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Politics

Why is socialism viewed so negatively in politics and media?

630 replies

Vix150 · 08/04/2026 23:37

Why do people not like socialism?

To me it doesn't seem disastrous but it's portrayed in the media as a horrific way for a society to run.

Any thoughts?

OP posts:
SharonEllis · 09/04/2026 22:10

Pineneedlesincarpet · 09/04/2026 22:02

"you need a form of socialism for society to survive , otherwise with capitalism you get the Victorian era type society"

I'm not 100% sure this is high skilled debating? I feel you may need to put your own house in order before you criticise others.

Absolutely this. And anyway, this is not a debating society which is an artificial form of discussion anyway. People can have perfectly valid points and make insightful & persuasive comments without following academic rules.

Sillycake · 09/04/2026 22:11

not to mention

"Who judges what opinion has merit and what opinion doesn't, m'lud?"

talk about a hypocrite

Sillycake · 09/04/2026 22:12

so i get called on using oxfords guides when judging others points.

yet when i use a tool to help me better then im judged because of i tool i used.

again hypocrites anyone ?

Pineneedlesincarpet · 09/04/2026 22:14

Sillycake · 09/04/2026 22:11

not to mention

"Who judges what opinion has merit and what opinion doesn't, m'lud?"

talk about a hypocrite

I'm not holding myself out as a great debating genius though? Unlike you. So logically I can't be accused of hypocrisy.

Important to have evidence to back up your arguments when debating. Top tip for you.

Sillycake · 09/04/2026 22:15

Pineneedlesincarpet · 09/04/2026 22:14

I'm not holding myself out as a great debating genius though? Unlike you. So logically I can't be accused of hypocrisy.

Important to have evidence to back up your arguments when debating. Top tip for you.

it does when its in context of a tool i used

GarlicFind · 09/04/2026 22:15

Pineneedlesincarpet · 09/04/2026 21:56

"Not every opinion has merit"

Who judges what opinion has merit and what opinion doesn't, m'lud?

The usual expression is "You are entitled to your own opinion, but you are not entitled to your own facts."

The Heritage Foundation defines capitalism by freedom of markets. The UK ranks as very free, 10th on their index after places like Singapore, Switzerland and Ireland.
https://economicfreedom.heritage.org/pages/dataviz

If you switch the criteria to 'financial freedom', the UK ranks as very free.
Switch to 'government spending' and the picture reverses.
This helps to illustrate how various economies balance the needs of the many with the bounties of the few.

Why is socialism viewed so negatively in politics and media?
Pineneedlesincarpet · 09/04/2026 22:16

Sillycake · 09/04/2026 22:15

it does when its in context of a tool i used

You aren't making any sense again. Sorry. I know you have extremely high standards of debate (using AI to argue with the rest of us who aren't) but sometimes I think you might make a clearer point if you just use your own brain to make a point?

Pineneedlesincarpet · 09/04/2026 22:17

GarlicFind · 09/04/2026 22:15

The usual expression is "You are entitled to your own opinion, but you are not entitled to your own facts."

The Heritage Foundation defines capitalism by freedom of markets. The UK ranks as very free, 10th on their index after places like Singapore, Switzerland and Ireland.
https://economicfreedom.heritage.org/pages/dataviz

If you switch the criteria to 'financial freedom', the UK ranks as very free.
Switch to 'government spending' and the picture reverses.
This helps to illustrate how various economies balance the needs of the many with the bounties of the few.

What point are you trying to make? Chat GPT is busy tonight....

Sillycake · 09/04/2026 22:18

Pineneedlesincarpet · 09/04/2026 22:16

You aren't making any sense again. Sorry. I know you have extremely high standards of debate (using AI to argue with the rest of us who aren't) but sometimes I think you might make a clearer point if you just use your own brain to make a point?

that is my own brain and its the reason i need the tool, because i can understand what i want to write, i just cannot always write it in a logical way and as ive already proven my words confuse you,

so i cannot win, i use a tool and its omg, i be me and your confused with my words, so now you can understand why i need the tool

Pineneedlesincarpet · 09/04/2026 22:19

Sillycake · 09/04/2026 22:18

that is my own brain and its the reason i need the tool, because i can understand what i want to write, i just cannot always write it in a logical way and as ive already proven my words confuse you,

so i cannot win, i use a tool and its omg, i be me and your confused with my words, so now you can understand why i need the tool

Ok. Thanks though.

Sillycake · 09/04/2026 22:19

Pineneedlesincarpet · 09/04/2026 22:17

What point are you trying to make? Chat GPT is busy tonight....

Edited

thats garlic and if they are right why does it matter. you dont say did you use your brain or did you read a book so why should ai be any different ?

Pineneedlesincarpet · 09/04/2026 22:21

Sillycake · 09/04/2026 22:19

thats garlic and if they are right why does it matter. you dont say did you use your brain or did you read a book so why should ai be any different ?

Yes I know thats Garlic.

I feel you two may be sitting together on the sofa with Chat GPT out...🤣

It's been fun. Sort of. Am off now.

Sillycake · 09/04/2026 22:22

Pineneedlesincarpet · 09/04/2026 22:19

Ok. Thanks though.

the overall point im trying to make, is the debates would be alot better if people stayed on topic when debating and then admit when one side or another is correct or at least has good points, to often the debates end up as a bun fight so to speak

GarlicFind · 09/04/2026 22:23

Pineneedlesincarpet · 09/04/2026 22:17

What point are you trying to make? Chat GPT is busy tonight....

Edited

Fuck me.

If you can't see the point I was trying to make about balancing capitalist policies with socialist ones, I'm definitely wasting my time.

If you can't believe anyone can write a coherent eight-line post all by themselves, we're barely even speaking the same language.

Sillycake · 09/04/2026 22:25

GarlicFind · 09/04/2026 22:23

Fuck me.

If you can't see the point I was trying to make about balancing capitalist policies with socialist ones, I'm definitely wasting my time.

If you can't believe anyone can write a coherent eight-line post all by themselves, we're barely even speaking the same language.

thats the other problem these days on threads, as you say when people write a very good points if it counters x person, people then like to go oh its ai rather than debate the points

Sillycake · 09/04/2026 22:26

The Victorian Exhibit: Pure Capitalism’s Laboratory of Horror

Consider Britain in the heart of the 19th century, the world’s first industrial superpower under near-laissez-faire capitalism—minimal regulation, no welfare state, private profit as the sole arbiter. The Industrial Revolution generated unprecedented wealth: Britain became the richest nation on Earth. Yet three-quarters of the population, the working class, lived in conditions that would shame a medieval dungeon.

Factory and mine workers adults, women, and children as young as five—laboured 12 to 18 hours daily in unventilated, rat-infested hellholes. Children hauled coal through tunnels too narrow for adults, scrambled under machinery for spilled cotton, or swept chimneys until their bodies deformed. Malnutrition produced rickets; accidents maimed or killed without compensation; disease (cholera, typhus) ravaged overcrowded slums where families of ten shared a single damp room with no sanitation.

Wages were starvation-level—under £100 a year for most families—with no savings, no sick pay, no pensions. The Poor Law of 1834 offered only the workhouse: a deterrent so brutal it separated families and forced the able-bodied into virtual penal servitude.

Wealth?

Concentrated beyond imagination. The top 10% owned the vast bulk of land, capital, and political power; the bottom 50% owned virtually nothing. Inequality metrics from the era—top income shares approaching 40% for the richest 5%, wealth Gini equivalents far above modern levels—paint a society of two nations, as Benjamin Disraeli described: the rich in their drawing rooms, the poor in their graves.

This was not aberration; it was the logical outcome of unregulated markets. Employers competed ruthlessly: cut wages, extend hours, ignore safety, externalise costs onto workers and the environment.

The “invisible hand” delivered innovation and growth, yes—but at the price of human lives treated as disposable inputs. Without countervailing power, capitalism’s profit imperative creates a race to the bottom. As one contemporary observer noted, life was “as cheap at home as it was at work.”

Sillycake · 09/04/2026 22:29

Honourable assembly, history’s verdict is final: laissez-faire capitalism produces Victorian England—wealth for the few, misery for the many, instability for all. A calibrated form of socialism—welfare safety nets, labour rights, public provision—does not destroy markets; it domesticates them, ensuring society survives as something worth living in. We have the data, the precedents, the moral imperative. Reject the Victorian path. Embrace the hybrid that works. The alternative is not progress—it is relapse into a past we outgrew only by rejecting pure capitalism.
The motion carries. Society needs socialism to survive.

GarlicFind · 09/04/2026 22:40

Thanks @Sillycake (and your AI scribe)! I can imagine Charles Dickens being sneered at on this thread, told his ideas were unworkable and the poor must suffer for the nation's freedoms 😏

Sillycake · 09/04/2026 22:56

GarlicFind · 09/04/2026 22:40

Thanks @Sillycake (and your AI scribe)! I can imagine Charles Dickens being sneered at on this thread, told his ideas were unworkable and the poor must suffer for the nation's freedoms 😏

Thank you, its a great tool when it behaves, i would rather not use it bit it helps me make my points. it would be nice to debate with people even if using ai because then it can help to have some good and interesting debates. but the problem these days is trying to have the debate when everyone is busy going naughty you used ai

SevenYellowHammers · 10/04/2026 01:30

Pineneedlesincarpet · 09/04/2026 21:42

What "media" are you referring to and what are their viewing/readership figures? So we can judge the influence they may have on people's poor view of socialism. (Other than the common sense view that socialism doesn't work, which people don't need to find out from the "media" but just have to live through a Labour government).

I am referring to mainstream media in particular newspapers which whilst do not command the same circulation in physical form, the headlines are still regularly reported on broadcast and digital media. Even publications with low physical and online circulation such as The Spectator are given oxygen by the the BBC to spread their vitriol. As for socialism not working, we’ve had an albeit attacked and diminished version for 80 years and it’s worked remarkably well despite attacks from the ruling classes. If socialism didn’t “work” (by which I mean provide some basic rights like healthcare and education to the working classes) then it wouldn’t come under attack from the ruling classes and the USA as much as it does. Common sense is a phrase often used in place of a hegemonic stance supporting capitalism. A lazy expression.

MsAmerica · 10/04/2026 02:43

Because it terrifies capitalists.

SharonEllis · 10/04/2026 06:06

Sillycake · 09/04/2026 22:56

Thank you, its a great tool when it behaves, i would rather not use it bit it helps me make my points. it would be nice to debate with people even if using ai because then it can help to have some good and interesting debates. but the problem these days is trying to have the debate when everyone is busy going naughty you used ai

Its not helping you at all as I have no idea what point you are making.

Pineneedlesincarpet · 10/04/2026 06:28

SevenYellowHammers · 10/04/2026 01:30

I am referring to mainstream media in particular newspapers which whilst do not command the same circulation in physical form, the headlines are still regularly reported on broadcast and digital media. Even publications with low physical and online circulation such as The Spectator are given oxygen by the the BBC to spread their vitriol. As for socialism not working, we’ve had an albeit attacked and diminished version for 80 years and it’s worked remarkably well despite attacks from the ruling classes. If socialism didn’t “work” (by which I mean provide some basic rights like healthcare and education to the working classes) then it wouldn’t come under attack from the ruling classes and the USA as much as it does. Common sense is a phrase often used in place of a hegemonic stance supporting capitalism. A lazy expression.

Common sense as in you would draw your own conclusions from your own lived experience of a period under Labour. Which is seldom a great experience for the UK. Rather than relying on "the media" to form your views. I'd suggest that's the approach of most people.

"Socialism" isn't what provides "some basic rights like healthcare and education to the working classes".

I have no views on socialism in the USA as I live in the UK.

Pineneedlesincarpet · 10/04/2026 06:32

GarlicFind · 09/04/2026 22:23

Fuck me.

If you can't see the point I was trying to make about balancing capitalist policies with socialist ones, I'm definitely wasting my time.

If you can't believe anyone can write a coherent eight-line post all by themselves, we're barely even speaking the same language.

Sorry. It was the classic of "balance the needs of the many with the bounties of the few" that was a step too far. Too good.

Alexandra2001 · 10/04/2026 07:36

Pineneedlesincarpet · 10/04/2026 06:28

Common sense as in you would draw your own conclusions from your own lived experience of a period under Labour. Which is seldom a great experience for the UK. Rather than relying on "the media" to form your views. I'd suggest that's the approach of most people.

"Socialism" isn't what provides "some basic rights like healthcare and education to the working classes".

I have no views on socialism in the USA as I live in the UK.

I thought the period 1997 to 2010, even with the GFC, was considerably better than prior or post 2010, where we had Austerity, Brexit, Division, Truss, Covid, Ukraine and now Iran... all either badly handled or supported by the 'right wing...

Less and less people now have worked under a pre 1997 Labour Govt... the 'rightwing are responsible for what has gone wrong in the UK since 1945.

A form of Socialism is exactly what has provided basic health, educational & welfare needs in the UK...

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