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Original poster

Have the House of Lords voted yet about the tax credits?

221 replies

Fantasyland · 24/10/2015 21:15

Just wondering if my last hope of the House of Lords voting against the tax credits changes has happened yet?

OP posts:
ElizabethG81 · 26/10/2015 20:33

Yeah, I don't think there'll be a two tier system. The SI has been sent back to the HoC, so they have to sort it out before they can send back to the HoL, meaning that things remain as they are for current and new claimants.

GingerIvy · 26/10/2015 20:34

I'm still incensed over the government thinking it was a good idea to send letters out just before Christmas telling people how much their tax credits were going to be cut. Merry Christmas indeed. Hmm

GingerIvy · 26/10/2015 20:35

I am wondering if they have something worse already lined up ready to go and this was a decoy, or if they were really just getting so big for their breeches that they thought they had complete and ultimate power. Confused

Fairylea · 26/10/2015 20:36

I wouldn't like to be George now :) :)

Thank goodness for the House of Lords tonight. There are other ways of recouping money than going after the poorest in society.

ElizabethG81 · 26/10/2015 20:37

"An outrage to the constitution" Grin It's sad that they're going to be more outraged by this than the fact that their glorious leader was happy to plunge millions of children into poverty. Bunch of cunts.

Rebecca2014 · 26/10/2015 20:44

Wow cannot believe the Tories are still defending the tax credit cuts. What the hell are they doing do now? flood the house of lords with Tory peers? I don't think this is quite over yet...

Nottodaythankyouorever · 26/10/2015 20:44

There are other ways of recouping money than going after the poorest in society.

They will I'm sure go after the vulnerable instead such as disabled

There have already started.

Shutthatdoor · 26/10/2015 20:46

I don't think this is quite over yet...

It isn't. It is delayed not abandoned

GingerIvy · 26/10/2015 20:47

Downing Street has responded to the defeats. According to Sky News, they are talking this up as a constitutional crisis. This is what they are saying:

The prime minister is determined we will address this constitutional issue. A convention exists and it has been broken. He has asked for a rapid review to see how it can be put back in place.

Original poster
Fantasyland · 26/10/2015 20:48

When they say new claimants would this include a person just on child tax credits who then gets a job but is now not entitled to working tax credits when they would have done previously ?

Or does it mean brand new claims and not someone on child tax credits adding working tax credits if they found a job?

OP posts:
kimlo · 26/10/2015 20:56

Fantasy, that would be a change in circumstances not a new claim. A new claim would be if a couple split up for example.

Does this affect the changes for 3 children? Or was that seprate?

squidzin · 26/10/2015 21:23

The good news about all this, is how it exposes the Tories as the liars that they are, and exposes their incompetence.

They lied to gain votes, but had no plan to see it through.

Evil geniuses without the genius.

squidzin · 26/10/2015 21:27

The "constitutional crisis" is only a crisis for the Tory party.

The HoL has never been more appreciated, they rarely receive such a platform.

bodenbiscuit · 26/10/2015 21:44

There certainly is a sense about this government that they think they can do what they like. The way they treat people is disgusting.

But really I blame people voting them in again who didn't read their manifesto. Now we are stuck with them for years while they dismantle public services which won't affect them and their rich pals because they don't actually use them in the first place.

ilovesooty · 26/10/2015 21:45

The cuts to tax credits weren't in the manifesto.

squidzin · 26/10/2015 21:47

boden, don't blame people for voting them in. They were misguided.

I blame everyone who didn't vote at all.

itsmeohlord · 26/10/2015 21:49

I have a dilemma. Not sure I like the idea of an unelected house of lords being able to vote against the elected government.

But the tax credit cuts are too draconian - they should be more gradual

I don't in principle believe that if you are working you should need government funding to subsidise a mean employer.

squidzin · 26/10/2015 21:49

People really need to understand what the Tory party are before they understand to stop voting for them.

They take on a lot of disguises.

blacksunday · 26/10/2015 21:50

Some commentary:

Osborne’s tax credit cuts are ‘delayed’ by Lords

voxpoliticalonline.com/2015/10/26/osbornes-tax-credit-cuts-are-delayed-by-lords/

bodenbiscuit · 26/10/2015 21:52

The tax credits weren't in the manifesto but it was obvious that they would be targeted - it was reported on for some time before. They're didn't say where the cuts were going to come from but the Tories have always been about stamping on the poor and giving massive tax breaks to the rich. They help about 1% of the U.K. And the rest of us they couldn't give a shit about.

blacksunday · 26/10/2015 21:55

Squid-

People really need to understand what the Tory party are before they understand to stop voting for them.

I agree. However, you give them too much credit. Only 24% of the public voted for them, and the last election was the most unrepresentative (votes vs. seats) election in history.

We also desperately need to fix our electoral system.

squidzin · 26/10/2015 22:03

itsmeohlord companies can and do pay the minimum they can get away with. In this country this means a lower minimum than people can earn to survive.

It's not "mean" it's basic economics.

The answer is either intervene in wages (force higher) or intervene in the cost of living (force cheaper).
Or provide wage subsidy.

Neoliberalism is against intervening in so-called market forces. (but is happy to intervene to prop up multinational companies and artificially inflate the property market).

The Neoliberal parties such as Tory / New Labour have a huge problem reconciling this discrepancy.

MoriartyIsMyAngel · 26/10/2015 22:10

There are other ways of recouping money than going after the poorest in society.

But the Tories have been doing that, almost unchallenged, for over five years. I'm glad they finally ran into the buffers. Now we wait to see what they do when they regroup - spiteful knobheads. If they can't take money from the poor one way, they'll find another way. Hell has no fury like an entitled posh twat scorned...

cruikshank · 26/10/2015 22:16

Exactly, squidzin. We keep on hearing about market forces and what the market will support etc but actually the market is rigged, as it stands.

I am a socialist so I don't subscribe to this 'free market' thing anyway, but actually the market that we have now is anything but free.

The problem that we have now is that we are a low wage economy with a high cost of living. And both of those aspects are due to the market being rigged.

MoriartyIsMyAngel · 26/10/2015 22:16

The prime minister is determined we will address this constitutional issue. A convention exists and it has been broken. He has asked for a rapid review to see how it can be put back in place.

"I'll scweam and scweam and scweam until I'm SICK!" - David Cameron, 26/10/2015