JW please help me to understand my new friend

[cantthinkofausername26]

I've got a lovely new friend, we have children the same age and they get on fabulously. My friend is a Jehovah's Witness. I understand she will not celebrate Christmas or birthdays but I'm nervous about offending her. For example, would it be weird to invite her to my house that's a Christmas grotto? How do I not leave her children out when DD gives out little gifts to her classmates at Christmas?

I have replied using manners and respect to all and will continue to do so. But I also expect others to be respectful and keep the conversation polite and considered.

Ultimately, a fair number ended up in death camps though.

@cabbageking

So no longer anonymous.
Well done

Please kindly and respectfully will you answer my question.

Love and kisses

Horrace

On a slightly lighter note, my professor of Hebrew used to love JW calls. He could easily dismiss "Jehovah" as the name of God and was interesting on the whole blood thing (ingesting is crucial here)

I also had a lovely neighbour as a child, a Polish guy who came over to serve in WW2, staunch RC who had retired and actually looked forward to their calls. He could argue for hours (in still slightly broken English) to the point where they would back down the steps with him in full flow and eventually try to creep past his house unnoticed. Mr Dobronski was too quick for them.

As others have said, my issue is with the organisation.

Well, this attempt to generate lovely fluffy stories about how great JWs are has gone completely to plan!

A Chronicle of the Persecution of Jehovah’s Witnesses in Nazi Germany

There was another one similar last week.
Ended up the same way.

The sympathisers never stick around very long. As soon as difficult questions are asked then shuffle off

There must have been something about cyber-witnessing in The Watchtower recently.

Yes more than likely .I find it terrifying the way they listen and read and then just obey without questioning. It makes me think of Nazi Germany.

I'm a 'strong' one. But your assesment tells me more about your mentality than anything else.

It's my choice whether my kids can study re. I'm mid 30s and I studied re with other kids in my hall. We all got GCSE A* - it's not true that we don't learn about other faiths, it would be ridiculous to be knocking on people's doors not knowing at all what their beliefs are.

What I didn't do is nativity assemblies or acts of worship like carol singing at the local church. I did sit out for those things as and I read whatever I wanted to. (Probably what ever Jacqueline Wilson was out) My kids are apparently given Ipads/colouring or comics when this sit out.

You are taking your own lived experience and assuming it applies to everyone who is choosing to be JW

The whole point is there is no freedom to pick and choose . The organisation makes it clear that allowing children to attend RE at school is absolutely not in line with their policy. I have never heard of any JW child being allowed to attend RE lessons.

This is all typical JW bait-and-switch tactics to draw people in. It's very common in high demand religions. They'll tell people "oh, we're not that strict really, you can still do lots of things and have lots of choices!" - but try actually exercising those choices once you've signed on the dotted line.

This is definitely a YOU problem.

Why aren't you in assembly?
I don't celebrate.. Eid, Xmas, Passover..whatever the assembly is

Why aren't you in R.E.?
I am

Why aren't you coming to the school disco?
if it not a religious disco, you'll see me there

Why aren't you in the school production?
if its nativity...becasue i dont celebrate xmas...if its Annie, i'll be Rover the dog

Why aren't you joining the netball team?
coz I'm in football, gymnastics, swimming and drama club...insert club/team of choice

Why aren't you coming to Julie's birthday?
Don't celebrate bdays, but I hope she has a lovely time. I hope Julie can make it to my end of SATS party so we can still have fun another time

Why aren't you making Christmas cards?
I don't celebrate Xmas, but pass the Prit stick.. I'm making a Minecraft Snowman card

Why aren't you doing the nativity with us?
I don't celebrate Xmas

Why aren't you dressed up for St David's, St Patrick's Day?
I don't celebrate saint days

I mean these questions are tedious but I was embarrassed by them i had other stuff going on as do my kids. Anything outside of religious PARTICIPATION is the choice of whoever raised you.

I don't know where you are or what age you are...but I'm telling you we do, and i did.

And my kids and other kids I know all do.

HRTFT but I'm ex JW. I drifted years ago so wasn't disfellowshipped. At times that would have been easier. There was no shunning if you simply left and I was harassed strongly encouraged back into the fold.
Be careful. Unless she's planning on leaving and creating a friendship group outside of 'The Truth,' I'd expect she's witnessing to you and possibly even counting you as a study.
Any 'worldly' association outside of the faith is strongly discouraged. They come before family, friends, even your own DC. I'd assume if she holds strong beliefs she won't be seeking a friend outside of the JWs.

The truth is I'm not going to change anyone's mind. I'm literally NOT here to change your mind. But personal attacks and annoying, and you telling me that everything I'm saying about how I raise my family is just propaganda is annoying. Like I'm going to post stuff on mumsnet painting a lovely picture meanwhile my kids are crying over an WT in the corner.

I don't think anyone's going to convert to be a jw just because I said we study RE and have presents at other times of the year.

I genuinely did only pop onto this thread to reply to OP who decided to leave. Which i think is understandable because she got the advice she was looking for.

@Horrace
@Tealeavesinthecup
Both of your experiences are not ALL of our experiences. I'm sorry for you both

🤣🤣🤣
I wish there had been, maybe I'd have stayed over on AIBU instead here with all you crazies.

@Namechanging88 What @Horrace and @Tealeavesinthecup went through, and what others here have described, are abuses that resulted from official JW policy. I was going to say that the JW organisation is a textbook example of a highly abusive religious group, but I'd go further than that and say they wrote the textbook. They're about as dishonest, corrupt, extreme and harmful as any religion gets.

Why do you think it's such an unpopular organisation? Anyone who knows anything about how it truly operates won't touch it with a bargepole.

@PrimitivePerson 8.6 million people globally don't feel that way I guess.

@Namechanging88 I bet loads of them are desperate to get out, but can't stomach the consequences of leaving.

@Namechanging88

The reason. We weren't allowed to join in with after school sports clubs or school productions was because it involved extra curricular activities with worldly people. That was strongly discouraged from the platform and articles such as Young People Ask in the Awake magazine and the Youth Book.

Discos we're a definite no no.

R.E. was a definite NO

If the GB have relaxed rules now then that's lovely for your kids. But for those of us that grew up before the Nooooo Light, it was torture and there was absolutely no biblical reason for any of it.
The rank and file just obeyed orders blindly.

Ask any JW that has left. They will all tell you the same if not similar experiences. It's not just us few here in this chat.

Admittedly some have very harrowing stories to tell. Others not so much. It all depends on how they left and at what period in time.

Some plan their exit carefully so as to avoid disfellowshipping.

Some stay in physically but are out mentally. This is because they fear losing everyone they know and love.

Even after leaving, it can take years to be fully out. It took me 10yrs.

I have current family members who are very active JWs. One is an elder. So I know what I’m talking about.

I think it's worth pointing out that there's a world of difference between converting as an adult and being born into the faith. Both for living and for leaving.

If you haven't people outside, and JW is all you know, it's extremely hard to get out. The fear of loosing everything and everyone is too much.

I went on a trip some years ago and there was a large group of JWs. The tour took us to a very famous gothic cathedral. The kids (all born into the faith) were physically shaking like a leaf at the prospect of going in, totally scared out of their wits - I'll never forget their faces. The adults were reluctant and conferred among themselves. The new converts said they'd traveled all that way, so they should go in.

Interesting. I was a born in.
I too would have been nervous about going in.
If I'm honest, going into churches still feels uncomfortable. I can't explain it.
Obviously it's so ingrained in me.