Page 10 | Would you pray for someone who asked you not to?

AchillesPoirot · 2022-04-05T08:32:19+00:00

Prompted by another thread. If you are of a faith, and you said to someone you’d pray for them, and they asked you not to, would you still do it? For honesty sake. I have no faith and find it offensive if I’ve asked someone not to pray for me that they do so.

Original poster

AchillesPoirot · 22/04/2022 11:05

In the spirit of friendship my arse.

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Original poster

AchillesPoirot · 22/04/2022 11:06

soultrader made no comment about what you may or may not have suffered.

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Original poster

AchillesPoirot · 22/04/2022 11:08

And by the way. Don’t assume I have no friends. And that I need or want you as a friend. You’re not the sort of person I would ever be friends with.

how DARE you insinuate I have no friends.

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Soultrader · 22/04/2022 11:14

Don't assume what I have suffered. My background is eventful to say the least.

I'm really not interested in your background at all. This isn't your thread, or mine. I said about mine for context. Id say that if you have suffered trauma it doesn't seem to have made you very empathetic yourself.

Strange considering how you want op to show empathy to her abusers. Anyway shes asked you to go away so what's your interest in continuing to harangue her?

Original poster

AchillesPoirot · 22/04/2022 12:07

Unrequited love is difficult butsomething people must learn to cope with otherwise it can turn to dysfunctional and abusive behaviours.

I have not in any way been dysfunctional or abusive towards them. Not in any way.

ive asked them to stop. As I’ve asked a poster on this thread to stop. They haven’t either

OP posts:

Name1232 · 22/04/2022 12:14

I'm atheist and happy for any religion to pray for me. It's their belief that it may help and is just their expression of caring, in my view its not real so doesnt matter at all.
However I guess if I was religious and someone of a different religion wanted to pray for me to their God then that may not be OK?

picklemewalnuts · 22/04/2022 13:19

@hihellohihello

Most people who haven't suffered trauma would shrug their shoulders but the fact the op can't, and that she's said you're triggering her suggests that there's something much deeper going on. Nobody should ever feel obliged to empathise with their abusers but that's what you are telling her to do.

Don't assume what I have suffered. My background is eventful to say the least.

You are badgering the OP. You are making assumptions about her situation, based on your own experiences (as we all do). It's possible you are right. It's far more likely you are not.

Please leave OP alone. What you are doing is not helpful. You are not being a critical friend. You are trampling over someone else's boundaries with no invitation to do so.

Please leave OP alone.

steppemum · 22/04/2022 16:35

hello
you're treating this thread as if it was a philisophical discussion. But it isn't.
Achilles has come on to ask because she has been traumatised by the treatment of a particular group.
In this situation, telling someone to be objective is like telling someone with a broken leg that pain is all in the mind.
It is, sort of, but that doesn't stop it hurting. A lot.
You comments are pretty inappropriate to the thread.

Thehundredthnamechange · 22/04/2022 17:10

saraclara · 22/04/2022 02:02

But I also don't think that it is wrong to pray for someone to return to God. I actually think it's a very loving thing to do, especially when that person seems to really hate you

It's not a loving thing at all. It's a controlling thing. The person who had left a faith has made their own decision. It's not up to those within that religion to 'bring them back' by praying.

This is such a bizarre opinion. I can't comprehend your personal position. Are you a Christian who thinks God uses people who then use God to control each other? 😳 Or are you an atheist, in which case how is praying for someone controlling if you don't believe the God being prayed to is real? So odd.

Thehundredthnamechange · 22/04/2022 17:13

Soultrader · 22/04/2022 08:16

Nobody is saying you are wrong to have feelings. But I also don't think that it is wrong to pray for someone to return to God

What part of loving thy neighbor includes failing to respect their religious choices? Would you pray for a Muslim to turn to Christianity? Isn't that offensive? Why's it different to pray for an atheist to turn to Christianity?

Even though prayer means nothing to me, if you're praying that someone will turn to religion you clearly do believe that a) you have the right to an opinion on their religious beliefs and b) that through prayer you have the power to turn them to your religion. How is that not disrespectful and offensive?

The people the op knows are weaponising their religion against her. There's more than one way to feel violated and you don't get to tell her that she shouldn't feel the way she feels about this. And this is why i can't stand religion. It always seems to come very much with a holier than thou attitude. Clearly prayer doesn't always come from love. These people don't seem to love op.

Is this a joke? Of course 'respecting religious choices' isn't really a part of being loving in a Christian context. Turning your back on God or worshipping false gods is warned against repeatedly in the bible. Loving people, in a Christian context, means trying to turn them back towards God, for their own benefit, even if it means that they hate you for it.

Thehundredthnamechange · 22/04/2022 17:14

Just don't talk to them 🙄 it's not a big deal. Move on. Don't think about it.

Original poster

AchillesPoirot · 22/04/2022 17:41

Loving people, in a Christian context, means trying to turn them back towards God, for their own benefit, even if it means that they hate you for it.
So. You would completely override my express request and carry on regardless.

And I haven't ever said I hate them you're making that up

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Original poster

AchillesPoirot · 22/04/2022 17:54

Thehundredthnamechange · 22/04/2022 17:14

Just don't talk to them 🙄 it's not a big deal. Move on. Don't think about it.

It's a big deal to me and it's not that simple.

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steppemum · 22/04/2022 19:00

I do think that prayer or not prayer is a slight red herring.

Because this is really not about someone quietly between them and God praying for something.

This is about the public prayer in a public meeting for someone, expressly about their lifestyle, and after they have said please don't.

If I believe God answers prayer then I have no need to parade my prayer in front of anyone. It is silent between me and God.

The parading in front of everyone is publicly making a comment.

It is no better than gossip which the Bible expressly tells us not to do.

Archilles is offended by that.
I would be in her position.

MarriedThreeChildren · 22/04/2022 19:13

Of course 'respecting religious choices' isn't really a part of being loving in a Christian context. Turning your back on God or worshipping false gods is warned against repeatedly in the bible. Loving people, in a Christian context, means trying to turn them back towards God, for their own benefit, even if it means that they hate you for it.

And that’s how you end up with wars going on because one group doesn’t follow the faith of another….

Have we not moved on from that? You know learning to be respectful of other people’s faith etc… (I classify being an atheist as having a faith, one where no god exist)

Greensleeves · 22/04/2022 19:18

Of course 'respecting religious choices' isn't really a part of being loving in a Christian context. Turning your back on God or worshipping false gods is warned against repeatedly in the bible. Loving people, in a Christian context, means trying to turn them back towards God, for their own benefit, even if it means that they hate you for it.

This is why it is difficult for atheists or people of other faiths to have healthy, trusting relationships with Christians. The boundary-trampling, intolerance and lack of respect for other people's autonomy is baked into the religion and can't be removed.

I would cut someone off without a second thought if I found out that they had been praying for me when I had expressly asked them not to. Not because I believe there is any power whatsoever in prayer, but because they do, and their lack of respect for my right to exert agency over my own life disgusts me.

Original poster

AchillesPoirot · 22/04/2022 19:19

This is why it is difficult for atheists or people of other faiths to have healthy, trusting relationships with Christians. The boundary-trampling, intolerance and lack of respect for other people's autonomy is baked into the religion and can't be removed.

This.

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GrouchyKiwi · 22/04/2022 19:53

The people in OP's life who are praying for her don't seem to be doing it out of a place of love or care, and that is the problem. It seems to be about control and coercion, which is why they make a point of telling her about it. In this case what they're doing is wrong.

I'm sorry, OP. This sounds horrible for you. I hope you're able to find space from these people.

Original poster

AchillesPoirot · 22/04/2022 20:22

means trying to turn them back towards God, for their own benefit, even if it means that they hate you for it.

This really bothers me. What you mean is they're doing it - and you do similar - for my own good.

As if I'm not an adult who can make my own choices.

You (generic) don't get to decide what is good for me. I get to make my own choices and they should be respected. And sitting in a house having a gossip and bitching session covered up by calling it prayer is just nasty.

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Thehundredthnamechange · 23/04/2022 03:47

AchillesPoirot · 22/04/2022 17:41

Loving people, in a Christian context, means trying to turn them back towards God, for their own benefit, even if it means that they hate you for it.
So. You would completely override my express request and carry on regardless.

And I haven't ever said I hate them you're making that up

Yes. If you were a person I loved and cared for, and you turned your back on your faith for some reason - and reason - I'd definitely pray for you to find peace and return to God and I would do this out of love. I wouldn't tell you I was praying for you if it made you angry, but I wouldn't stop. I would accept any anger you felt towards me as a sacrifice I needed to make for someone I cared about to return to God.

Thehundredthnamechange · 23/04/2022 03:48

AchillesPoirot · 22/04/2022 20:22

means trying to turn them back towards God, for their own benefit, even if it means that they hate you for it.

This really bothers me. What you mean is they're doing it - and you do similar - for my own good.

As if I'm not an adult who can make my own choices.

You (generic) don't get to decide what is good for me. I get to make my own choices and they should be respected. And sitting in a house having a gossip and bitching session covered up by calling it prayer is just nasty.

Obviously I am referring purely to prayer and not to 'gossip and bitching' which is of course entirely different! You asked about praying for others. Yes, I would pray. But no, I wouldn't bitch or gossip as these things are also unbiblical.

Thehundredthnamechange · 23/04/2022 03:50

Sorry, posted too soon. As a Christian I don't think that anyone who believes that they don't need God has made a good or correct choice. Everyone needs God, in my opinion. So no, I would never think 'Well, she's an adult! If she doesn't want God then good for her!' I'd never think this.

Original poster

AchillesPoirot · 23/04/2022 05:22

@Thehundredthnamechange so you have a problem with consent then and you're happy to trample on my boundaries because you think you know better than me what is good for me.

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Original poster

AchillesPoirot · 23/04/2022 05:22

Also. Did you read the sort of thing that is being done to me?

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Thirdsummerofourdiscontent · 23/04/2022 05:32

If I did I wouldn’t tell you, that’s the asshole bit. But honestly I feel it’s fine to pray for whatever I want. As they say that’s between me and God.