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Original poster

Trump (Part 4)

1000 replies

claig · 04/12/2016 19:37

Continuing discussion of the Trumpquake and populist rebellions

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Original poster
claig · 12/12/2016 00:32

I use elite in teh sense that nearly every political journalist in the world now uses it

"The Political Elite Fights Trump -- And They're Still Not Winning

Elites vs. Trump -- and the elites haven't won yet

In a general election unlike any we've covered before, this fact stands out: Almost every elite institution in America is united (or mostly united) against Donald Trump. Consider:

Current or ex-presidents: Zero current or living ex-presidents are supporting Trump, versus four who are backing Hillary Clinton (Obama, Clinton, Bush 41, Carter), with the other (Bush 43) on the sidelines.
Big business: Not a single Fortune 100 CEO has endorsed Trump, while 11 are supporting Clinton, per the Wall Street Journal. (The other 89 haven't picked a side.)
Cabinet members: By our count, only 9 of George W. Bush's 34 cabinet secretaries are backing Trump.
Silicon Valley: Just 1% of the political donations from the internet industry in this presidential election ($28,272 out of nearly $4 million total) has gone to Trump, while 60% has gone to Clinton, according to the Center for Responsive Politics.
Newspaper endorsements: By our count, 15 newspapers have endorsed Hillary Clinton in the general election, versus just one for Trump (The National Enquirer); in fact, Gary Johnson has more newspaper endorsements (four) than Trump does (one). And most recently, USA Today calls Trump "unfit for the presidency."

Twilight of the Elites?

In short, elites and elite opinion are united against Trump. But guess what: Trump is still in the ball game. So what's going on? "

www.nbcnews.com/politics/first-read/political-elite-fights-trump-they-re-still-losing-n657356

What was going on was that Trump beat them all because of one thing - the people - because it is the people vs the elites and Trump is on our side.

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Original poster
claig · 12/12/2016 00:34

'But Claig, you attribute every bit of academic research you don't like to a "think tank"'

Not at all. Think tanks are political, they are staffed by servants of politically motivated paymasters, nothing to do with commercialising scientific inventions.

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Lweji · 12/12/2016 00:34

To be clear, and as a summary:

Trump’s Labor Pick, Andrew Puzder, Is Critic of Minimum Wage Increases
mobile.nytimes.com/2016/12/08/us/politics/andrew-puzder-labor-secretary-trump.html

As a summary:
against minimum wage increases
against over time pay
says machines are better than workers
uses almost naked women in ads for fast food (!. why?!)

Him: Good.

People worried about the consequences of climate change and trying to do something about it: Elites, Establishment, Bad

Kaija · 12/12/2016 00:36

If you are going to use the words "people" and "elites" it is perfectly clear that the people voted for Hillary, and the elites are in Trump's cabinet.

Lweji · 12/12/2016 00:37

Adding to the list of endorsements: more than 50% of the US voters also endorsed Hillary. :)

Original poster
claig · 12/12/2016 00:38

"The Political Elite Fights Trump -- And They're Still Not Winning

Elites vs. Trump -- and the elites haven't won yet"

Trump was fighting the whole darn lot of them. The people Trump has picked will now help him to improve the lot of the people against all teh elites who were supporting Hillary and trying to stop Trump and who are still trying to stop Trump even now.

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squishysquirmy · 12/12/2016 00:39

"Big business: Not a single Fortune 100 CEO has endorsed Trump"
So CEO's of Fortune company's are the elites now?
What about the CEO of the company ranked second in the Fortune 500?

fortune.com/2016/06/08/exxon-mobil-fortune-500/

Kaija · 12/12/2016 00:40

The people voted for Hillary Clinton. Even with all the help Trump had from Russia.

Original poster
claig · 12/12/2016 00:42

'So CEO's of Fortune company's are the elites now?'

That is what that journalist says. Elites is a loose term that encompasses lots of different strata of elites. We use teh term "metropolitan elite" and that would include someone like Ed Miliband, who is not really elite at all, but more muppet. So it is a loose term that encompasses lots of people.

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Kaija · 12/12/2016 00:43

"Americans are less approving of President-elect Donald Trump than they were of previous presidents during their transitions into office, a new Pew Research Group poll shows.
Americans say Trump has also done too little to distance himself from white supremacists. And a majority are concerned that his business ties will present conflicts."

Lweji · 12/12/2016 00:43

The list, we need the list.

Original poster
claig · 12/12/2016 00:44

Tony Blair is not real elite, although he would be classed as "political elite", even though some analysts would clas him as just a "bag carrier" for the real elites.

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Kaija · 12/12/2016 00:44

". Elites is a loose term that encompasses lots of different strata of elites. We use teh term "metropolitan elite" and that would include someone like Ed Miliband, who is not really elite at all, but more muppet. So it is a loose term that encompasses lots of people."

It is othering. A propaganda device. Nothing more.

Lweji · 12/12/2016 00:44

That's all very nice about Cameron and Blair, but...

squishysquirmy · 12/12/2016 00:44

Loose terms are really handy, aren't they? Because you can just use them to mean whatever the fuck you want them to mean at any particular moment.
Not great for constructive communication though.

Lweji · 12/12/2016 00:45

ups

So CEO's of Fortune company's are the elites now?
What about the CEO of the company ranked second in the Fortune 500?

Original poster
claig · 12/12/2016 00:46

'It is othering. A propaganda device. Nothing more.'

Then write to the Guardian journalists and ask them to stop using it in their articles.

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Kaija · 12/12/2016 00:48

Donald Trump is very very unpopular. With the people. His proposed administration is full of his billionaire donors. The corrupt elites.

Original poster
claig · 12/12/2016 00:48

'Loose terms are really handy, aren't they?'

They are aggregations, classes, ways of classifying people who have things in common e.g. working class, middle class, "the people", "the elites", "the bag carriers" etc

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Kaija · 12/12/2016 00:49

"Then write to the Guardian journalists and ask them to stop using it in their articles."

I am more concerned with how it is being used here.

Kaija · 12/12/2016 00:51

"They are aggregations, classes, ways of classifying people who have things in common e.g. working class, middle class, "the people", "the elites", "the bag carriers" etc"

It is clear that the thing "elites" as used here have in common is simply liberal values and nothing else.

Original poster
claig · 12/12/2016 00:51

'I am more concerned with how it is being used here.'

Yes, it is clear you have no understanding of the concept. Write to the Guardian journalists and ask them to explain what they mean by it.

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squishysquirmy · 12/12/2016 00:51

So to classify people who have a dislike of Trump in common we could use the word "elites"?

Kaija · 12/12/2016 00:51

I understand extremely well what you are doing with the word, Claig.

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