Spectator - The Torment of British Jews. This article almost brought me to tears.

[stelladelmare8]

https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-torment-of-british-jews/ Apologies for the pay wall, but if you did want to read it you can get a free trial.

This article broke my heart. Sharing in the hopes of raising some awareness around what British Jews are facing right now in our own country.

This is a thread about AS and I don't wish to derail, but I'll rey as you are questioning me.

I totally support the idea of a Jewish state. I don't support any state that is built upon the eradication and systemic human rights abuses of other people in order to build and uphold that state. That is not only racism, but very shitty behaviour on a human level. So no, I don't support Israel. Do I think that makes me antisemitic? No, I don't. It makes me against the government of that state. I have no doubt there are many Israeli Jews who oppose what the government is doing. I dont hold any Jewish person accountable for Israel's actions. I utterly abhor the idea of 'good/bad' or 'right' Jew. Every person is free to hold their beliefs/opinions, whether I like them or not.
There are Palestinians living in Israel, who are under a form of occupation themselves. I want freedom for them all. Free Palestine encompasses all of them for me. How that is going to happen under the current Israeli government, I don't know. But something has to change. The situation as we see it now (and it has been going on for decades) is totally against humanity.
Sorry if I mixed you up with another poster who said pro Israel posters should never be questioned or expected to justify their stance, and this was antisemitism.

The vast majority of Israelis were born there. What do you think should happen to them when Israel does not exist and instead it is all Palestine?

I was appalled at the way British Muslims were hounded to denounce 9/11, as if it had anything to do with them. Many on the left criticised those calls. It's immensely disappointing and hurtful to see some of those same groups on the left now demanding that British Jews publicly say that they think what Israel is doing amounts to genocide, with those who do being held up as examples of the "right kind of Jew" while everyone else is dismissed as some kind of genocide-loving maniac.

I was appalled at the way British Muslims were hounded to denounce 9/11, as if it had anything to do with them. Many on the left criticised those calls. It's immensely disappointing and hurtful to see some of those same groups on the left now demanding that British Jews publicly say that they think what Israel is doing amounts to genocide, with those who do being held up as examples of the "right kind of Jew" while everyone else is dismissed as some kind of genocide-loving maniac.

Excellent point.

@ThatKookyNewt they don't care. Jews can be murdered. As David Baddeil says - Jews Don't Count.

@madderthanahatter and what about the Palestinians in refugee camps? Where would they go?

If Palestinian refugees have the right of return how would this work? You are talking about millions of people.
Are you talking about refugee camps in what is now Israel? Or are you talking about evicting current Israelis from their homes?

Fortunately those tasked with eventually negotiating some kind of peace deal will be slightly better informed, is all I can say!

@madderthanahatter It does come across like you are parroting phrases. You want it to be one state. And for all Palestinians to have the right of return. How many generations back? It could be millions and millions of people returning.
Where do you want everyone to live? How will they all be fed?
The reality is it would either be one country with massive refugee camps and a punitive police to stop ongoing riots, or there would be a civil war.

I have not even considered the reality that many of Hamas and their supporters want every Jewish person eradicated from Palestinian land. Or that some Israelis will seek revenge for losing their country. Or that there are fundamental conflicts between Hamas run land which has Sharia law and Israel with a large LGBT population.

Simply looking at available resources alone there would be civil war or a punitive state with large refugee camps.

People who understand these basics when they call for a one state solution are working on the assumption the current Israeli jewish population will all move somewhere else.

Someone has gone bye-bye

I think the trouble is, having serious concerns about what is happening in Gaza is one thing. But to march in the streets demanding a ceasefire suggests ignorance of, or indifference to, the actual plight of Israel. And the timing of the pro-Palestinian rallies, immediately after 7 October, was... well, at the very least, insensitive; but quite possibly deliberate on the part of some of the organisers.

That would be because people don't know about it. It's not on front pages, unlike Netanyahu and the conflict in Gaza.

I agree, a line must be drawn between racist treatment of Jews and criticising the acts of Hamas and the completely disproportionate response of the State of Israel, both absolutely deserved.

If there was public and political unity from all in condemning the above, this would be for the best, but there's too much deafening silence instead.

I am critical of the Israeli government response. But how would you know if you do not know me? I am not going to march with people chanting anti semitic phrases.

the completely disproportionate response of the State of Israel

Everyone says this - but no-one says how they think Israel should have responded.