Trump (Part 4)

[claig]

Continuing discussion of the Trumpquake and populist rebellions

"Willing consenting adults and all that"
Well, they weren't.

Lweji: I think with that link Chris was trying to point out that liberals can be capable of hypocrisy too. Therefore you and I should stfu (which would be convenient, wouldn't it?)
Personally I don't care what Melania or Hillary wore. I find obsessing over the clothes of female politicians and of male politician's wives to be deeply trivialising and sexist. Right wing tabloids in the UK are particularly bad for this, but I suppose more left wing publications are also guilty.

Chris, there was absolutely nothing remotely "goady" in my question to you. Nothing. But thank you for answering.

I agree with lweji's response but would just add two points:

". Im not interested in the slightest if Trump is catholic, protestant, muslim, amish, mormon. Im not interested in the slightest if Trump has been married 1, 2, 3, 4 times. Im not interested if Trump is gay, straight, transgender. Im not interested if he watches Porn on a saturday night. Im not interested if hes told a woman to fuck off, just as he would tell a male to fuck off."

None of these are the things that have been raised as concerns, but rather the fact that he has both been accused of sexual assault and boasted of using his wealth and power to assault women.

Regarding abortion, the Trump victory has been cited by those bringing the 6 week ban to Ohio, so this is not just about abortions beyond 20 weeks.


"Ohio’ss Republican-led House and Senate passed legislation Tuesday nightt that would ban abortionss_ as soon as a fetal heartbeat can be detected― as early as six weeks into a pregnancy.
The measure was attached at the last minute as an amendment to an unrelated child abuse bill. It has no exceptions for rape or incest.
If it’s passed into law, physicians could face a year in prison if they perform an abortion after a heartbeat is detected or if they fail to check for one before a procedure.
The measure is the most extreme abortion restriction in the country, effectively banning the procedure before most women even realize they’re pregnant, pro-abortion rights advocates said.
“After years of passing anti-abortion laws under the guise of protecting women’s health and safety, they lay bare their true motives: to ban abortion in the state of Ohio,” said Dawn Laguens, a spokesperson for the Planned Parenthood Action Fund.
Ohio lawmakers have been trying to pass the “heartbeat bill”” since 2011, but some activists feared that it was so extreme and unconstitutional that it could lead courts to overturn other, less stringent abortion restrictions. The Supreme Court refused to revieww Arkansas’ 12-week abortion ban earlier this year, which lower courts had blocked. The high court ruled in Roe v. Wade in 1973 that states are not allowed to prohibit abortions before the fetus is viable, usually around 22 to 24 weeks into the pregnancy.
Republicans said they now feel emboldened to pass the bill because President-elect Donald Trump is likely to appoint anti-abortion conservatives to the Supreme Court.
“A new president, new Supreme Court appointees change the dynamic, and there was consensus in our caucus to move forward,” Ohio Senate President Keith Faber"

The four women Trump has appointed are probably the best thing about his cabinet (not because they are women, before you get carried away).

That six week thing is shocking, Kaija. Tacking it onto a child abuse bill (presumably so it wouldn't be vetoed?) at the last minute too is devious.

I'm just still surprised that anyone can genuinely say that Trump is good news for women, or that they can reduce valid, clearly articulated objections (to his policies, language and behaviour) down to how many marriages he's had and whether he's watches porn.

"Willing consenting adults and all that"
Well, they weren't.

Exactly. I didn't have time this morning to address that.
Grabbing women was without their consent. Entering changing rooms in the Miss Universe contest was without their consent.
So, if it's not consenting adults, how do you view his actions and attitudes?

The logical consequence is that abusive men will also feel entitled not to obtain consent.
Which worsens life for women in general.

On side news, life in Crimea, under the wonderful new regime of Putin.

www.theguardian.com/world/2016/dec/12/crimean-tatars-accuse-russia-of-kidnappings-and-political-arrests

Crimean Tatars accuse Russia of kidnappings and political arrests

"Since the Russian takeover, all independent media outlets in the peninsula have closed down, most notably the Crimean Tatar channel ATR, which broadcast news throughout the annexation that did not chime with the Russian version of events. It was denied registration last year by Crimean authorities."

That's the man the US is supposed to get along with.

He may be willing to remove sanctions and ignore Putin's worst behaviour for the sake of "getting on" with Russia (for now, anyway), but it looks like he's happy to let relations with other powers deteriorate:
www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/china-bomber-flight-send-message-donald-trump-taiwan-a7468021.html

Lets hope Trump listens to advisors when trying to navigate complicated international relations and security.
www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-elections/donald-trump-says-hes-too-smart-for-daily-intelligence-briefings-a7468456.html
Because it's "smart" to not listen to experts.

The trouble is that he's trying to apply the sort of principles and practices he used in business and on The Apprentice to the presidency, which in itself makes no sense; and even less so when you consider how often his business principles and practice led him into bankruptcy and illegal conduct.

Yes Deepan, have you heard of the Dunning Kruger effect? It's basically the idea that the more unskilled a person is, the more they massively overestimate their own competence. People with more knowledge of a subject realise how much there is they don't know.

Trump comes across as thinking he knows everything already and that the problems he's promised to fix are "easy". A more intelligent leader would show some humility and understand that he needs to listen to experts, not dismiss them.
"The fool doth think he is wise, but the wise man knows himself to be a fool"

It's extraordinary, having the President telling the American people not to listen to what the CIA are saying...........

Well, everybody knows the CIA are liars.
It's in all the films.

He does have a point regarding Iraq and WoMD, but, to be fair, SH seems to have convinced himself that he had them and refused full access to inspectors (I remember those times well). And he had used chemical weapons against the Kurds and other minorities. I don't think the CIA at the time had sufficient knowledge of the Middle East or Iraq.
Plus it's a complicated game of bluffs and double bluffs, and secret agents, and spies, and double agents, and triple agents.

I bet he gets a headache at the end of the briefings. All those complicated words too.

But:

"Meanwhile, Mr Trump confirmed that his running mate, Vice President-elect Mike Pence, and his generals are receiving the intelligence briefings more frequently."

Could he be saying that they are not smart?

Nor is Obama

"Except in 2012, and 2014, he criticised then president Barack Obama for doing the same thing:"

"Donald J. Trump ✔ @realDonaldTrump"
"Fact--Obama does not read his intelligence briefings nor does he get briefed in person by the CIA or DOD. Too busy I guess!"
9:15 PM - 30 Sep 2014

"Priorities--while fundraising and campaigning on our dime, Obama has skipped over 50% of his intel briefings wapo.st/PiD36V"
8:29 PM - 11 Sep 2012

I'm sure the situation is not the same every day. To start with the fight against ISIS changes every day and China are sending daily messages.

I imagine that this doesn't happen:
DT: So, what's happened since yesterday?
CIA: Oh, same old, same old.

The overall message he wants to give out is:

Don't trust the media
Don't trust the CIA
Don't trust the FBI
Don't trust the scientists
Don't trust the experts
Don't trust the union leaders
Don't trust immigrants
Don't trust Muslims..

...Trust ME.

Maybe they had to repeat themselves to make sure he really understood it?

And it's extraordinary that the answer to his cabinet choices is that "he'll keep them in line".

You have to love lil'ol' Sarah, though:

Sarah Palin ✔ @SarahPalinUSA
Russia's getting out of hand? So says the defeated. Not to worry... remember I can keep an eye on them from here. fb.me/3f16JyA2c
12:10 AM - 12 Dec 2016

Maybe they should show DT this prediction. He might well give up on being President:

It is quite amazing how the left wingers believe the Establishment, Blair and those types. Trump is anti-establishment which is why the people voted him in.

The non-mainstream media (non Establishment) have been linking to Craig Murray in teh past day or two. Craig seems to be having a pop at one of the Guardian's great and the good, an Oxford PPE.

"There is no Russian involvement in the leaks of emails showing Clinton’s corruption. Yes this rubbish has been the lead today in the Washington Post in the US and the Guardian here, and was the lead item on the BBC main news. I suspect it is leading the American broadcasts also.
...
As Julian Assange has made crystal clear, the leaks did not come from the Russians. As I have explained countless times, they are not hacks, they are insider leaks
...
The continued ability of the mainstream media to claim the leaks lost Clinton the election because of “Russia”, while still never acknowledging the truths the leaks reveal, is Kafkaesque.
...
In the UK, one single article sums up the total abnegation of all journalistic standards. The truly execrable Jonathan Freedland of the Guardian writes “Few credible sources doubt that Russia was behind the hacking of internal Democratic party emails,
...
But in what passes for Freedland’s mind, “credible” is 100% synonymous with “establishment”. When he says “credible sources” he means “establishment sources”. That is the truth of the “fake news” meme. You are not to read anything unless it is officially approved by the elite and their disgusting, crawling whores of stenographers like Freedland.

The worst thing about all this is that it is aimed at promoting further conflict with Russia. This puts everyone in danger for the sake of more profits for the arms and security industries – including of course bigger budgets for the CIA. As thankfully the four year agony of Aleppo comes swiftly to a close today, the Saudi and US armed and trained ISIS forces counter by moving to retake Palmyra. This game kills people, on a massive scale, and goes on and on."

www.craigmurray.org.uk/

Although this may be more realistic:

Waht a change in the world. Before 2014, PPEs were riding high. The Miliband Bruvvers, Blair, Camerone et al. And then along came UKIP and a man called Nigel Farage.

The BBC tried to knock Farage for the PPEs, the Guardian Oxbridge teams did their best to mock "the people" and Farage's People's Army, but the people's revolution had already begun.

Then came Brexit when the world's elite faced defeat as the British people didn't belive ethem and the BBC.

Then came Trump and the world's elite were stunned.

Then came Renzi and the panic spread.

Then anything that was not BBC and Guardian was called "fake news" as the PPEs were losing on all fronts.

Next will the EU itself collapse? No one yet knows, but panic is in teh air among the elites as the people's revolution rolls on.

Blair, the PPE, is all they have left.

Claig- I do wish you would just talk about one thing at a time without all the propaganda. It would be much more interesting and informative.........

"Whatever the party, our political elite is an Oxbridge club"

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/aug/24/our-political-elite-oxbridge-club

Left, right, centre, they're all Establishment, all PPEs.

But they couldn't stop Trump. The BBC tried their best, but they failed, just as they failed to stop the British people in Brexit.

Bertrand Brussells, this is my thread as have been the last 15 or so and I am talking about the same thing, the major shift in world politics, the people beating the elites, Trump's victory being the most amazing turn of events this century as an outsider defeated the entire world elite, and of course the Oxbridge teams serve the elites.

Former UK ambassador put it best

"But in what passes for Freedland’s mind, “credible” is 100% synonymous with “establishment”. When he says “credible sources” he means “establishment sources”. That is the truth of the “fake news” meme. You are not to read anything unless it is officially approved by the elite and their disgusting, crawling whores of stenographers like Freedland."

---

How can the PPEs put the genie back in the bottle, how can they reverse the Trump Revolution and the People's Revolution and the global populist rebellion against the establishment which may well end the entire Establishment EU next?