Boris Johnson pillar box comment

[stillamum22]

I'm just appalled by his comments on the Burka. In my opinion there's no barrel he won't scrape to get backing from sections of the British population to be leader of the Tory party. Really is Boris reflecting Brits opinions or just a nasty potty mouth racist? I'm curious to get the opinion of the good women of MN

He is an oaf but at least he has started a debate of sorts. That outfit has no place in a liberal society. Banning it woukd be anti-liberal but it needs stopping.

Some embarrassing posts here. What the fuck does someone like Boris know about what it’s like to be a Muslim woman wearing a burka? He’s no right to comment on what someone chooses to wear, especially a woman, especially where there are sexed based differences in expectations around clothing and demeanour. His comments do not encourage anyone to think about dress, they encourage everyone to take the piss out of women he regards as less than him who are obviously different and are easy targets. I can’t believe women on mumsnet are nodding along with this bullshit. Like boris sees you any differently to a woman in a burka.

Boris is liberal so he is just saying stuff to highlight how liberal he is. He wouldn’t ban anything. He is just trying to stay visible and make sure people understand what he is about.

I don’t think Boris reflects opinion nor do I think he is rasist. I think he just thinks it’s ammusing to talk in a certain way. He could convey the same sentiment in an acceptable way but chooses not to. He’d rather get a reaction.

Sorry typo racist

"Letterboxes" and "Bank Robbers" - nicely dehumanising and creating suspicion of dishonesty in one stroke there

I saw Sahar AL-Faifi on a programme earlier, she's an NHS scientist and has worn the Niqab since age of 14. She wants to wear it and sees it as an act of spiritual worship, nothing to do with men.

She's doing a worthwhile job, her Niqab doesn't prevent that but yeah let's worry about what women like her wear, and pretend that Boris Johnson and rabble rousers arent going to further compromise the safety of Burka/Niqab women going about their daily life and not harming anybody.

How are these women going to feel today, walking around whilst all this is going on? I shouldn't think they feel good.

Boris is inciting fear and hatred of these women for personal gain.

Perhaps they should all just stay at home henceforth as they're so scary to certain folks out there anyway🙄

All this 'at least he's started a debate' - as if that makes racist bigotry ok. When these women are de-veiled what's the achievement?

As ever, women are the easiest victims for scapegoating

BJ like most of us defends the rights of women to wear the burka. He also points out it looks silly (which we all know). It is also very sexist and not required by islam. I support his right to mock. Je suis Charlie. We are allowed to say these things. If people do not like it they should seek therapy or just read the Koran or other books and not read on line comment.

I particularly like this comment on twitter on the topic:-

"This is the uniform of medieval patriarchal tyranny. It victim-blames women for their beauty. Where this is enforced it symbolises violent misogyny. I’m not advocating banning this monstrosity but I refuse to defend it. It deserves to be ridiculed. Not the women inside it.

Women defending this have Stockholm syndrome. Liberals defending this are akin to conservatives defending the confederate flag. It is not offensive to remind everyone that this isn’t normal. It is offensive to advocate for this to become normalised.

And blessed be the fruit."

Majid Nawaz

Johnson doesn't 'defend' anything but Johnson.

And no he has no right to mock women. If you don't grasp that Xenia then educate yourself or acquire therapy. He knows he has made life for women who wear the clothing more difficult - scum racists will now feel that bit more entitled to abuse these women.

And by helping legitimise his cynicism you are helping that scenario.

Goldenwonderwall totally agree with you. Interested that two threads on MN at the moment about this issue and both lead with Boris, but both have primarily attracted posters focused on women not being allowed to wear burqas. It is assumed that somehow Muslim women are not capable of making informed choices about clothing. Yet many more women in the UK wear cripplingly high heels: they restrict movement, if worn too often can cause foot deformities, are dangerous trip hazards, and affect the muscle and tendons of the lower leg. They are also associated with misogyny, the 'fuck-me' heel, the idea that they force women to walk in a way that makes their buttocks protrude which has been linked to being suggestive of rear entry sex and so on...I have friends who work in the city who are not required to wear them but do so because it is expected of them in less overt ways. Yet no-one is calling for a blanket high heel ban or suggesting that that women who wear them are not capable of making choices about what they wear. Seems it's only Muslim women others feel free to dictate to.

I've seen plenty of medical advice over the years to not wear very high heels. No physiotherapist or doctor ever got villified for saying this.

Boris is liberal so he is just saying stuff to highlight how liberal he is.

What is your understanding of 'liberal' as a term? Boris has moved from the liberal wing of the Tory Party and is currently allied with the right-wing of the party, and has been for some time. He, together with Rees-Mogg and Gove, has just been in meetings with Steve Bannon. Bannon the the anti-immigration, former Trump strategist, formerly executive for Breitbart the US far-right news site and currently in talks with far-right groups throughout Europe. Boris is looking to pick up voters from the right in the UK and not just the right, the far right. Boris as usual is out for Boris.

I've seen plenty of medical advice over the years to not wear very high heels. No physiotherapist or doctor ever got villified for saying this

Think you got the wrong end of the analogy there!

Sex sells. Women are encouraged to flaunt their bodies. To fight to hold back the years because you know, if you're older you don't look good.

Katie Price et al can make a fortune just by inflating their tits for the male gaze. Media strives to sexualise and influence young girls, getting them to obsess re how they look, and physical perfection. The thigh gap obsession. It is ALL to do with men who want titillation, and women socialised to buy into that both knowingly and subconsciously.

Alongside it all you have the hypocritical double standards message that women must be nice, pure, not to acceptable; all this whilst encouraging women to be and look accessible and fuckable.

There's no moral high ground to be gained at all re the western outlook on Burka/Niqab. As ever, it's blind to its hypocrisy in not even recognising that women and girls here are direct victims of blatant misogyny sexism and control too, and that is centred around womens' bodies.

MistressDeeCee Absolutely. Not to mention growing levels of plastic surgery even for very young women.

Perhaps.

Boris is no idiot. Nothing he says is accidental or casual. He has deliberately thrown this set of insults in to the media to keep himself in the public eye and gain votes from the far right. He is racist. He does think he can be the next prime minister here. It’s hard to know where you draw the line as a liberal society. It seems at the moment in the case of women being forced to wear the veil that they have to just find their own way out.

At the same time, I accept that some women actively choose to cover their faces and I respect the right of women to wear what they want. I don't really think it's the state's place to dictate this.

Which is what Boris said.

Boris is a showman. Like all performers in the entertainment business he tailors his act to appeal to his fans. Unfortunately he is also a politician.

At the same time, I accept that some women actively choose to cover their faces and I respect the right of women to wear what they want. I don't really think it's the state's place to dictate this.

Which is what Boris said.

This is because Boris can be politically astute when the need arises, he, Gove, Fox and Rees-Mogg are in the process of trying to install themselves as the next leaders of the Tory Part. If Boris hadn't qualified his statements he could be expelled or indefinitely suspended for going against the party's discrimination rules:that would be a bit of a problem; can't run a party you're not part of! His statement crossed the line just enough to bring condemnation from a number of high-ranking Muslim Tory figures and a censure from May, he may get disciplined, but he's betting on getting past that. However it was enough over the line to signal to anti-Islamic groups/voters that he shared their ‘concerns’. For ‘concerns’ read thinly and not-so-thinly veiled racism – no pun intended.

He is an oaf but at least he has started a debate of sorts. That outfit has no place in a liberal society. Banning it woukd be anti-liberal but it needs stopping.

He is an oaf but at least he has started a debate of sorts.

A debate at the expense of the dignity of Muslim women, pretty poor debate, more like stirred up anti-Islamic thinking. The whole point of a liberal society is just that, that it is liberal, banning clothing is the very antithesis of that.

You don't know why particular women choose to wear or not wear a burka, many women say they find it liberating. And actually I can see why, you can nip to the shops, don't have to bother with hair, presentation and so on...Actually there are women who say that's when they wear it and who don't wear it otherwise. If you want to say that nobody should be forced to wear something if they don't want to fine, although even that's a problem as many organisations such as schools require uniforms/have dress codes that find oppressive, so good luck wording that law.

Johnson isn't an oaf. He is deliberately being predatory toward muslim women to make himself the poster boy of the political far right. Who are racists. He is one of them.

Unfortunately the shame of being called a 'racist' is swiftly being devalued as racists behaviour becomes normalised as in the US of A.

Timefortea while you're busy restricting Muslim women's choices of clothing, I hate the fashion for long nails, I think they look horrible, make it hard for women to do things and they're a breeding ground for fungal infections and bacteria so could you throw those in too please.

Hairbrush I lived in a predominantly Muslim area for years, I never had any of the problems you described, the people I met were really friendly, neighbours gave us food they prepared and so on. I even went into some cafes reserved for men a couple of times and was served tea/food, nobody was rude to me or made me feel uncomfortable only realised afterwards they weren't cafes but actually clubs for men. Also worked with young women for years many of whom were Muslim, some of whom wore Burkas, all interesting, intelligent, articulate women.