The Final Fruition of the Frolicking Forays for the First Time Frolickers

[Spirael]

We came, we saw, we frolicked.

Now our PFB has arrived and we can begin the stressful befuddled guiltridden exhausting wonderful journey of parenthood!

(Or at the very least we can stop bothering the antenatal bunch until they join us!)

spirael how did you get the thrush diagnosed and what were the symptoms? please :)

bunny I tried the mean mummy let him cry thing but he just works himself up into a frenzy and then it takes even longer to settle him, also tried shoving a dummy into his mouth as soon as he stirs and sometimes it works but more often than not it doesnt :( I'm dreading the going back to work saga as he's really independent and I know he'll settle well which is good in a way but like you part of me can't help but feel a bit hurt!

worrisome at least you only get a begging look, we get full blown I want to grab whatever you're eating! I tend to snack on things I wouldn't give him (choc and crips usually :o ) whilst breastfeeding so he doesn't realise what I'm doing. Sometimes he does and just pops out to nosy but since he's also 'eating' it's ok apparently

crazy she will probably want more in the heat and may even feed for shorter periods but want both sides as the first flow is usually more thirst quenching (watery) Glad to hear that feeding is going well, it's really hard at first and the sleep deprevation really does hit you but after 4-5 weeks I suddenly realised that I actually enjoyed bf-ing, it came far more naturally, without any pain and you'll be pleased that you perservered. My nipples still tingle when in cold but only after a feed. Maybe try lansinoh after each feed might help? Thrush you can usually see in baby's mouth as white-ish patches or pain and itching inside your boob. Don't worry about the sleep, it gets better and ignore anyone who said that their baby slept through straight away, I moan but tbh I wouldn't do it any other way.

spirael I agree with you about the adult conversation, and me time! I think it just lets us recharge our batteries so we can go back to it with new eyes. I'm just putting things off partly because things are pretty crap at work from all the gossip I'm hearing and really really don't want to go back to have to deal with it!

What lovely weather we're having! A tad too hot by lunchtime so we went for a lovely swim, hope it carries on and everyone is enjoying it x

worrisome we often end up having an "at home" day to get back on track if we've been out and about alot. I think William can tolerate 2 consectutive days of being out all day before he ends up overtired, not napping, and then being generally miserable. He's pretty much consolidated his sleep to 2 long naps now, so I try and get him to do the morning one in his cot, then go out for the day, and if the afternoon one is short, then he'll usually sleep in the car/pram on the way home.

crazyb she will want to feed more frequently in the heat, and possibly for less time than normal too. The foremilk will quench her thirst so it will be that she's after, leading her to feed little and often. We had some mega hot days over the summer (in the 40s!!) and I made sure to offer Will a feed every 2 hours in the day.

I have dodgy nipples so it took me longer than most to find BFing comfortable - probably about 6 weeks for the majority of feeds to be pain free, but it was only at the 3 month mark that I suddenly realised that it was actually enjoyable. Although part of that might be due to feeds only taking about 10mins at that point.

spirael I was a bit worried about how Will would cope at nursery, as most of the other babies in his room are 1 or over and he's less mobile than them. Needn't of worried though as I observed him commando crawl over to one of the other smaller babies, steal his dummy, and then crawl off with it. Am now just waiting for the day I'm called into his school to be told I've raised the class bully

mumnerves hope you find a solution for the sleep soon. Will went to town on his 4 month regression, so I remember the hell of being up with him every 90mins. You will eventually find a solution that works for you, you might just have to try a few first. For whatever reason, William preferred to just be left to it - I tried shushing and patting etc. and that just seemed to anger him. He either wants to be fed to sleep or left to cry it out

I found thrush affected me as a burning sensation inside my breasts, crazybutterfly, that went on for an hour or so after feeding stopped. Even after that point, it also often felt like my bra was filled with shards of glass my nipple was so sensitive. Mindy didn't seem to get white patches in her mouth, but she did develop a mild bit of thrush rash on her bottom.

My team at work are being pretty rubbish at the moment too, mumnerves so I can sympathise there. However I've managed to get myself a six month secondment to a different team that'll hopefully start in the next month or two, so I'm hoping that'll improve things. (And that they'll invite me to stay permanently!)

LOL at Will stealing the dummy from the baby, bunnygirl! I'm the other way around with Mindy, I fear I've got the room doormat - she'll happily give away any toy she's playing with and just sit happily and watch the proceedings. She also has been bitten on the hand, once, by another baby who was after her raisins!

Thanks for all your replies :)

spirael that's sort of how my nipples are, really sensitive even when I'm not feeding, when I get out of the shower it hurts to put a towel round me and the thought of anyone touching them makes me shudder! How did you get it diagnosed? I could just be oversensitive or just a case of getting used to feeding (i am only 11 days in after all) but it might be worth me getting it checked out.

bunny wrt the feeding...if I only give her the quenching bit do I need to express the rest? The BF counsellor I saw said if the hindmilk isn't drained properly it can cause blocked ducts?

Can any of you recommend a pump at all? I have the medela mini electric but ouch it really hurts! Any good stories about manual ones or am I better off hiring/buying a good one? To be fair I only tried the medela one when I was engorged so that could have been why it hurt but am scared to try it again

I love this thread, thank you all for your help - cheers

spirael poor Mindy being mugged for her raisins.

crazyb thinking back my nipples were really sensitive for the first 2-3 weeks. I wore breast pads all the time, even though I never leaked much, just because I couldn't bear the sensation of them touching my bra. If you're going to a BFing support thing anyway then it might be worth getting them checked out though.

Not sure about expressing if she only has a short feed. By the time we had really hot weather Will was about 6 weeks so supply was a bit more established. I would imagine that if you still feel like the breast is full after she's done feeding then it would be a good idea to express a bit for comfort (and it'll get you a supply of milk for the freezer) The other thing I did in hot weather was feed bottles of EBM straight from the fridge to cool him down, although you might want to wait until you've got BFing well and truly sorted before you give a bottle, but it might be something to try later in a few weeks if you continue to have hot weather.

I have the Avent Isis breast pump that works as an electric and a manual, and it works well for me. I tend to use it as an electric unless I only need a little bit to add to his food, as manual pumping makes my hand ache. I found expressing painful at first due to my nipples being sore anyway, so it might be worth giving your pump another go just to see how you get on. If you do want a change of pump, maybe hire one to test it out before you invest. I got my pump off ebay as I figured buying a used one was no different to hiring one, and I could always relist it if I didn't like it.

Better go as Will is currently pulling himself up my leg, using his mouth to provide suction

In my experience the doctors were pretty rubbish and identifying and treating thrush. :( I basically had to go and tell them I was sure I had thrush before they'd do anything, as they kept just saying "Wait and see, it might just go away.".

First thing they gave me was a medicine for Mindy and an oral gel to put on my nipples which did nothing at all aside from make me sticky. Then I got a really weak dose of the ingested drugs after arguing for them. I also started using regular caneston cream on my nipples and just making sure to carefully wipe it off before Mindy fed. That combination finally seemed to kill it off!

For pumps, I used an Avent Isis electric/manual too, though I never actually used the manual fitting! [lazy] It was a bit sore to start with, partially thrush, but also I think because I was pumping too hard and too fast (that sounds wrong...). You don't need to use the full pressure, especially when engorged. Just hold the pressure for a few seconds, as long as milk is being produced, before starting another stroke.

The Isis was good that I could set a pressure and speed that suited me. I still got the tingly let-down feeling at the start, but found it a lot less than when my leech LO was let loose. Oh, and my nipples always seemed to get a bruised, purple look afterwards, regardless of what I did. They seemed to recover without issue, so I'm assuming that was fine. [oblivious]

bunny that's helpful, maybe I am just experiencing a bit of soreness while my nipples get used to it. That's exactly how I'm feeling, the bra thing. Can't even imagine life without breast pads!!

I am not seeing BF counsellor again, it was a walk in clinic I had access to whilst I was still under midwife care but was signed off on Friday as Tabitha has gained 1lb in 10 days, little guzzler!!

Haha Will sounds very determined bless him, he's obviously going to be into rock climbing when he's older

Thanks to both of you for the recommendations on the breast pump. Have just had a look on amazon and it looks a lot more gentle than the medela one which has a solid plastic nipple contact! Is it the one that's about £80? Or there's an Isis duo that's £250...?

Hi guys, sorry have been a bit awol again. Laptop is broken so not able to post as often but am still lurking using my phone!

Spirael Robyn is now purely formula fed. Finally stopped expressing last weekend. I just wasn't able to produce enough milk and was pumping about 6 times a day and only managing to get around 4 ounces. Pretty soul destroying (and time consuming too) Milk drying up was a bit upsetting as I got quite full after about 2 days and was really tempted to express but knew I'd just be getting myself into a vicious cycle!! Anyway I'm happy enough that Robyns had as a good a start as I could give her and it's obviously doing her no harm as the little chunker weighed 9lbs 6 when she was weighed on Thursday. She's 6 weeks old tomorrow. :)

Crazyb I think the weird nipple feeling I got in the cold was one of the things I disliked most about breast feeding!! I also couldn't put the towel round me when I came out of the shower! So on that basis I guess all those things are pretty standard!! Well done to you for persevering though!
As for the sleeping thing, I was advised to make as much day time noise as possible whilst Robyn was sleeping but then to keep things quiet and dark at night time so that she would know the difference that way. Maybe we were just lucky but she seeed to catch on pretty quickly!

On Friday night she slept from 11.30pm until 06.30am, unfortunately for us it was at my mums house! She was babysitting for us as we were at a wedding reception. Naively hoped for an action replay last night but it didn't happen!! She is sleeping for 4-5 hour stretches overnight but if she goes down at 9 (like she did last night) it the means she gets up at about 2 and then again at 6!! Much prefer her going down at 11.30 til 4 or 5!

Other than that she seems to be doing really well, smiling, blowing bubbles, coo-ing now and again but never when you want her too!

crazyb the Isis duo is a double pump so you can do both sides at once. Probably only worth it if you are exclusively pumping or have twins

mrsw glad you've got feeding sorted - you should be proud of yourself for persisting with expressing for so long. I'm back to work this week and am meant to send 1 bottle of EBM to nursery for Will each day, and I'm already finding it a huge pain in the arse to try and find time to sit and pump each day. I definitely would not have had the will power to keep trying when he was a newborn.

Well done for being brave enough to leave Robyn overnight - I'm still not brave enough to leave Will and he'll be 7mo this week.

Hi all,

Just started writing a message and I lost it. :( Anyway, as I was saying, that's us all moved in now, and the broadand was activated this morning, so hopefully I'll get a chance to pop in a bit more regularly now. Glad you all seem to be doing well. We're fine. Loving the space and the garden in particular (small 1 bed flat to large 3 bed house makes quite a difference!) We've still got a lot of boxes to unpack but there's the advantage of the spare bedroom! :-P LO's doing great. Won't sit still for a second - we too are familiar with the thud of head on floor, though, like Will, LO doesn't seem to mind too much! :-/ In other news, he's FINALLY (at 8.5mths!) got his first tooth! Slow coach! Anyway, I don't REALLY have time for MN. LO's asleep so I should really be taking advantage of that and going and making lunch. We're going to buy a second freezer for the garage soon, because with LO's diet, I have to make EVERYTHING from scratch, and life would be so much easier if I could do it all in bulk, but our normal sized freezer's already bursting at the seams. Such a nuisance. And it's not even like, after putting all the effort into cooking, the food tastes any good! :-/ Ah well, just got to get used to it I suppose.

I'll check back again soon.

WR.x

Just checking in quickly.

MrsW I agree with the others rebuts expressing, well done for continuing so long. I expressed for the first three weeks but only enough for one feed. I have to say that the feeling of freedom when my doc told me to stop was immense!

WR congrats on the new place and the tooth! Hope you're all settling in.

Meant to say crazy well done on the weight gain!!

roses glad you're settling into your new place. Poor you having to cook everything from scratch...I really like being able to give William a pouch of something premade every meal time if we're out and about. Can your LO have the ones that are just fruit/veg or are even those ones too risky?

Did my first day back at work today, and I feel like a terrible mummy, but I loved it and didn't really miss Will at all I'm sure the novelty will wear off soon enough, and I'll be wishing I could be at home playing with Will all day. The hardest part was having to get up and get me and William fed and dressed and out of the door by 8am, instead of still being in our pjs until midmorning. All DH had to do was drop William off at nursery, which he managed........it's just a shame the bag with his milk, sleeping bag and dummy was still in our lounge Poor DH had to go and buy bottles and formula and drop them off at nursery before he finally made it into work.

I though it would be cute to teach William how to splash the water when he's in the bath. He managed it all by himself for the first time 2 days ago, and it was really nice watching him gently splashing and giggling to himself. 48hrs later he's figured out that it's much more fun to splash with both arms and both legs all at the same time, so now it's pretty much impossible to bath him without getting soaked from head to toe

hello all!! thanks v much for all your kind congrats, very exciting to finally make it to the other side. Its been a bit of a shock to the system though!

B/feeding has been pretty tough. Had the cracked and bleeding nipples to start with (Lanisoh, Jelonet and co-drydamol helped...) and now they're not cracked or bleeding but like you crazyb just really sore. Had our latch checked so don't think its that - think I'm just a wuss sensitive soul. I am using Lilypadz - they are silicon breast pad things from Boots, and I highly recommend. I find them less sore than brushing against breast pads, and they also catch a little bit of milk that leaks out which I think is great for the healing in between feeds. I am perservering with the b/feeding for now, although we have introduced a bottle of formula at night for DH to do, but have to say am quite upset by how much I am not enjoying it. I think its not only the pain, but also being so restricted on what to wear and am terrified of feeding in public as C takes ages to latch and likes to come on and off often, making it very hard not to flash everyone. We are taking it a day as it comes.

The sleep deprivation is also quite something and probably makes everything worse. C is a frequent snacker and def not keen on sleeping (unless on me, DH or my mum) which means 1/2 hourly night time wake ups. Wise frolickers, does it get easier??

Mrsw, R sounds like a dream baby and you are coping so well! Maybe we could come to you for a bit and you can see if she can teach C how to sleep?! V impressed by how long you continued expressing. I am expressing at the moment too on the m/w's advice, takes bleedy forever. Crazyb I have an Avent hand pump. I find it much less sore than feeding as my nipple is not in contact with anything. My SIL recommended the Medela Swing electric pump so if we continue b/feeding for a bit I may invest in that.

bunny ooh can't believe you're back at work, was like yesterday you got your bfp! Lol re your DH leaving behind the bag with the milk. Baby C is only tiny but I have to say I loved being away from her for 20 minutes the other day (DH had her whilst I dashed around the supermarket doing an emergency nappy shop). I promptly burst into tears when I got back in the car as I felt so guilty for feeling like that and like a terrible mummy. Darn hormones...

Oh dear, baby was snoozing in the sling but has now wriggled her way into a v uncomfy position and woken herself up. She's not happy! Got to go - hello to everyone else!

Welcome cherry! Sorry to hear you're struggling with the feeding - it sucks that something so natural can be so difficult! Btw I recommend the Swing too - I found it quick and quiet!

Yep, the sleep will get better... And then worse... And then better again .... Don't forget that your LO is still very very new and enjoy the snuggles. Is cosleeping an option? Just grit your teeth, it will get better. You can see now why sleep deprivation is a form of torture! Oh and try not to feel guilty for enjoying the time to yourself, you need recovery time too and you'll be a better mummy if you get the break you need. You need to continue taking the regular me-time. I'm having mine at the moment while Lochie tips various board books off the bookcase and then tries to eat them... I figure it's good for him to learn independent play! Mind you, it's only a matter of time before he twigs that mummy is holding something shiny and crawl over to investigate!

bunny so pleased your first day went well and lol at your dh! Hope the positive start continues.

Hi,

Back again - hurrah for broadband! :)

Anyway, just a quick catch up with the most recent few posts, cause again I should really be busy!

MrsW - I don't think we ever "met" on the other thread, did we? My LO was probably just born round about the time you got your BFP... Funny feeling, makes him seem so old! (Spireal - you're probably used to this now, what with Mindy's first birthday fast approaching! Where does the time go?! Have you planned anything special yet?) Anyway, I was just going to add that I expressed for LO recently just before starting a course of antibiotics and though he's on solids, some formula, and only a little of my milk, it took FOREVER! Such a nuisance. I REALY don't think I could keep it up for long, so well done you for lasting as long as you did. :)

Hi Bunny. Yes and no... It's a bit complicated, to be honest. My LO can freely have any ready made thing that's got 0.3g of protein per 100g of product. Unfortunately, that rules out most things, becuase even non-meat containing pots/jars/pouches tend to have more protein than that in, either because they contain rice or pasta or milk, or even restricted fruit and veg like banana and broccoli. There are a few alternatives that are either just apple and pear, plain apple, apple and peach or apple and carrot but do you see a theme?! The companies just don't seem to want to leave the apple out, and while he is allowed it, I don't want all his food to taste the same, and more importantly, I don't want it all to be sweet. Also, another off-putting thing about that is that all the food is REALLY runny, suitable from 4mths, and LO prefers something more substantial. Then in addition to that, he has to have a protein substitute medicine made up and given to him before each meal, and he also, over the course of the day gets 4g of protein spread out evenly between his meals. And that protein has to take specific forms - ie. 25g of peas, or 35g of sweetcorn, 10g of Weetabix... All weighed out and measured, so again, ready made stuff's not suitable. As big a hassle as it is preparing stuff from scratch, I don't think there's any way round it. It gives LO a more normal diet too. I.e. This morning he had protein substitute, followed by 60g of (prescription) creamed porridge (1.5g protein), followed by kiwi fruit, orange and a little banana. Then for lunch he had protein substitute, homemade vegatable soup containing 35g of sweetcorn (another 1.5g of protein) and some homemade (using prescription flour) bread. And for dinner, he'll have his protein substitute and then we've got sausages made from scratch (using stuff got off prescription as well as freely allowed vegetables and herbs) with potatoes and peas, which will give him the remaining 2g of protein for today (I haven't worked out the weights yet!) But basically, much as I hate all the time spent in the kitchen, it's the only real way of giving him a "normal" (ish) diet.

Anyway, that was quite a rant! I'm glad you enjoyed your first day back at work. I don't think it makes you a bad mummy at all - just a human being! I can imagine it must be lovely to get out and have a few hours without worrying about being puked over! Lol!

Gosh, Will is such a little live-wire, isn't he?! He totally reminds me of my LO, always going that one step further! Keep meaning to ask you how Will is with his non-physical milestones? He and my LO were both very advanced in terms of everything physical, weren't they? But I sometimes wonder if that means with my LO if other things are taking a back seat... He's always just been on time with everything else. And I was reading a thing today that said some babies of my LO's age (8.5mths) can say "mama" and "dada" to the correct parent... My little man can say them okay, but not to us! I don't think he's slow, but does seem slow-er, if you know what I mean? Ah well, I'm not worried. Just curious!

Bugger! That's LO awake! I might get back later or it might be tomorrow, but I'll send this now in case something happens. Sorry to all I've missed out! Talk soon. x

Going onto formula won't do any harm to Robyn at all, MrsWajs. :) As you said, you gave her the most important breast milk. I can confirm there is no medal awarded for sticking out breast feeding, and formula is likely to be soooo much more convenient at times - especially growth spurts!

Is she smiling at you yet? :) It's really heart melting once you start getting smiles! I think that was around 8 weeks for Mindy.

I haven't left Mindy overnight yet, bunnygirl and she's just passed 11 months. However we have a weekend away booked next weekend, while the grandparents get to spoil look after their DGD. Sounds like so much fun with the bath! DH did bath time earlier and all I could hear from the other room was the sound of splashing water, squeals of delight from Mindy and howls of protest from DH.

It does get easier, Cherry. :) I promise! Practise feeding lying down if you can, then you can doze and feed at the same time. Just get your DH to watch you/C if you think you might actually fall asleep. The hormones get easier too with time!

Mindy hasn't said anything meaningful yet, WhiteRoses, so I wouldn't worry too much. We hear Mamamama, Dadadadada and (more commonly) Rarararara, but she's yet to say anything at the right time or to the right person.

She does however point at everything interesting, so we keep saying common words (like Door, Light, Cat) to her a lot. Hopefully she'll pick them up!

She's also learnt to crawl (finally!) in the last week. And she's frantically trying to pull herself up on everything. She's always been far ahead on fine motor skills, seems like she's catching up on the gross motor skills right now, then hopefully will work on communication.

We have all kinds of plans for her first birthday... The weekend before my parents are visiting, on the day DH and I have taken the day off work and we're going to take her out somewhere and then have some friends over for tea. Then DH's parents are visiting the weekend after. Then the weekend after that we're having a joint 1st and 30th birthday BBQ for Mindy and DH! July is one big party.

I already know Mindy is getting a sand pit and paddling pool from my parents for her birthday. DH and I have got her a lovely wall height chart that you can put pictures in.

I also just booked her MMR jab for the day after her birthday. [evil Mummy]

This was a very long post... for anyone that made it through the lot!

Cherry It definitely does get better! Doesn't seem like it at the time though! You sound a lot like I felt in the beginning wrt BFing, so well done you for persevering, I wish I could have but I really didn't enjoy it -i think it really is one of those things that isn't for everyone and we shouldn't feel guilty about it if it's not! Expressing for me was just the easiest way to appease my own guilt i think! Probably why i carried on for 6 weeks! As for sleeping i was pretty tough with Robyn in the first 2 weeks, probably made a little easier by the fact that i don't think i bonded with her immediately! i left her to cry on a few occasions and she just learned that no-one was going to pick her up at every little squeak! Can't say i find it as easy now though!

Sorry got called away by screaming baby before I'd finished there! Bathed and fed now though.

WhiteRoses No I don't think we have properly "met" - Hi! Here's me grumbling about BFing when you sound like you have a much more difficult task feeding your LO! Would I be right in thinking he has PKU? Think I remember reading that somewhere??

Spirael x-posts there. You're right there is no medal for breast feeding! And I'm glad my HV was of the same mentality, I think it would have been a whole lot more difficult stopping if she was a hitler 'breast is best' type!
Robyn has started smiling and kind of silently laughing too although it's not always consistent but it's definitely happening more regularly! Makes 4am so much more bearable, even though I'm trying to ignore her so she'll go straight back to sleep - impossible!! I actually overheard DP saying to her on a night feed the other day "stop it, stop smiling at me, it's bed time!!"

Bunny Glad your first day back at work was ok.

cherry it does get better. Each thing you go through seems like a massive challenge at the time, but it's all over with and you're onto the next challenge in a heartbeat. I found it got so much easier once I started getting some feedback from Will - smiles, giggles etc. - because at least then there's some reward for your efforts.

Will was the same with coming on and off while BFing at the start - it was like he would sample the milk to check it wasn't off before tucking in. He was about 8 weeks before I was confident enough to feed in public, and by 3months he was pretty much able to latch himself on to the merest hint of exposed nipple.

worrisome William also gets alot of time to do independent play

roses gosh that is a lot of cooking you're doing - you'll be able to go on Masterchef soon I reckon. I also found it quite annoying that most of the fruit and veg pouches are either 60% banana or apple, but they are convenient if we're out and about. Will's mastered slurping them straight from the pouch as well

As for non-physical development, he's pretty much average. With alot of the physical milestones he seems to reach them very early, but it then takes a while for his understanding of why he's doing it to catch up. For example, he could roll both ways by 13 weeks, but didn't really ever do it very often until he was well over 5months and he realised that rolling could get him closer to something he wanted. He's babbling away - he did pull off while I was feeding him the other day, look right into my eyes and said mama, but I think it was just random that he said it rather than knowing what to call me.

spirael I'm a little depressed at Mindy's rapidly approaching birthday as it's the day after mine, so I'm getting rapidly closer to being yet another year older. I've already started planning Will's 1st birthday extravaganza - I think it'll be more for me than him though

Hello all. We had to do without the internet for 6 days but I am back. Things are going well hear. Hannah is so alert and happy. The only tears we get are when she is overtired (which unfortunately is everyday - she just won't nap for very long and seems to make do on micro naps!) Anyway I spent a lot of my time bouncing her, walking her and trying to feed her to sleep. All the things that are frowned upon but otherwise she just stays awake/cries. Self settling can wait...

mrsw Sounds like Robyn is doing really well. I so am jealous of your night time sleep. Well done on expressing for so long. I just don't get chance to do it along with feeding, changing, playing, MNing etc.

crazy My nipples still feel sensitive 10 weeks in (towel goes under boobs after shower) but I have found that I get less and less painful feeds as the weeks have gone by. I think this as my milk supply has settled down. Now most are pain free and some are enjoyable. It does take time though. Some people a couple of weeks, others longer. I kind of like the night feeds as they are so cosy and snuggly. Although I would much prefer it if there was only 1 night feed, instead of 3. Oh and I still need breast pads. I wear reusable ones as the paper ones stick to my nipples. Lilypadz sound good though cherry although I worry I'd still leak too much for them..

cherry How old is LO? Bf took me a while to get used to - a day at a time sounds like a good idea. The bf/ff board is brilliant for any questions (I browse it constantly) and this thread in sleep might be of interest. It will get easier I promise. For night feeds I took the side off the cot bed, drag LO over to feed, slide back when done. Sometimes she stays in with me on my side (not in the middle) if she wakes more than twice when I slide her over to her bed. This might not work if your LO wants more contact but thought it was worth mentioning. Some of my bf support groups babies are sleeping through the night (or doing 5/6 hour stretches) Yours might soon be one of them!

whiteroses We want to move to a 3 bed house too. I bet its brilliant to have the space. Hope you get that second freezer soon, sounds like it would be a real help for you. Congrats on the tooth!

bunny Wow at being back at work already! Glad you enjoyed it - defiantly not a bad mummy. Bath time sounds like fun now - saves you having a bath I guess! Saying mama at you is so cute - I reckon you should count it as his first word!

Spireal One year old soon!! Wow..congrats on the crawling baby.

Hope this made sense - Hannah has napped for a record 45 mins in her bouncy chair whilst I typed as quick as I could. Time for a quick ?

Hi all

I'm not going to namecheck as so much has happened since I last read this thread/posted on the ante-natal thread.

Here's my birth story:
Started having contractions at 2am on Tuesday morning. They were fairly irregular - anywhere between 10 and 5 minutes apart and not all that strong. At 11am we headed into the birth unit (40 minutes away from where we live). I had a vaginal examination and they said that I was not dilated at all and that my cervix was still posterior. This was a bit crap. We were sent away and went out for lunch and hung around as I didn't want to go home. Managed to get a brief nap of 30 mins or so as the contractions calmed down during the afternoon.

We then popped back into the birth unit and agreed to go home and wait to see if things would happen. I continued to have contractions which were getting closer and closer together. DP went to bed and got some sleep as I figured there was no point in the two of us being awake. At 2am I was sat at our dining room table leaning over a chair, dosing between contractions which were about 7 mins apart. At this point I called the local hospital just for some reassurance. Despite going to two sets of ante-natal classes, I didn't realise that slow labour could take so long and be so painful. The hospital were lovely and convinced me that all was normal and to relax a bit.

I eventually got fed up at the dining table and went through to lie on a beanbag in the living room. I was finally managing to catch a wee bit of sleep when my waters went at about 4:30am. Not a huge, floor wetting gush, but half a pint or so. Thankfully I had a pad in! I woke DP and called the birth unit. Unfortunately the unit had another lady in who was having to be transferred to the big hospital so they did not have enough midwives to take us. We had to go straight to the big hospital. I called them and DP showered and we headed in.

We got to hospital about 6am. I puked almost immediately. I was struggling a little with the pain so was given paracetamol and something stronger (not sure what, a tablet, co something?). Contractions were less than five minutes apart. I was examined and was 3cm dilated. I was not comfortable in bed and the contractions were beginning to feel like I was needing to poo. Going to the toilet was pretty difficult as contractions seemed to intensify when I was sitting down.

I'm a bit sketchy on the timing through the day, but I know that I stood up the entire day as lying/sitting were just too painful. I started the gas and air about 2 or 3pm when I was 5cm dilated. By 5pm I was 9cm dilated. (What a long day!) I started pushing about 8 or 9pm. I was up on the bed, leaning forward over the back of it.

After I'd been pushing for over two hours my face began to feel funny and tight. I asked DP if my cheek was swelled up and he said yes. He pointed it out to the midwife. Within ten minutes my other cheek had also swollen up and my left eye was puffy too. The midwife was quite concerned and went to get a doctor.

The doctor came to see me and immediately decided that I had 'subcutaneous emphysema'. He explained that I'd pushed so hard that I'd punctured my lung and that I would have to stop pushing. He also explained about a pneumothorax and suggested that I might have one. This is when there is air in between the chest wall and the lung due to puncture and can be fatal. It's also known as a collapsed lung. There were a number of people milling about from then on, and the midwife sister came through and one point and suggested that it was only an allergic reaction and I'd be fine if I had antihistamines. (This was clearly not the case, the woman was off her head).

The doctor told me to stop pushing and also to stop using the gas and air. Not a good combination, I was in agony.

The anaesthetist (sp?) came to see me and the doctor started talking about giving me a chest x-ray. I told the doctor that there was no chance they were giving me an x-ray until the baby was out. It was decided that the baby would be delivered with forceps so I was rushed through to theatre pretty sharpish and had to sit still with no pain relief while they put the spinal block in. I was taken to theatre ahead of a woman who was having twins delivered by emergency section and the procedure was overseen by the senior consultant anaesthetist.

There was real concern that I'd need a c-section as they did not want to have to intubate me because of the possible collapsed lung. I still don't know what would have happened if I'd had to have an emergency section - I think there would have been full scale panic.

When I was in the theatre, DS's heart rate started to drop and they were quite concerned, so things speeded up even more. I was rolled onto my left hand side on what seemed like a very tiny bed to support my weight.

The spinal anaesthetic was absolutely amazing. I could not feel anything from my boobs down and all the pain was completely gone. I did not even know when I was contracting.

DP was allowed in to hold my hand and watch. The doctor got the forceps sorted out and DS was born in three contractions. He was popped onto my chest and DP said 'it's a boy'. We had been convinced he would be a girl so my first word was 'really?'. I stroked his skin and he was so soft. He didn't breathe straight away, so the midwife picked him up and took him over to a side table. I told DP to go with them as I did not want DS to be alone. He started breathing pretty quickly after that.

DS was bundled up and put on my chest and we were wheeled through to the recovery room. DP called my parents to tell them and my mum's first reaction was 'it's a boy, really?'. We had been in recovery a couple of minutes when two people came through with an x-ray machine. DP was asked to take DS out of the room while I was x-rayed and the woman in the next bed was given a lead jacket to protect her as she was still pregnant.

Harris James was born at 2319 on Thursday April 21st and weighed 8lb 3oz. We were allowed to spend time together as a family and at 5am I sent DP away so that he could get some sleep. At this stage I had not slept for longer than 30 minutes since 2am on Tuesday, so I was completely and totally knackered. DS was a bit unsettled at around 7am so one of the midwives offered to look after him while I got some sleep. I still feel bad that I said yes, but I know that there was really no alternative. I napped for about 40 minutes and woke up desperate to have my baby back.

The anasthetist came to see me and told me that the x-ray showed that I did not have a collapsed lung, but that there was a dark area on it showing a 'leak' rather than a full scale collapse. She said that it should heal by itself but should I have any symptoms that I would need to seek medical help asap. Apparently this happens in 1 in 100,000 births, so is pretty unusual.

The doctor was amazing in diagnosing it so quickly. The situation could have gone much more seriously wrong had I been allowed to keep pushing/keep taking the gas and air. Gas and air thins the air in the lungs so more of it could escape through a smaller hole.

It took a couple of weeks for the swelling in my face to settle down and I was coughing quite a bit for a few days. Obviously I also had stitches because of the forceps delivery which also took a couple of weeks to heal.

We were allowed out of hospital pretty quickly (probably too quickly) on the friday night. Breastfeeding was not really established but we thought we were doing okay. DS was latching on for about 5 minutes at a time and I was feeding on demand. We had lots of visitors over the weekend, but on Sunday things started to go downhill. DS cried most of the day then cried the whole day on Monday. By 3am on the Tuesday morning DS was still crying and had only stopped to sleep. After some heated discussion with DP (lack of sleep and stress and worry), I called NHS 24 who sent us to our local hospital. The doctor did not know what was wrong with him, so sent us to the big hospital. She arsed around a lot and really pissed us off. When we got to the big hospital we were made to wait again.

The nurses reckoned that DS was hungry. They weighed him and he had lost 15% of his birth weight in 5 days so they advised giving formula. I was just so desperate for him to be okay that I agreed. I do not regret the decision at all, the poor kid was half starved. He took about 50 mls of formula (a LOT for his weight) and fell straight into a contented sleep. I felt like such a total failure. How had we not realised that this was what was wrong with him?

The nurses had me express milk and I got about 160mls first go. They were amazed. We were asked to stay in hospital so that we could get DS's weight loss sorted out. I continued to express and was feeding DS three hourly and expressing three hourly. By the end of the first day I had produced enough milk to feed him with EBM from a bottle entirely so he did not get any more formula. He gained weight very quickly and was back over his birth weight by day 7.

On the Thursday of that week we saw a breastfeeding midwife who said that I was doing everything right with regard to trying to latch him on and she thought that it was just that he had too small a mouth and I had too big breasts/too flat nipples. I felt a little better after this as it was not 'my fault' as much as I thought it had been earlier. She suggested trying nipple shields then topping up with expressed milk after each feed.

On the Friday we were allowed home again and made a fresh start. It took just over a week for DS to be taking entirely from the nipple shield and not requiring any bottle top ups.

Since then DS has been gaining weight at an incredible rate (9.5oz 2 weeks in a row) and is now weighing in somewhere around 11.5lbs at 7 weeks. I haven't had him weighed for a couple of weeks though so this is guesstimating.

The health visitor could not believe how much milk I was producing. She came in one day and there was a bottle on the table. She asked if it was my expressed milk (there was about 70ml). I said no, that it was what had leaked out of the left hand side while I was feeding from the right. She was slightly shocked and stopped pestering me to get rid of the nipple shields after that.

Over the past 24 hours we have been trying feeding without the nipple shields though, as they are too much hassle and it's been going pretty well. I'm hoping that this will continue and that we'll be off them completely in a couple of weeks.

DS has also had colic (on top of everything else!) so we've been using colief for the past 3 weeks. We had one day when he screamed in pain the entire day. I then tried infacol with his evening feed and he did two absolutely huge burps then stopped screaming and went to sleep. It was only after this that I spoke to the health visitor about colic and she suggested colief.

He has been much better on the colief. For the past week every night bar one he's only been having one night wakening - sleeping 10 til 2 or 3 and then 3 or 4 until 5 or 6. I'm beginning to feel a bit more human with the extra sleep.

DP and I are both completely besotted with DS, but have found things a little hard going at times. We've had a few arguments which we wouldn't normally have and we've been much snippier with eachother than normal. DP has been working almost every day since he returned from paternity leave (including weekends and 2 evenings a week) and does a physical job, so he is about as knackered as I am which isn't helping. I'm sure we'll get through this though and that it's just caused by tiredness.

I've also been working a few hours a week since DS was 3 weeks old. I don't get maternity leave so it's been necessary, if a bit crap.
On Monday I have an appointment with the consultant at the hospital to discuss the birth and how it went. I'm fairly certain that if I was to get pregnant again I'd be under consultant care, and I also think that they might suggest ELCS for any future babies, but we'll have to see what they say.

Phew. That was some length of post. I feel better to have written some of that down though. DS is in his moby sling fast asleep. Probably the best purchase we have made (self settling is also something to deal with in the future for us!)

Right, where was I?!

Cherry - I don't think we've met either? Sorry to hear you're having such a hard time of it with the feeding. To be honest, I can't understand anyone who says they enjoy it. Nearly nine months in, I'm still at it, but it's purely for LO's benefit, not mine. It no longer hurts (though not strictly true - sometimes when he's tired, LO has a habit of latching on and off and that does make my nipples feel a bit grazed, though luckily that's normally at night, so then they do have a chance to heal up). Anyway, it's not like it was in the early days, where I dreaded LO wanting to feed, but it's still a pain in the backside. I leak, my chest feels ready to explode if LO takes too long a gap between feeds, I worry about exposing myself in public, I have to wear a giant nursing bra so that makes wearing nice feminine summer tops an impossibility, I can't leave LO for any length of time because he's so dependant on me... The list's endless. They say it's good for bonding but in my opinion even that's a load of rubbish. Giving LO a bottle, I can chat to him and look into his eyes - with BF, he's away down on my chest, facing into me, eyes shut and I'm just sitting there, supporting his weight, often with my back at a silly angle, waiting for him to finish. I don't care what the midwives lead you to believe, breastfeeding might be best for baby (hence the reason I persevered) but it's not always best for you. In the beginning, I felt like a complete failure for not enjoying it, but then I talked to my mum, who breastfed all three of us, and she completely stunned me when she told me of the relief she felt when she finally moved each of us onto bottles at 6mths. It was nice to think I wasn't alone. Anyway, I guess what I'm saying is good for you for doing it, and please don't feel upset over not enjoying it.

As for sleepless nights, how awful. I was very lucky in that respect so I don't have any advice, but I'm sure it will get easier eventually. It is still very early days. [hug]

Worrisome - wow at Lochie crawling! How old is he now? I'm terrible for losing track... I thought he was a good bit (few weeks?) younger than my LO? I often think we should have a list up on this forum like we did on the other, with our LO's birthdays. My poor brain can't keep up at times!

Yay! That's me caught up to yesterday! Just the past 24hrs to do now! (Please stay asleep, LO!)

Oooh, Spireal - lucky you - a whole weekend away! I'm jealous! Though I bet you don't stop thinking and talking about Mindy the whole time! :) Aww, lol at Mindy pointing! I always love hearing you talk about her cause she's the eldest on here, so it gives an idea of what's coming next for us! :)

Wow! July IS a busy month for you, right enough! Sounds great! What date is the birthday again? I'm thinking the 7th but am probably totally wrong! Like I say, I often wish there was a list to refer to!

MrsW - hi! Yeh, PKU... Though no matter how difficult it is to feed him now and no matter how hard it will be in the future, I still maintain that those early days of breastfeeding were the worst by far. Particularly awful feeling that you have no support because nobody but you can do it. Aww, how lovely about Robyn smiling/laughing. Motherhood just gets better and better, doesn't it? I think in the beginning you think you couldn't possibly love more than you already do, but then you get the smiles, then the laughs, then the moving about, the "chatting", all these little things, just more and more personality coming through by the day - it's wonderful!

Bunny - good old Will, making things easy for you, taking his food straight from the pouch! Lol! I can't believe you're planning his first birthday already though! SO what are the plans? I imagine we'll probably have a lot of visitors over for our LO's, but I haven't really thought about what to do yet... Figured September's ages away yet, though you're making me look a right slacker! Lol!

Halo - I was the same with my LO, not wanting to force him to self-soothe. I didn't see the point. I spent a few weeks doing what you're doing while he went through a silly "must fight sleep" phase, but that seems to have passed now, and while he still doesn't like to admit he's tired, if I lie him down and ignore him (not when he cries, but when he tries to sit up/play), he tends to get the message and drifts off himself. So I'm glad I ignored all advice (from parents, in-laws and DH), because it seems to have worked out in the end (I shouldn't tempt fate!) and LO has still never had to cry himself to sleep, which is something that admittedly wouldn't kill him, but might just kill me! Lol!

Jolly - just hada a quick skim through your post - don't think I've met you before either... Anyway, you sound like you've had quite an ordeal, but with little Harris beside you, I'm sure you feel it's all worth it! :)

Right, miraculously, LO's still asleep, so I'm going to go and start lunch and then if he hasn't woken, I'll have to wake him, I think! Very unusual, though perhaps something to do with having had a very wakeful night.... Perhaps another tooth?

Hi Roses lovely to see you and your lovely long posts back! Sounds like your little one's feeding regimen is an absolute mission. Are you going back to work and if so, what are you doing re LO's care? Just wondering how a nursery would cope with a PKU feeding program!

Yep, Lochie is proper crawling now (unless he wants to get somewhere super quick and he drops to his tum). He's also pulling himself up and cruising the furniture and today he used his highchair to 'walk' himself across the kitchen! He's 7.5 months so is quite a bit ahead of where he's meant to be. He's always been a strong wee thing though, he never had that whole floppy newborn head thing, so I was expecting him to be a wiggly monkey! He just never stops now, but at least I can get on with things in the house - I just have a little shadow!

Spireal I can't believe Mindy is almost 1! Your plans for her birthday sounds so nice, apart from the jabs of course! The wall chart sounds great, would you mind posting a link? It's something I've been thinking about for Lochie and like the idea of one you can add photos to. What age did Mindy start pointing? And is she waving? So cool, I love the fact that our little ones are starting to get real proper personalities!

MrsW the smiling is infectious isn't it? I had to tell DH not to engage with Lochie during the night time feeds as otherwise he thinks it's playtime and is a nightmare to get back to sleep, but sometimes it's just too hard!

bunny I reckon Will knew exactly what he was saying - how lovely! We've not had much 'mamama' babbling from Lochie, although he does tend to say 'dedede' a lot, especially when he's pulling himself up on something, it's hilarious. I will be very if his first word is Daddy!

halo I'm another one with a micro-napping baby. Lochie cat napped from about 3 months and has only just started lengthening the naps. However, he's just not a sleeper by nature and is so active. Completely agree with leaving the self-settling alone, she'll work it out. I say do what you need to do in order to get the baby to sleep. They change so quickly - for the last month or so, Lochie has been rocked to sleep for naps but now he's started getting irritated by that, so I just rock him to drowsy and then put him in the cot and stroke his cheek and sing 'You are my sunshine' over and over and over and over again... It seems to work!

Jolly welcome to the other side! I don't think we 'met' on the other board either, but congrats on Harris! (Love the name btw). Sounds like you had a nightmare of a time. Poor you re the colic. Hopefully you will find it calms down - Lochie had terrible wind when he was tiny but as his digestive system matured it calmed right down.

Oh, I wanted to ask if anyone had any handy hairwashing tips? We used to bath Lochie in one of those plastic bath seats so it was easy to wash his hair with a flannel. However, now he's a big boy and therefore sits in the bath on a non-slip mat, hairwashing has become a huge battle. If I try and lie him back, he just flips over and dunks his head under the water. I got one of those jugs with the soft plastic bit at the front to use but it freaks him out so much that if he sees me filling it with water he starts crying. Are those shampoo shields any good? Should I just try with a flannel, or persevere with the jug? I'm worried I'm going to give him a complex and he'll never be able to go near a barber shop...

Hope everyone has had a lovely week!