Well done Labour NEC - Corbyn can stand

[claig]

They have voted 18-14 to allow Corbyn to stand in the leadership election.

One less stitch-up in a season os stitch-ups.

Go Corbyn!

Yes, in times of economic hardship., the masses have always gone for dictators and extremists. Hence the unsurprising appeal of both Corbyn and Trump, who are remarkably similar in a lot of ways (though Trump is frankly rather more skilled at connecting with a wider audience, though his policy suggestions are equally 'out there').

'But he's not interested in democracy'

The 172 cared so much for democracy, they wanted Corbyn to be excluded from the leadership contest. The whole public is watching this spectacle and thinking does anyone listen to the members and the people or is it a club where the Establishment knows best.

the front figures are mainly from Oxford with a PPE, whether Labour or Tory.

I don't know who is meant to be defined as 'front figures'.
I am seeing... Hague, Heseltine, E Milliband, Osborne, Cameron & P-Hammond were indeed PPEs at Oxford.
Thatcher, chemistry, Oxford + barrister by another route.
T Blair: studied law at Oxford
Gordon Brown, history degrees from Uni of Edinburgh
Nick Clegg: Archaeology and Anthropology at Cambridge
Bojo: classics at Oxford
Gove: English at Oxford
David Davis, comp-sci/MBA: Warwick, London, Harvard
John Major, Corbyn, Farage, John Prescott: didn't go to Uni.
Theresa May: read geography at Cambridge

Not mainly Oxford PPE. Nobody at LSE.

Osborne was actually history

& I thought I'd read recently that May did do PPE

I'd have to check them though!

May was geog, but at Oxford

Didn't say anyone went to LSE for undergraduate. However many MP's did for masters - examples Stella Creasy, Yvette Cooper, Ed Milliband etc etc. It is simplistic to just look at Oxbridge

List of people associated with LSE en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_people_associated_with_the_London_School_of_Economics#United_Kingdom

At the same time you could also say people who like the colour purple btw. I am making a point

The 172 cared so much for democracy, they wanted Corbyn to be excluded from the leadership contest

No that's not right. What they wanted was for him to get the nominations to get on the ballot. The same as he insisted Kinnock did.

Complete hypocrisy.

Haven't yet had a chance to catch up with everything that's been posted overnight, but YY to this:

Owen has been an MP since 2010 and thinks he can do a better job than Corbyn who has been an MP since before Noah built the ark, and has been a socialist all that time while Owen was at Pfizer.

A Corbyn rally is jam-packed with enthususiastic socialists and there is no such thing as an Owen rally - instead it is a man from Pfizer and his dog, 3 Oxbridge graduates and a senior Establishmentarian taking notes on Owen's diction and hand gesture performance. While Corbyn rails about Cuba, Iraq and Venezuela, Owen wonders what the point of being in the "game" is.

It made me smile, claig. Yesterday, the BBC predicted Corbyn would beat Smith 2 to 1. I'm optimistic.

Are all Corbyn rallies jam-packed though? I've been to a couple of his speeches and, although there were a lot of people, there were still a lot of empty seats.

There's also a bit of propaganda mixed into this. This picture is doing the rounds as being representative of Corbyn's rally at the Lowry theatre in an attempt to discredit a BBC picture, with what looks like rows of hundreds of people applauding. Yet as the second picture hopefully shows, the theatre is nowhere near the size it seems.

This is also worth remembering

I have been to the Lowry a few times it isn't as big as some are making out it is.

AllThePrettySeashorses, doubtless there will be oodles of spin/propaganda on both sides.

However, I thought the Lowry looked pretty big in the second picture too, actually. Just googled the capacity - it's 1,730. That's pretty huge. (A comparison for Southerners like myself, it's bigger than the Olivier, which has 1,160 seats).

I think these pictures actually support claig's point.

Like Piglet, I've been there too although only once years ago, so I'm glad she confirmed it wasn't that big and I've also googled anyway to check details. There seem to be nearly a hundred people in each row on the lower tier when in reality it goes from 34 to 44 per total row right across the three sections. The caption also says the BBC picture only relates to a tiny proportion of the audience, when in fact, referencing seating plans, it is almost a third of the entire row around the theatre. Where are the definite breaks for the aisles as well? If Corbyn is as popular as his supporters say, why do they feel need to put demonstrably false pictures about?

Surely it's obvious that:

1. The Lowry is a very large theatre (bigger than the National Theatre and most West End theatres, in fact);

1. It was almost full at the Corbyn rally.

Am I missing something?

Imagine how the Tories must cackle with laughter when they read conversations such as this. Look at us - now we're in dispute about theatre architecture, fgs!! This is why people vote Tory, isn't it?

I find the whole thing amazing. All these new supporters and the PLP instead of embracing this completely misinterprets this new support. I know quite a few JC supporters and I can tell you none of them belong to any left militant groups, none of them have been out to destroy the LP. They were all excited by someone finally addressing issues that others were being weak on. I think the comments about bullying have also been grossly exaggerated. I went to a local LP meeting and encountered the opposite: quite vicious LP members being really nasty (only 2 - but nothing from the JC supporters). There was an immediate mistrust and it's really sad as instead of seeing this as an opportunity, they were quick to try and push out any JC support. Other party mbers were thankfully more tolerant but it is a worry. How on earth will they harness this new support? I can't see Smith doing it (claims he's on the left but has supported Progress). People in politics don't suddenly change.

Thank you, houseofpain. I'm a Momentum member and have never had any truck with the hard left, antisemitism, violent protest or destruction of property. And I've never met a Corbyn supporter who thought these things were anything other than totally abhorrent. I don't recognise the picture that is being painted of us.

I am an LP and Momentum member - I have seen the bullying and intimidation by Corbyn supporters and the social media splaining of any anti-momntum or Corbyn stories

It is there. It is rife. People are scared to speak up. I saw people scared to vote. When the party splits the armchair activists will have a very hard job getting any candidates into seats. But as apparently that's no important I guess that wont matter

So are you saying there's no bullying from the anti-Corbyn side?

I think the comments about bullying have also been grossly exaggerated

Unless you are at each event you can't possibly know.

I think we get in to dangerous ground when we start down that road.

I am saying I have seen specific instances of bullying and intimidation from Momentum/pro Corbyn members.

There is no equivalent of Momentum against Corbyn (and hardly anyone is a member of progress btw especially not me). There is no organised mass movement against Corbyn the PLP has not created one at the grass roots level - it just isn't there. There are some individuals like me speaking up that's it. So if there has been any 'anti-corbyn' bullying it is not organised, not part of a 'movement'

If people are interested read about the events at the Brighton and Hove AGM
www.theargus.co.uk/news/14621420.Brighton_and_Hove_Labour_party_suspended_and_election_results_annulled/

and the Bristol West AGM
www.bristol247.com/channel/news-comment/daily/politics/claims-of-bullying-at-toxic-labour-agm

I'm not doubting bullying by some Corbyn supporters but this has become a whole new trope with which to attack him. It's taken hold and completely misses the point about what he stands for and completely ignores what his critics are doing. My point about my own experience was that the opposite was true for me and I'm sure there's a lot more going on to silence Corbyn's supporters outside and also within the PLP but this is not going to be reported because it doesn't fit the right wing narrative.

There is no organised mass movement against Corbyn the PLP has not created one at the grass roots level - it just isn't there. They've tried to create something similar to Momentum with Saving Labour - difference is, it's garnering no where near the popular support.