The Final Fruition of the Frolicking Forays for the First Time Frolickers

[Spirael]

We came, we saw, we frolicked.

Now our PFB has arrived and we can begin the stressful befuddled guiltridden exhausting wonderful journey of parenthood!

(Or at the very least we can stop bothering the antenatal bunch until they join us!)

Thanks for all your support girls, had a bit of a down day again yesterday but am now in touch with the BF support worker and am beating myself up less about the formula!
Left nipple is cracked wide open again, so it would appear there is still some problem although the BF lady said my latch etc looked good but that my nipples are still wedge shaped!? Not sure how we're meant to get past that?? I have quite flat nipples so we're working on the assumption that they just aren't quite long enough to get to where they should be! So new plan now is expressing again from the sore side, feeding from the good side and topping up with formula, although not sure how long the "good side" is going to hold out
I do want to continue a bit longer with BF but I just feel I'm doing something that makes me miserable and sore and then I feel bad because I know I'm doing it for my baby and I should just toughen up!!
Its such a head pickle!! Going to a breast feeding group tomorrow if we can get organised and out on time!!

Hope you're all well :)

spirael glad to hear Mindy's brushing her tooth, and yay for clapping

worrisome you sound very posh with your hearth It's good that Lochie's naps are getting longer, William has gone back to catnapping recently, but my extensive googling suggests it pretty normal around the 4-6 month mark, then they go back to long naps.

mrsw it's good that you're getting some support. Can you ask them about trying nipple shields - my nipples are really flat and we had massive problems when my milk came in and William couldn't latch at all, but when he did get on they obviously weren't going far enough back and were coming out cracked and wedge shaped. I used nipple shields for about 5 weeks and they meant William could latch easily and I wasn't left so sore (although you can still get damaged through the shields if you have an incorrect latch)

Lots of BFing support type people are a bit against them for some reason, I think the older style ones were linked with a reduction in your milk supply, but for me they were the difference between continuing to BF and giving up. The downside is that you have to remember to clean them after every feed and it does take a while to wean them off feeding with them if you decide to stop using them. I used them for every feed until about 4 weeks, then started offering without-sometimes he'd go on and struggle, others he'd feed ok until one day he refused to go anywhere near the shield and has fed fine ever since

Think I'm going to have to start hiding my credit cards - yesterday Will managed to pull himself along the floor on his tummy and started rummaging through my handbag

mrsw Am pleased to hear from you. I hope you don't think I am pushing you but I found this article linked on kellymom about flat nipples. If you don't have time to read it, it basically advises you to pump a little before latching to extend your nipples, explains an exaggerated hold: -

"Pulling back on the areola before you latch the baby on. Support your breast with your thumb on top and your other fingers underneath, and pull back on the breast toward the chest wall. This will help the nipple protrude."

and that in time your baby will become bigger and better at latching. I hope you are ok and can take it one feed at a time. Remember you can take paracetamol too.

bunny Lol at Will, I wonder what babies would buy if they could...!

Oh it also suggest nipple shields too, after consulting a bf expert. And putting ice on your nipples before a feed. I thought that one sounded horrific though!

Thanks for that bunny and halo every little bit of info helps, feel like I've had limited help from MWs which has probably led to this situation in the first place!

Well tried my first BF of the day this morning from the "good side" turns out it's not so good anymore :( So new plan is expressing only and formula feeding so am probably doing about 50/50 at the moment. Not ideal but I'm just not putting myself through the agony anymore. Spoke to BF lady again today who also suggested nipple shields and said to make sure I get the right size otherwise they can do more damage! Explained to her that I wanted to continue expressing and that I would maybe attempt BF again once nipples are healed and we can start over from scratch with lots of support and maybe it'll be succesful second time around so she was happy enough with that and will visit again on Monday. I honestly can't begin to explain the relief in knowing that I don't have to get my nipples chewed off at every feed! Glad she's still getting breast milk though but am a little sad that we won't have that feeding bond but I guess there's always a chance we could get it back.

MrsW Great to hear from you again, and glad you're feeling a bit happier with things. Giving yourself a chance to heal is a smart plan. Don't worry about losing the feeding bond - you will bond with Robyn anyway, and I have to say I love feeding Lochie via bottle - he's started reaching up and grabbing stroking my face/ears/hair.

halo I never went as far as ice on my nipples, but I did have most success in the early days of trying to wean William off the shields if I sat topless under the air con for a few minutes before a feed

mrsw it's a good idea to give yourself chance to heal up before you try again. If you try again Robyn will be that bit bigger and might find it easier. I also had most success in the early days of feeding using the rubgy ball hold - it was much easier to try and shape my nipple to get it into his mouth that way.

I never felt a huge amount of a feeding bond anyway - he used to fall asleep so quickly there was none of the gazing lovingly into his eyes that I expected. Now he does delatch to smile at me, but that just leads to me flashing innocent bystanders if we're out in public

We're flying back to the UK this evening for a holiday. So far I am still in my PJs and have packed nothing. Really need to get a move on, but am filled with dread at the prospect of a 24hour flight with a 6 month old, so am just pretending it's not happening

Just a quick one to say Congrats MrsW and sounds like you're doing a great job! FWIW I expressed for 3 weeks and just fed for one feed a day then DS suddenly caught on and now just feeds off me? Maybe try the nipple shields for a while then slowly back on the breast? Whatever you decide to do, formula isn't evil sometimes but a necessity and you're trying all you can already so hope you manage to sort things out, it's so hard isn't it? Just make sure you're not too hard on yourself!

Bunny have a great holiday, I was dreading our flight too but the white noise kept Sean asleep for the long haul and airports these days have some wonderful facilities! Amsterdam had baby rooms with cots and a microwave for babyfood!!
Also, assuming you're using disposables, just a tip, use one of your reusable wraps over them to minimise 'accidents'. Also, we didn't have a problem but apparently feeding on the way up and down or making sure he sucks something evens out the pressure in the ears for them. Sorry if you're already thought of all this but I just thought I'd share it with you. Have a lovely trip!

haloflo I use bamboozles but the old ones, not too sure about the new ones, I have one and it doesn't look as big or as absorbent but maybe I should just give it some time. I do love my bamboozles (with motherease wraps) , yet others swear by all-in-ones(mainly bumgenius and itti bitti). Have you got a nappicino near you? Maybe go to a second hand sale and buy a few to try? You could also go to clothtreenappy and buy a few second hand ones to see how you get on with them? Hope this helps. The ladies on MN nappy forum are also really helpful if you've got a specific problem. However I found if it was a general which one is best everyone had a favourite! :o Shame you're not near me as I could lend you a few to try and I have some terrys too as backups. Also the ones that nappy lady recommended to me I didn't end up trying as I didn't like the look of them...it's a minefield!!

Will catch up with everyone soon have a nice weekend!

Hi everyone,

Haven't been on in ages and haven't read through to catch up yet, but I might not get a chance to post if I start doing that first!

Anyway, all's well with us. Router broke, hence the absence, but we're back up and running now. Having said that, we have just bought a house so will be cancelling broadband soon, then waiting to get reconnected, so although I'm back, I'll be going missing again soon! :(

So, like I said, everything's fine here. Can't wait to get the keys to the new house - our flat's like one giant playroom with all LO's stuff crammed in and we don't have a garden, so the new place will be brilliant. As for TTC no. 2, we're still taking the laid back approach - no news yet! Having said that, I found out yesterday that my thyroid's been underactive for the past few months, so chances are I'm not ovulating anyway. What else? LO's great. SOOO active. He sleeps about 8hrs overnight, like he has done since Day 5, but during the day, only has a maximum of an hour's worth of nap time. I don't know how he keeps going! At 7.5mths, he's still got no teeth (so I'm still breastfeeding!) and still isn't crawling (slow coach!) but he IS walking along the furniture and walking around, holding onto our hands for support... To be honest, he just wants to be on his feet constantly. He has no interest in lying down and learning to crawl! The second you lie him down, he looks for something to grab onto so that he can pull himself up to stand! Anyway, I think that's all our news... And he's awake! We're just going to head into town now, to shop for my sister's 18th birthday - fun! Hopefully I'll get a chance to catch up on all your news once we get back - hope you're well.

WR.x

Gosh it's quiet around here! roses good to 'see' you, and I am flabbergasted that you are able to cope with LO only sleeping 8 hours at night!! He must be a mini-whirlwind! So exciting re the house purchase - we're in a similar situation with a small flat, and it's completely taken over by Lochie's stuff!

bunny hope you're having a good time over here, we should have been organised and arranged a UK Frolickers meet! Ah well...

All is well here, Lochie is into everything and pulling himself to standing really well now. He's been feeding like a devil too, so I think he may be growth-spurting. However, we seem to be getting into a nice nap routine (at last!) so thats one thing. I've just had my return to work date confirmed which is a bit scary really. Only 3 more months of maternity leave left.

Argh, boy is awake.. will write more later..

mumnerves I wish I'd thought of bringing a wrap - we took him out dressed in his nicest clothes to meet a friend the other day. Cue poo explosion in the car which soaked through all his clothes and ran down his legs......we ended up having to run into a shop to buy him a new outfit

roses good to see you again. Good luck with the house move

worrisome that's amazing that Lochie's standing already

We made it over here intact - William was really good on the flight, although the jet lag has led to a big sleep regression so we're up 3-4 times a night with him Not much point trying to resolve it though as I'm sure he'll do the same once we're back home.

I'm amazed at how baby unfriendly the UK is compared with Oz though. Maybe we've just been to all the wrong places, but we've really struggled to find nice baby change rooms. I've also gone from only ever having had a positive reaction from people seeing me BF William, to having been told by more than one person that I really should have stopped by now

Should really have baby proofed before we left as he's now on the move - not quite properly crawling but dragging himself along on his belly. He's also finally gone public with his rolling

bunny I know what you mean re the UK being baby-unfriendly. I've learnt to keep an eye out for Mothercare or John Lewis, as I know that they always have feeding/changing rooms! Great that the flight went well, you're very brave! Hope William is getting back into the proper sleep patterns.

Yep, Lochie is very keen on standing and has started pulling himself up on any available surface, rather than just his mummy jungle gym! The only problem is that he's not quite worked out that if he tries to turn around or let go then he just topples over, and we have wooden floors, so I'm paranoid about him banging his head. However, I did a baby and kids first aid course on the weekend so at least I know what to do now!

Hope everyone else is ok, it's very quiet here at the moment!

We have new arrivals! cherry and crazybutterfly have both had baby girls!

Congratulations again you two - come in say hello if you get chance.

Oh yay! Congrats folks!

Congratulations Cherry & crazybutterfly :)

Gosh it's quiet in here!

Congrats to cherry and crazyb

worrisome I've got quite used to the sound of William's head thudding off our wooden floors. He rarely cries when he bumps it so I'm assuming it sounds worse than it is....or that there's just not that much in there to damage

We're finally back home in Oz! I loved visiting everyone in the UK, but I really do feel that Sydney is now my home

William's routine seems to be back on track, but he has jetlagged poos Poor thing normally poos at set times of the day, but now that happens to be in the middle of the night. He was grunting and straining every couple of hours last night, but unable to produce anything. After being up with him for over 2 hours at one point and him only sleeping if I massaged his tummy constantly I decided to see what would happen if he was on his front. He fell into a deep sleep straight away but I was so paranoid about the risks of him sleeping on his tummy that I ended up lying awake next to him checking he was still breathing. Hopefully his bowels will get back on track tonight

Hi hi! I never thought I would get in here after my munchkin kept us waiting so long! We are doing really well, am trying not to get lulled into a false sense of security just yet. Tabitha is doing great too, getting very good at sleeping (better at it during the day than night - she does longer stints) and pooing
Hope you're all well and enjoying the BH. It's my last day with DH at home, eeek!

Welcome crazy! Great to have you here and congrats on the birth of Tabitha! (love the name btw!)

Great that things are settling for you - just one thought, if Tabitha is sleeping for longer stretches during the day, she might have her nights/days mixed up. The advice we were given to help that was to have Lochie sleeping in the daylight (so Moses basket in the lounge with us) and to get outside in the sunshine (as long as you feel up to it!!).

Hi all. :) Congratulations to Cherry and crazybutterfly on their safe arrivals! Love the name Tabitha, it was on the final shortlist for Miranda! Are you going to use a nickname? If so, which one??

Mindy has finally discovered the joy of motion, though her ?crawling? currently consists of dragging herself across the room by her arms. Though she has at least learnt to push herself up to sitting from being laid down! She?s also starting to (finally) try and haul herself up to standing on anything she can find. (The cat was not impressed.)

How?s the feeding going, MrsW? :) Hopefully things have improved by now!

I didn?t find going back to work too bad, Worrisome. Mindy adores going to nursery and I seem to do much better going to work. I got kind of bored being at home, and struggled to keep structure in my day. We have a nice routine going now, that seems to work well for everyone. (And having the small amount of extra money from working is good too!)

Nice to ?see? you back, WhiteRoses! Though a bit and that you have DC2 on the cards already! I?m aiming for a 3 year gap between DC... Mostly for convenience of only needing 1 buggy/cot/highchair/etc, but also because we can?t afford 2 at nursery full time without the free hours.

The UK doesn?t seem too bad for babies, but you really do have to know where to go as everything is pretty well hidden and rarely signposted. Mothercare/Boots/John Lewis/Tesco are normally pretty good for having feeding/changing rooms provided.

Restaurants tend to be a bit hit or miss... Though I can thoroughly recommend Betty?s Tea Rooms. They were fabulous this weekend when we went out with friends and their daughter: so we had an 11 month and a 2 year old with us. Changing facilities (with playpens so the adult can use the toilet in peace!) in men and ladies toilets, the kiddies food brought out ahead of the adults, dedicated buggy store area and even toys provided for the LOs while we were waiting!

Anyway, since I?m at work, I guess I?d better actually do some.

Welcome Cherry and crazybutterfly and congrats to both of you!

bunny I totally agree with you about UK being unfriendly, I only realised this after my holiday. I don't think it's the places but we tend to bring Sean with us when we go out for a meal and in more than one place, even though they are 'child-friendly' the diners who are there constantly give us an evil eye if he makes any noise, for goodness sakes, he's a baby!!! There also do seem to be far fewer child friendly restaurants than ones where kids are not welcomed! Also abroad they wouldn't dream of turning away a family with a baby! BTW after our holiday now sleep has just all gone to pot after teething and jetlag messed his day and night up :(

whiteroses we also only get 8 hours sleep at night and it's spread out over about 12 hour period so if I don't go to bed within an hour of him going to bed I don't end up with much sleep at all! I want my baby back who used to sleep 8 hours straight and then have another 2 hours sleep!! Doesn't a duvet day sound like heaven!
Hope you're all settling into the new house ok.

crazy it's awful when DH goes back to work isn't it? Don't worry soon you'll be in the swing of things and enjoying it!

spirael nice to hear being back at work is suiting you, I'm going to see a prospective childminder next week and it's making me sad :(

We started weaning a few weeks back and decided to go down the baby-led weaning route....what a mess! But got to love those strawberry stained grins! Have a nice weekend everyone and enjoy the weather!

spirael glad to hear you're enjoying being back at work. I go back on Wednesday (only part time though) and I can't wait. Much as I adore William he's not exactly great at adult conversation yet

mumnerves we've had big sleep problems since we got back too. After trying all my usual tricks I've ended up just leaving him to cry [evil evil mummy] It's not what I wanted to do, but last night was the first night I resolved to be firm with him, and he woke for 10 mins at 9pm, 10 mins at 1am then slept through till 7am. This is a complete contrast to the previous nights where he woke at 1am and despite dummy, patting, offering water, and finally trying to BF him back to sleep he was up for 2hours wanting to play.

William has been on his induction at nursery this week. He absolutely loves it and has settled in really well. I'm a bit though as yesterday I left him there all day for the first time, and when I went to collect him I expected to be greeted with a big smile and a cuddle, but he was more interested in the nursery worker's pen than in me. There I was thinking I was the centre of his little world, but it seems he's perfectly happy without me [sob]

That sounds familiar, bunnygirl. M grins when she realises DH and I are leaving when we drop her at nursery, and normally just glances at us then carries on doing whatever she was doing whenever we arrive!

I tend to think of it that she's independant, which can only be a good thing in the future. :)

spireal and bunny that sounds great that they're both settled/settling in so well, but I completely understand the heartbreak! bunny - a WHOLE DAY to yourself, I hope you napped through it!

I'm knackered today too, but mostly because Lochie decided 4.30am was morning. I think it's my fault as he went to bed at 5.30pm last night because of barely napping throughout the day. Today I've resolved to have a 'good nap' day and he's currently been asleep for 50 mins, so hopefully we'll be able to get back on track. Do any of you have those days where you just have to stay at home and get things settled again? I find if we've had a busy week of being out and about, then a day like that really helps recharge our batteries. (Or mine at least, Lochie obviously runs on wiggle power!)

mumnerves We're doing BLW too and I love it! It's so much fun and I'm so proud of how well Lochie is managing. The funniest thing is how aware he is of food now - if DH tries to have toast for his breakfast then Lochie is immediately sitting at his feet doing his best begging look. He also knows that when I get his spoons out he's going to get yoghurt and gets very excited! We then have a kind of factory line going where he sucks a spoon as I get the next one ready for him. All kinds of mess, but lovely.

spireal I'm actually almost looking forward to going back to work (am obv bad mummy!) I just can't wait for a bit of me-time, even if that is only on the commute!

Thanks for the welcome ladies

We are doing well so far although had a difficult afternoon yesterday because it was really hot and T was grizzly. I am BFing and have no idea whether I am meant to feed her more in the heat, am assuming I am because we need to drink more...the midwife is due this afternoon so I will ask her about it. She is also really struggling with a blocked nose bless her... It's hard not being able to do much to help!

She is managing to differentiate night and day now which is brilliant. Coincidentally I have had her with us in the lounge and have been walking a lot worrisome though I have only just read your post! So must work! Lochie sounds sooo cute, I can't wait to see Tabitha's personality coming out.

spireal I am struggling with a nickname, I think tabby sounds too much like tammy! And Tabs means cigarettes where I'm from so I can't get my head round that one either. I am hoping one will come to us! We call her truffles at the moment because she sniffles for the boob like a little truffle pig :)

Despite only being 10 days in, me time sounds wonderful, if a long way off! I hope you all enjoy it when it comes. It's lovely to hear such positive stories about daycare since DH is adamant we need to use it at around a year, whether I go back to work or not. At the moment I can't imagine it but I am sure I'll get used to the idea!

MrsW how is the feeding going? I know how you feel... We had real problems at about day 4 but there is so much support out there, am glad you are using it and getting the help you need. I am still not 100% sorted, still kinda ouchie...but am going to persevere for a while as it is still early days for us. We just need to remember that our babies benefit from it hugely no matter how long we do it for, so youve already done her the world of good whether you stop now or not.

bunny glad to hear you had a lovely holiday here in the UK. I do agree with you about how unfriendly the hospitality industry especially is here. I'm only just finding out! We have been looking for hotels for 2 places in the next few months and as soon as I mention a baby they say they can't help. I am actually considering just not mentioning it in future; surely they wouldn't turn us away on arrival!? I can't believe people commented on your BFing. That's appalling! Saying that my cleaner told me to put it away yesterday and I was in my own bloody house!! I haven't tried in public yet, though managed in the M&S changing room. Poor DH felt a bit uncomfortable though. Do you think they are generally more for women only and I while leave him outside?

mumnerves 8 hours sleep sounds like a dream to me!! That's definitely the downside to exclusively BFing but it's not forever.

For those of you BFing...how long will it be before my nipples don't ache in a cold wind?! I think I have got the latch just about sorted as they are not scuffed/bleeding any more but they feel sort of bruised if that makes sense!?

Wow mammoth post sorry! You can tell baby is sleeping :)

I'm the same, WorrisomeHeart! I need the escape and adult conversation that going to work allows me to have, for my own sanity if nothing else. If needing some me-time makes us bad mummies, at least we can be bad mummies together.

For a nickname, how about Tibby, crazybutterfly? :) Or Tibs, or Tibtab, or various alterations on that theme.

I found the idea of Mindy being in nursery was easier once she turned six months, as before then it was pretty much a case of all she could do was lie on her back and flail helplessly. Once she started being able to actually do a few things for herself (even just moving away, or picking up a toy) she seemed a lot less helpless. :)

I never had any problems with BF around my area... Most people just ignored me, and the few that seemed to notice tended to give me smiles before carrying on their business. Once you build up the courage to go more public, maybe try the coffee shops? They're normally pretty welcoming and accepting. (And often have big comfy seats!)

For the sore nipples, I'm not a good person to ask as I struggled with thrush for months before finally getting it cleared and experiencing BF without pain. I believe it's meant to be about a fortnight to a month though for everything to settle and toughen up.