Post Grad Brookers - we're in here....

[Biscuitsandtea]

New thread - t'other one got full up....

Ahem ^^

Oh yes, sorry Purple I crossed posts with you .

My milk production hasn't been affected as far as I can see, Scream. I must be taking in more or less the same numbers of calories as I was before, they're just made up with a higher fat/protein ratio. Maybe it's the drinking - it has been so hot and muggy recently that perhaps you're getting dehydrated without realising.

Biscuits, not sure if it could be the jabs or not. They always seem to make M sleepy. I don't see why not, though - or it could just mean he's gearing up for a really long sleep tonight!

It could be the nappies - have had Pampers before but Huggies were on offer. I think it's partly the shape of M's arse and partly that with new nappies it always seems to take me a few goes before I get them fitting her right - don't want to make them too tight around her tummy.

Pomme, moving to Italy?? Whereabouts? Can you speak Italian? Why would you move?

Hawthers, Biscuits and Scream, we too are a last minute packing family. In fact, a lot of M's babygros are currently revolving in the washing machine and we have to leave tomorrow at 3ish and have no tumble-dryer. There is no way they're going to be dry. Nor are my decent jeans, which were in the previous load, as were DH's. We're only going away for the weekend, though. Still, DH has tomorrow off, yay, so it won't be just me trying to pack on my own.

M is in bed - it is weird! Not sure if she's actually asleep, but I don't hear anything from the bedroom (DH is with her and I'm supposed to be making cups of tea). It is way too early for her to go down for the night. Really hope she stays there!

That's a normal nap pattern for a biscuits

Have a super holiday Hawthers. It'll be well worth the journey once you're there. I hope the weather is good for you.

Scream so of your California trip. It was the BEST holiday ever when we did it. It's the only holiday I've ever done that I would do exactly the same again. I usually love to go to new places.
We had a day out to Warwick Castle today. If you were a day earlier going to Stratford or we had gone a day later we could have met up . It's worth a visit if you get time over the weekend, but get cheap tickets online beforehand. Or buy some Tesco fresh orange juice, they have a 2 for 1 cutout on the carton. It's very overpriced otherwise. Oh and don't bother taking the pram, tonnes of cobbles and steps. DD has spent the day asleep in her Ergo.

DS is not well . He's full of cold and has a terrible cough and a slightly raised temperature. I don't know if it's illness of a side effect of the booster injections he had last week. The nurse said the MMR part of the jab won't show side effects until 10-14 days afterwards. Today is day 10, so it's either that or he is actually not well. But I'm in my usual ridiculous panicked state about it. The sickness phobia has now morped into childhood illness anxiety. I'm so fed up with myself. Got a GP appointment booked for next week to see if I can get some help.

That's a normal nap pattern for mine too biscuits :(

Can I have another little moan?
I really thought the colic and reflux were settling but after his amazing night poor B has been miserable, projectile vomiting again and crying/ fretting all day. Three x 20 min naps, two in the car on the way to/ from music group (last one til end of Sept, sob) one in the buggy though pushed for one hour plus to achieve that. He's so unhappy again tonight :( plus DD is kicking up as usual so i sat with her for 30 min til I could hear dh struggling loads with the twins then went back to help him, now S finally asleep so I've got B and dh in with DD and I just hate bedtime. We tried starting earlier with ideal bedtime being 6:30-7:30 in everything I've ever read but so far no good.

Italy?! Where did that come from pomme? One of my twin thread mums is Italian living in Italy. She says she would rather be here (she spent 10 years here and had her first two children here. her twins are #3&4 for her, with a 10yo and 7yo too). House swap ;-)

too I hope M stays asleep. All night. Evenings to yourself, yum.

Right, off to walk and jig

Oh,but scream, if A seems happy and her normal self don't look at the red book. How do you know you've less milk??

Scarlet sorry to hear DS is not well. Ds1 has had a cold for a while, I hadn't associated it with his booster jab but it could be I guess. But then there is a lot of that sort of thing around - I've got a cold and cough and have lost my voice - and I haven't had any jabs . Fingers crossed that he's over it soon though.

And brooking that the GP can do something for you. Do you know what you'd like them to do? Can they refer you for counselling or something?

Scream you'll have to make us all drool with some details of where you're going . I would love to do a trip like that (but not with a 3 year old repeatedly asking 'are we there yet?')

Oh yes, on the amount of milk Scream could it just be a bit of a growth spurt?

Sorry it's been a stressful day Dream and the reflux is back . Brooking for improvement. Where are you on the medication etc?

Scarlet - was Warwick Castle any good? I've never been. And dd loved get day in the ergo then - did you wear it all day ok?

I lived in the south of Italy for four years back in my twenties setting up a business for my dad and his business partner and living with my ex. I do speak Italian.

Dh and I have been doing work in various ways for dad and business partner for years now and they want us to move to the north (il veneto) to start a new business.

I am excited for a work pov but wary for a personal pov in terms of friends/groups/child care etc. plan would be to come back when holly ready to start school.

Feeling very unsure!

I have been worried about my milk supply as a's feeding has been so erratic and I haven't managed to express as much as I probably should have done. It seems fine though - a bf counsellor assured me my milk wouldn't dry up and bottle refusing a perish when I wept on her asked her

Warwick Castle is a good day out Biscuits. For kids I'd say it's probably better when they're 8+ish as they have dungeons and ghost walks and there's a lot of climbing steps if you want to see everything. DS loved the playground and the falconry display and made DH climb to the very top of the tower with him, twice! . So although he's not well, he's still ok in himself. DD was in the Ergo all day bar stopping for her feeds and our picnic. I've mastered getting it on myself, it's very easy really.
I hope the GP will refer me for some CBT. I know I'm ridiculous, I just don't really know why and it's definitely getting worse. I need to learn some coping mechanisms or get to the bottom of why I get in such a state. It's fear. It's fear that the illness is being caused by something major that's not been diagnosed. I've probably read too many newspaper stories about children who have died from a virus that's not been picked up correctly or in time. Which is rare I know, but it happens and it's like I have to be sure that it's not going to be DS. So even with really trivial things like colds I'm wondering if it's something else. Add vomitting to the symptoms and my brain goes into overdrive with worry

Dream sorry to hear your evening battles are still not over I take it the white noise was a one hit wonder? So tragic about the girl your sister knows. Life's very unfair at times.

It's not a growth spurt, A really doesn't seem any hungrier than usual and she's definitely not feeding any more frequently. I know I've got less milk because previously my breasts would get full to the point of pain at least 3 or 4 times a day, now I'm not sure they ever really get that full. On top of this when DD feeds now she'll start off sucking and swallowing as usual and then she'll start just sucking and sucking and sucking. She gets more and more breast in her mouth, and sucks extra hard, but it's obvious she's not getting anything. After a while she just gives up. She's not frantic when she gives up, she's clearly had quite a bit, but she isn't full like she used to be. As recently as 2 weeks ago even if I fed A directly after expressing I never used to run out of milk. Now I run out several times a day. :(

I think I'm going to stop the diet, I'm worried that if I keep going I won't be able to get my milk supply back up again afterwards. At the moment I'm really struggling to express enough for our weekend break, and feed A normally throughout the day. I keep expressing, then trying to feed her directly a couple of hours later and not having enough milk so I have to give her the expressed milk! This has never happened before. I need to be able to express enough milk to avoid bfing in public.

I'll keep up the exercise so that I finish out my 30 day Shred properly! I do believe it's making a difference to the outline of my waist and arms, I just don't think exercise can compensate for my chocolate addiction generate any serious weightloss. I'll have to try the dreaded healthy eating and gradual weightloss [lost cause emoticon]

So Scarlet tell us all about your trip to California! Also what's Warwick castle like? No Brooking for your DS to get better soon!

Oooooo Pomme tell us more about your potential Italy plans!!

Dream sending hugs your way, I'm convinced that really good night was just a sign of things to come. They'll be sleeping like that on a regular basis very soon!

have you tried just swapping breasts when she gets frustrated scream? R has been doing a bit of head shaking and wriggling so i just swap him from side to side till he's happy. it's good for stimulating supply too. he looks frustrated at first but must get more letdowns as he guzzles happily and zonks eventually.

I'm sure purple has mentioned that you don't 'run out' ever, the flow just slows down but your breasts make milk as she feeds. also breasts not feeling hard/full is just a sign that your supply is settling down and matching her needs. she will feed more if she needs to up it. your supply is like a river not a bucket is the description I've heard!

hope purple doesn't mind me sticking my oar in on the bfing.

I do swap breasts Jaggy, usually there's a little bit in the other side but that is quickly gone too. I know that milk production is continuous so your breasts are never completely dry, however I would say I've gone from being a river to being a leaky tap! Certainly my speed of production can't keep up with DD's speed of drinking, so once I'm pretty much out she needs to wait a while before enough accumulates for her to feed again.

I appreciate all the helpful advice, from Jaggy, Biscuits, Scarlet and of course The Guru (aka Purple ) It's really kind of you all. Going through all your points, and the Kelly website, has been great for ensuring I look at this issue from all angles and can make an informed decision rather than just caving at the two week mark like I always do with diets

I'm sorry for the x-posts with Scarlet and Pomme earlier. That shows how long it takes me to write a post (between running around sorting out my DD and DS DH!)

Thanks for the cobbles/stairs warning re Warwick castle Scarlet, it'll be another chance to use the carrier! Also, I've found an argos 2 for 1 voucher online, but thanks for the tesco juice heads up!

Pomme your possible Italy move sounds sooooooooo exciting!!! How seriously are you considering it?

Hmmm, so here I am again up in the wee hours, on my own

Every night for about the last 3 or 4, ds1 gets up at about 2-2:30 for some reason or another. Either he's lost his toy (it's always right there in his bed when I go and look) or he just appears at the side of my bed, doesn't say anything and I just need to walk him back through to his bed. Now he always goes straight back to bed (touch wood) but of course it wakes me up. Not normally a problem really but since I've had this cough, once I'm awake the coughing starts . Then in really conscious that I can't disturb ds2 by coughing lots (the arrival of ds1 normally disturbs him a little and he has to do a bit of fist sucking to settle again). So I end up coming to sit in ds2's room until the coughing stops. Which takes ages!

Now I do realise that this isn't the worst thing in the world as I'm very lucky that ds1 just goes back to bed, and doubly lucky that ds1 can settle himself back off normally. But I'm just fed up of sitting here on my own coughing away . Ah well....

Anyway I'm hoping that none of you ate up to read this as you're all having a lovely night's sleep, and in particular that those dreamy twins are repeating last night's excellent work

Scream I don't really have any knowledge / suggestions so will just send some lovely hugs your way instead. I genuinely don't know if this is possible but could it be that your supply is settling down to what A needs if she's not feeding any more often, and that the sucking at the end is more using you as a pacifier? Mind you i suppose she's taking the expressed milk isn't she. Maybe I'm clutching at straws. It must be very frustrating when you've literally had milk on tap all the time?

They do say slow and steady wins the race don't they so maybe that's the way forward on the eating front? Maybe while you're just shredding and not dieting, you could start measuring your arms / legs / waist as well as weighing yourself so you can see if you're losing inches as well as / instead of lbs? You'll get there (wherever 'there' is - I'm sure you're a goddess anyway ) one way or the other.

Have a fabulous time in Stratford - a very lovely place indeed. Hope you have a lovely day .

Now those of you that are using slings / carriers a lot. What are you doing with all this rain? How do you stop the babies getting wet?

Oh, I wiiiiiiiish I could stop coughing . What a waste of time!

I meant doubly lucky that ds2 can (often) settle himself again.

Oh and on the inches thing my waist has gone down by 1.5 inches in the first 2 weeks of this 'healthy' eating . This is of course only possible because I still looked (and indeed still look) several months pregnant. But it has to be a stepmom the right direction. It's still 41 inches though . No wonder only my fat jeans fit. Actually my normal jeans fit everywhere apart from the waist so I can't do them up. Or I can but there's just tummy spilling out everywhere over the top. How do I get my waist to go back down?

Right - 2 hours later I think I can finally attempt sleep without coughing for Britain and all because I had to look for ds1's toy....

oh no biscuits - that's rubbish. Hope it gets better soon. 1.5 inches is brilliant! I read the other day that blowing up balloons is a great exercise for tummies so have been doing that a bit for dd1!!

A had a much better night - fed at half ten and half three. Amazing. yesterday was the first time I did what I feel is the right dosage of her drug for her..connection? I am getting annoyed with the system at the moment. She's on a strong drug, I'm following a reasonably radical diet plan and still no proper paed information. GP was SO woolly about dosage it made me go and do my own research and come up with a plan.

scream - I think we are seriously considering it. it wouldn't be till early 2013 but if everything could be sorted and all my worries assuaged then yes I think it would be a strong possibility.

I really worked on getting my supply up yesterday, offering both sides, expressing etc and then D sleeps from 10-5.30! I woke up with boulders on my chest:) I think it worked(although I only expressed enough to feed a gnat baby)
Good question biscuits also sun protection? Solutions please? I am going to seriously discuss slings this weekend with DH. He goes away again next week so I have a small window of opportunity!

Is Il Veneto where prosecco comes from? Mmm, prosecco...Sounds like a v interesting plan, and it's not like you'd be going into it blind, because you've lived in Italy before and speak the language. If you were working too it would help with the meeting people part, I expect. Italy is so gorgeous!

Biscuits, you poor thing! Brooking hard for your cold to go away. And for Scarlet's DS to get better quickly. Scarlet, you've reminded me to nag encourage DH to phone the CBT people - he finally got his referral letter through and now he has to phone and make an appt. He's been putting it off because he has to call between 9 and 2, and he didn't want to call from work and have people overhear. He's got today off, though, so must get him to do it!

Dream, yesterday sounds nightmarish. Brooking that you had a better night last night.

M was just faking me out going to bed at 7. She woke up at 8.30 for another feed and fell asleep on me, so I thought great, put her down in the basket and scarpered to get in the bath. When I came out of the bath having ignored a few yells she was sitting on DH's lap giggling and cooing to him looking like sleep was the furthest thing from her mind. She eventually went back down at 11, and was up at 1.45, 4.45 and woke up for the day at 8.15. Stupid 4 month sleep regression!

Scream, jealous of your many trips! Hope you have a lovely weekend :) Thanks for talking about the settling without food before three hours with A.. I've been trying it with Iz with mixed results! :)

Biscuits, your limited interpretation of when E is hungry is the same as mine with Iz! I'm beginning to learn which of her squawks in the day mean tiredness and which are a hunger early warning sign (before the full scale screaming!) but that's it. With regard to not getting her wet in a sling, I've found a well placed umbrella has been protection enough!

Pomme, Italy sounds both exciting and scary..!

Iz has had two good night in a row! Wed night we only had two wake ups... the same last night , but the first was after 6.5 hours of sleep! That was after DH fed her a bottle of ebm before bed (want to get her used to it so at some point I can go out to the odd evening rehearsal). Maybe we gave her more than she'd normally take from me? Either way, I'm not complaining!

The Olympic torch is coming through here today. I fear it may be a little damp...

I used to just hold a waterproof over DD biscuits, or put her in an all in one waterproof when she was a bit bigger.

Those BBBB's, up every 2.5 hours. I'm now very frustrated as i know they can do better. I just hope B is more settled today... S is perfectly happy if held. So cue whichever baby not being held screaming but at least S stops as soon as you pick him up.

scream it does sound to me like your supply is just matching A's needs. Mine is like that now so I'm really struggling to express too. I'm no expert like purple though :)

it was absolutely bucketing rain in St A last week dream and i had R zipped into my waterproof with his head peeping out and an umbrella too. looked a bit mad i think! we only had one brolly so DH and DS1 got a bit soggy.

dream I put the package in the post yesterday

scream I lived in Sydney for a while and met DH there in the coogee bay hotel an uber trendy bar we must arrange a south london meet up!

Jaggy, I do that too - zip M up in my jacket! She has an all-in-one fleece suit (handed down from her 5yo auntie ) which is fine when it's wet and chilly, but no so good when it's wet and warm like the last few days.

Yay for 6.5 hours, Musical! And yay for pomme too. Sounds like you must be getting the right dose now - at useless GPs!

Biscuits, 1.5 inches off your waist is brilliant! Well done you!

Oh no, Dream. Still, they might behave tonight. How are you feeling about a Sunday meet-up? This time I swear I will check MN on DH's phone while we're away! If you're going to your hen party don't worry - there'll be other opportunities.

Wants, sun protection - well, that hasn't been an issue for us recently , but when it was so hot in May or whenever it was we were dressing M in a thin loose white babygro so her skin was covered, no vest, and putting a sunhat on her. She was inward-facing in the sling at that point so her face didn't get the sun. Now she's nearly 4 months can I put sun cream on her?

Tis pouring with rain - poor Taste festival! What can I wear that looks good accessorised with red wellies?