Reform party

[TalkToTheHand123]

Will Reform win any votes at the local elections?

I'd love to see how that would work and how they would fund it. What would the marines do? Sail them to the ME?

Yes which of those figures do people want to see? And how, the crossings system is problematic for non vetting and risk to life. If it is 10k then how, or 100k and so on.

@Alexandra2001

"Reform have zero idea on how to reduce x channel migration ALL their plans involve causing huge rows with the EU/France... one of the latest i read about was putting UK Marines on the beaches in France.."

To be fair every party has zero idea on how to reduce illegal cross channel migration because by definition it is illegal.

Labour's sound bite of "let's smash the smuggling gangs " is as unworkable as Reform's sound bite bites.

The only true solution is to make the UK a less attractive destination for illegal migration than other countries, for example national ID cards etc.

I'd ideally like to see none. But the west has meddled in their countries and does nothing to help stop wars or provide stability. So it's on us as well.

Well until you can achieve peace in Ukraine and the middle east, this is what will keep happening. We are just as complicit.

@1dayatatimeI don’t think ID cards are a fix. Germany have them and similar issues.

If people really do want a reduction then there’s the Aus way or overall change in law.

The issue is distorting politics in the EU. It can be resolved but it takes the outlier parties to suggest them usually. Although Aus just had the equivalent of centre right and now centre left keep the policies.

Yeah and unless we all start speaking gealic or something, people are still gonna migrate here.

Again we need to tackle the route causes and work towards peace and stability otherwise it'll keep happening throughout the decades. I have nothing against immigration at all, but to think that these people have travelled unsafely hundreds and hundreds of miles and turn up on our shores because their city has been blitzed, well it's all down to politicians. The very ones who then point the finger at them

The Australian way of dealing with immigration or refugees?

Offshore processing centers would provide safe routes into the UK but Australia's immigration detention is indefinite so the UK would still have to provide the accommodation, food etc.

There is probably a reason this isn't happening in Europe, geography, historical ties?

Aus numbers reduced drastically so it’s not like Labour’s Balkan suggestion which would be impossible. The numbers get close to 0 as the deterrent is so strong.

The main reason is due to Aus having its own court system and laws rather than the ECHR. I know people baulk at the mention of that but we’ll see Reform increase as the issue will increase and take votes with it.

That is the main reason Aus can stand alone in controlling borders rigidly.

The most significant success with the Australian system was the pushbacks - pushing back boats before they entered Australian waters. The reason that was an option for Australia rather than the Uk is that a) the boats used had to cross much longer distances and were therefore proper boats. There was significantly less risk to life and it should go without saying there is a responsibility to not deliberately sink other vessels.
And b) they were carrying this out in international waters. There are no international waters in the Channel. The navy would need to enter French waters which is not something the French would accept and nor would we the other way around.
It is also something that the Navy has rejected.
https://www.navylookout.com/why-its-not-the-royal-navys-job-to-stop-migrant-boats/

Geography has a lot to do with it. British Channel vs oceans and seas

And if the UK would leave the ECHR just to 'stop the boats', where would the offshore centre be located? Rwanda plan wouldn't have stopped the crossings.

Aus gap is actually pretty small when you look where the boats crossed. It was a specific point where it was very close.

By that I mean in comparison to rest of the Aus border.

But it was in international waters.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-australia-64898507

@1dayatatime

The only true solution is to make the UK a less attractive destination for illegal migration than other countries, for example national ID cards etc.

That won't work as the places they're fleeing are far less attractive than the UK could ever be eg Afghanistan and Iran.

The reason people are coming here is because they speak English or have relatives here.

It's far better to spend money processing claims quickly and establishing agreements with other countries to return economic migrants eg Albania.

Again we're just talking about "small boats" which make up a tiny percentage of overall migration to the UK and distract from the real issues.

I know some don’t want to talk about it but the movement of people using the asylum system is massive multi billion £ system and saying don’t consider it will end up in support for Reform increasing.

How is voting Reform going to bring down the cost?

https://conservativepost.co.uk/a-new-force-to-be-reckoned-with-the-great-british-pac-charges-onto-the-political-scene/

Democracy is dead

I was talking about the traffickers’ profits from people movement in that pp

But if you mean why would costs go down if there was a system like Aus then having googled we pay a lot, more than other G7 countries pp, and Aus costs go down the stronger the deterrent.

Because Reform simply aren't going to deal with asylum seekers. They're going to escort them out into the open sea and leave them there to drown or parachute them into other countries.

Obviously there will be the cost of the planes and boats. (And dealing with pissed off sovereign nations).

No, I am asking how Reform is going to bring down the cost.

Not specifically aimed at you, more asking Reform voters.

You have misrepresented my posts.

I didn't say Starmer was complicit or incompetent with regards to Savile. I made a passing reference to the BBC to say I was aware they had been criticised. You keep saying that the Tory Party were warned about Savile without supplying any details.

Regarding Margaret Thatcher, you posted some vague quotes up thread about the warnings Thatcher received, e.g. Savile's "manner of life". You didn't link but I've found the article;
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-23355531

There's no suggestion in the article that Thatcher was warned that Saville was acting illegally or that he might be a sex abuser or paedophile - rather the warning was that he was promiscuous. There were similar complaints about Mick Jagger before he was nominated for a knighthood by Tony Blair in 2003.

Also, you implied that Thatcher was privy to information about Savile not available to others - however the correspondence in the article shows that senior civil servants relayed details from the national press - available to all:

Sir Robert vetoed the idea, saying it was too soon after "unfortunate revelations" in which the entertainer had boasted to the media of having sex with women he met while running charity marathons...

At the time, the government was leading a high-profile promotional campaign warning about the dangers of Aids and Sir Robert wrote back stating that Savile's acknowledged "sexual promiscuity" should not be encouraged.

"My committee and I still fear that his manner of life - on his own confession - has been such that a high award for him would be an unhelpful signal when we are still grappling with an Aids problem which threatens to intensify."

I don't see how these 'warnings' compare with the CPS/police investigation into Savile's sex abuse of children.

The cavalry are coming lol.

So this is like the PAC lunatics the highly respected Liz truss (least popular pm in history) was hanging about with in the us. Aligned with Trump, Musk and also hardline “Christian” fundamentalists huh…

And the British public are going to lap that up approvingly are they? Do the British public like any of those people?

Nope

Ben Habib (the Pakistani born) politician is going to launch a party to the right of Reform is he😮 I don’t think he’s thought this through or understands the voter base he’s appealing to. Turkeys and Christmas springs to mind

He’s a very naive, foolish man.