between grandparents and grandchild. They don't get to spoil them in the same way which is sad. Being a grandparent should be about spoiling them with presents, sweets and attention and then sending them home.

Aww, thanks Frumious!

We're getting ourselves tied up in knots on this thread, and people are making assumptions about me and my intentions, which I've failed to correct.

My questions were, in the original post:
a) Is it OK to ask her if she'd consider full-time child-care?

• in the context of i) I have reasons to suspect she does want to, and ii) she's perfectly capable of saying "no" if she doesn't want to, in which case we'll consider other options. We're straight-talking people. And while being extremely nice, my MIL is not a pushover by any extent of the imagination.

b) How do we have this conversation appropriately and make sure she doesn't lose out on earnings or get offended?

The precise scenario I wanted to avoid was one where my husband and I were "using" her or forcing her into an arrangement she doesn't want. This is why I got tense - because it's what many posters have been implying.

The useful things I've learnt from this thread are:

• I've underestimated the amount of hard work childcare can be for older people.
• I should wait until my MIL offers her help, instead of asking her.

And I shouldn't have made those generalisations about nursing homes. I do meet a lot of people who should love their elderly parents a lot more than they do. But it's unfair of me to say that everyone who sends their parents to a nursing home could have coped at home if they'd tried.

God, wait til the baby's here OP. I used to get on swimmingly with my MiL but have found her to be a total pain WRT childrening. So much easier to get clear boundaries and expectations with an employee. IME you can't really know what you want til the dust settles.after birth. Maybe she might b part of an overall package but that should arise.when you and the baby and she all know what the reality of her looking after your actual baby will be.

Elle - The other thing you need to think about is that you are going to need a lot of childcare at awkward hours/times. You work nights and weekends at times. Your husband is, what, about 4 years PQE if you are still in your 20s. That is a difficult combination meaning that you might reasonably frequently find yourself needing weekend or overnight care at short notice. That care is basically not available on the open market and your MIL is very, very, very unlikely to be able to offer it if she has been doing regular long days with your child already. It's hard enough to do it when you're 30. And she would, obviously, still have her own life.

So even if she does offer, think very, very carefully about how you decide to use that offer. A family member who will suddenly pick up a Saturday, or the day the nanny is ill may well be more conducive to long term career stability for both of you than daily child care.

Assuming she offers...

Wow, I'm surprised at the heated response you got!

As a side note, should your dp not do the asking?

I imagine many grandparents would love to help. My mil looked into retiring bug it wasn't an option. She brought it up though. I think your one flaw is asking her to do it full time. At some point, it's perfectly reasonable to sit down and have a chat. Don't put her on the spot, tell her to go and think but ask if she'd be able and/or willing to help with childcare when the time comes. Say you'd love to be able to leave dc with someone you love and trust but that you completely understand if she can't. Then ask her to think about what days/hours she may be able to help with!

It seems pretty reasonable to me... You don't seem like the monster you've been painted!

Wow, I'm surprised at the heated response you got!

As a side note, should your dp not do the asking?

I imagine many grandparents would love to help. My mil looked into retiring bug it wasn't an option. She brought it up though. I think your one flaw is asking her to do it full time. At some point, it's perfectly reasonable to sit down and have a chat. Don't put her on the spot, tell her to go and think but ask if she'd be able and/or willing to help with childcare when the time comes. Say you'd love to be able to leave dc with someone you love and trust but that you completely understand if she can't. Then ask her to think about what days/hours she may be able to help with!

It seems pretty reasonable to me... You don't seem like the monster you've been painted!

Wow, I'm surprised at the heated response you got!

As a side note, should your dp not do the asking?

I imagine many grandparents would love to help. My mil looked into retiring bug it wasn't an option. She brought it up though. I think your one flaw is asking her to do it full time. At some point, it's perfectly reasonable to sit down and have a chat. Don't put her on the spot, tell her to go and think but ask if she'd be able and/or willing to help with childcare when the time comes. Say you'd love to be able to leave dc with someone you love and trust but that you completely understand if she can't. Then ask her to think about what days/hours she may be able to help with!

It seems pretty reasonable to me... You don't seem like the monster you've been painted!