Starmer Must Go

[BisiBodi]

I made a lengthy post yesterday (on this thread: www.mumsnet.com/talk/politics/5333405-changes-to-immigration-rules-announced-by-starmer?page=2 @ 17:43 if you want to read it) regarding the horrendous "island of strangers" speech by Starmer
Today, Kier Starmer has decided to say that immigration has done "incalculable damage" to the country. My despair and fury over this, and the general direction of labour, warrants its own thread.

Starmer claimed in writing that immigrants have put too much pressure on housing and public services (they don't, and he previously said they don't). He added that the immigration system is “almost designed to permit abuse” and that it risks “pulling the country apart”. He said that he wanted to close a “squalid chapter” in our country’s history (of too much immigration in the last few years), and then he seemed to quote the Rivers of Blood speech and said that without significantly reducing immigration the UK risks becoming “an island of strangers".

He's doing this because he's proposing new laws to make immigration harder and bring net migration down (except they definitely won't). Stuff like increasing it to 10 years before you can apply for indefinite leave to remain (10 years!!), introducing English language tests (in a post that suggests Welsh doesn't exist), reducing social care visas (the system would collapse in a day), being tougher on overseas students and reducing the time they can stay after graduation (if you reduce their numbers at all then Universities will be bankrupt immediately), new ID cards, reduce (oh sorry, "clarify") the amount ECHR article 8 can be used to justify people staying on human rights grounds, etc.

When someone pointed out that high migration helps economies and low hurts them, and that this is true in the EU right now and all over the world, Starmer didn't think so. He said that immigration has been high in the UK but the economy has been stagnant, so there can't be any link. Yes Keir, but the economy was stagnant during A PANDEMIC AND ENERGY CRISIS AND COST OF LIVING CRISIS AND EXPENSIVE NEW WARS AND GLOBAL MARKET TRUMP TURMOIL. If the immigrants hadn't kept us level, your "stagnant" economy would have plummeted like a rock. You cannot possibly be presenting that as X=Y in a total vacuum.

This kind of xenophobia doesn't need explaining, but it's worth saying why it won't work and will lose Labour a lot of votes:

• Conservative and Reform voters do NOT change their vote to Labour ever, so this pandering is worthless. But Labour can lose votes to the Greens and LDs at a high rate. Nearly ALL the Reform votes come from former Conservatives.
• Public concern about immigration is low and goes up and down exactly with how much the press is currently going on about it (see the graph) so is not worth alienating your voter base about
• And it is alienating voters, because you've heard this kind of rhetoric before but it was from the actual NF and BNP
• The Mail's headline today was still attacking Labour because it is impossible to ever go far enough for them, or for Reform voters. Nothing is ever enough.

So, Labour saying "Reform are right actually" won't bring a single voter over to Labour, but it sure will lose you a few. Or, er, a lot. People are resigning their Labour membership and sounding furious. I haven't seen a single event trigger this much outrage from the public (and Labour MPs) in quite a while. Starmer has hugely damaged himself. Germany's far-right AfD are praising him, that's the level it's at.

I already left for the Greens, but today has me going even further. I think it's now worth the potential chaos to get rid of Starmer's version of Labour. In a timely article today, Nesrine Malik called our current elections "hostage politics". You MUST vote Labour or the Tories will get in. Now you MUST vote Labour or Reform will get in.

I don't respond well to threats. Never have. I tend to escalate. And I'm bored of their crap: more cuts, keeping first-past-the-post even though Labour members want PR, refusing to talk about rejoining the EU even though Labour members (and the majority of the country) want full rejoin, this xenophobic shit which goes against everything Starmer said about immigration when he was running for leader (but then he's broken every pledge from that time), the anti-trans bollocks, coming for the disabled PIP and saying all benefits are too high and that people are taking advantage of handouts and all the rest.

Fuck these guys. There's pragmatic politics where you compromise, and then there's this literal far-right shit that means you personally HAVE to be comfortable with saying it in public. It's about the soul of the PM and the party. Today is way over the line of sensible cross-party anything.

And I'm done with hostage politics. What, so we keep Labour in for 8 more years of... this? Of the same or more cuts? I'm rapidly approaching the point where smashing this Labour party so that they never try to be centre- / far-right again would do more good than the short-term harm.

Voters didn't show unwavering support for Labour at the last election, they showed that they will be extremely flexible and vote for whoever can win in their area. If Labour become unpopular in the polls, that will be someone else and not them. Labour's lead is incredibly fragile and changeable and today's performance is EXACTLY how they lose it and deserve to lose it. Yes, some young men went to Reform before the election... and twice as many young women went to the Greens. Labour's share fell 21% in 18-24 year olds. You cannot gain a single Reform vote by going right. It will never be far-right enough.
Saying that Reform are correct and using their rhetoric in speeches and changing your policies to theirs is NOT how you defeat them, or run a country.

Replace Starmer, quickly. At the very least.

And so what is the purpose of this thread, other than to vent into an online echo-chamber? I think it's a request to a call to action. It's a call out to everyone who currently resides - whether you like it or not - in a Labour controlled constituency and has a labour MP.

You can easily find out the details, together with links to their speeches and/or voting records, from service such as They Work For You.
Check the details of your MP, and especially their stance on immigration and other matters important to you, then email them.

Yes. And it precedes Trumps tariff rollercoasters and the employment right's bill. There's a reason why the boe keeps revising down the growth forecast.

I disagree. I think that they extended their disbelief that Labour would have this in hand and so cared more about those other issues. Once it was apparent that they had yet again been hoodwinked, then immigration has become the leading issue. Still though, Keir seems happy to jump on board and try and make hay with his island of strangers speech, wouldn't you say?

Yes, there also seems to have been a rush in production and export to beat Trump's tariffs. There is likely to be a correction in Q2.

Things have moved on since the GE. There’s no point in looking back to a past poll either.

People are showing now how they feel and Reform are capitalising on the immigration issue. Legal version was in the headlines but it’s also crossings that drive votes to Reform, and smash the gangs won’t do it.

Obviously if there are ID cards there would also have to be enforcement and regular checks. So no access to services without documented paperwork, including schools and healthcare. One would have to discuss what temporary ID cards genuine refugee cases would get.
If the Germans are not enforcing it properly that is their issue.

What's frustrating is that construction is floundering, I wonder when we can see growth from the boom in housing construction and the promised 1.5 million new homes? <tumbleweed>

So there would have to be raids on car wash places, all those dodgy tax evasion etc going on all over the UK costing the country 100 billion a year. And you may have to criminalise people using those places.
So criminalise the normal British people using cheap labour that is illegal. That is what they do in eg Switzerland.

Regarding construction, they should be training up all the illegals already here as they cannot send them back to be labourers on construction sites. Temporary measures. It is migrant workers who rebuilt after the 2nd world war.

Agreed. Construction sector is showing the biggest decline in job vacancies in the latest ONS figures.

You can disagree as much as you like, those are the facts. In what way has the population been “hoodwinked”? And why would that make its main concerns change?

It hasn’t declined, growth is flat not negative.

You’re talking about priorities 9 months ago. They’ve changed. Plus many of the votes were a protest. Which might be the same at next GE against Labour.

I’ve always been a “my vote is a chess move, not a Valentine” woman. But I really don’t see how I can get past the language Starmer used.

There was certainly tactical voting which is why the minority parties benefited. Why have priorities changed? Could it possibly be something to do with Mr Farage?

Because they were told that smashing the gang would be feasible and effective, and it is clearly neither and the rhetoric was built on nothing more than lies.

What do you think about the island of strangers speech @Blossomtoes ?
Do you think he means it or are you suggesting that mean kids made him say it?

Look @CurlewKate if some of the Labour left did not realise what kind of guy Starmer is, then tough. He is making the right decisions for the country, suck it up. He is not interested in cowering to the far left fragile sentiments.

They cared less about immigration. They wanted the economy and the NHS improved more than they cared about immigration. I’ve told you this about four times now. Here’s the research if you don’t believe me.

https://yougov.co.uk/politics/articles/49594-general-election-2024-what-are-the-most-important-issues-for-voters

The number of vacancies in the economy was down 5.3% in the three months to the end of April -with construction sector experiencing the biggest decline.

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2025/may/13/uk-unemployment-rises-ons-job-vacancies

Which was it, is he racist or weak?

Neither

I reckon “islands of strangers” was just put in there to start the immigration conversation. It was an attention seeking move. So people wake up and listen. Tactics.

People wanted the last gov out and Labour’s policies don’t fit for a large section of the electorate who are now switching to Reform. The messaging around Southport, gangs and crime also didn’t help Labour. They seem to have dropped ‘dog whistle’ accusations and now going for ‘island of strangers’.

The last 9 or ten months isn’t surprising, when Starmer pledged to stop crossings with smash the gangs it was obvious the policy wouldn’t work and Reform would benefit.

Aping Enoch Powell to start a conversation? Would you afford this kind of grace to any other politician?

Of course not. And the conversation was happening without Labour. They realised they had to switch as Reform could win in FPTP.

Exactly; if Birmingham happened in Islington something would be done immediately. It's not about race for me but numbers and people not wanting to integrate.

We need action not words. Have lost faith in politicians and all hope for the future of this country.