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Philosophy/religion

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Original poster

Guidance sought

207 replies

MillieMallard · 03/11/2018 22:35

Have namechanged. I’m a Catholic and am active in my church. I go to Mass regularly. I abide by the teachings. I have been listening to faith leaders from my own and other denominations and faiths online for some time now. I also have friends with other faiths, Christian denominations and general outlooks.

I need to talk to someone because I need to discuss some faith questions but I can’t talk to my priest. The reason for this is that I know him very well which sounds contradictory but as he is embroiled in my whole life, I need neutrality. Also, he is always so busy that I don’t want to be an inconvenience. There’s lots more to this but I don’t want to out myself. A key area though is that my friend’s partner is a leader in another faith and believes I am not saved because I am Catholic. I’ve listened to information from so many avenues that I’ve been overloaded in my quest for an answer and just would like someone neutral with some theological knowledge to talk to. Any ideas? Also I haven’t come in here to be slated by atheists as seems to happen on so many other forums. Please help with any useful suggestions. I feel desperate. I just don’t know where to turn.

OP posts:
Fink · 04/11/2018 20:44

I'm happy to have a chat via PM if you want. I'm a Catholic studying for a doctorate in theology.

Or, I really suggest you talk to someone IRL. Without knowing where you are it's hard to make specific suggestions. If not your priest then are there any priests of surrounding parishes you could go to? a) they're not going to check up on whether you're in their parish and b) if they did ask, you could just say what you've said here: that you would prefer not to discuss this with your parish priest for personal reasons. If you're anywhere near a big city, there will be other options too, but that's a start.

Jason118 · 04/11/2018 23:02

Ok, I rephrase, there is no evidence for a spiritual dimension. It may exist in your and others heads, but that doesn't make it a real thing, just imagined.

noego · 05/11/2018 12:13

@Jason118

I agree. I can imagine a spiritual dimension and I can choose to believe imagination or not.
I am also aware that my mind can imagine. But what is it that is aware of the mind and imagination? It cannot be mind as that would infer that I have two minds.
So there is something that perceives the mind. In fact it perceives the mind, body and the universe.

What would that be then?

Slow down, look really closely. This might just be the evidence you seek!

speakout · 05/11/2018 12:25

noego

I do have a spiritual path- but I am aware that others don't.

noego · 05/11/2018 12:46

@speakout

No one is aware they are on a spiritual path, until it is pointed out to them.

There may have been a time in your life when you wasn't aware. I certainly wasn't.

speakout · 05/11/2018 12:49

I know I am on a spiritual path- I don't need anyone to point this out to me.

picklemepumpkin · 05/11/2018 12:55

Depending of course on your definition, I don't think it's possible to not be on a spiritual path.

Many people choose not to explore it, which is their choice.

The National Curriculum required us to help children develop a sense of their spirituality, by reflection/contemplation, looking at the stars, wondering at nature etc.

There is more to spirituality than any religion.

speakout · 05/11/2018 13:08

There is more to spirituality than any religion.

I agree. I am on a spiritual path and I am an atheist.

Knitwit101 · 05/11/2018 13:16

If you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, then you will be saved. Romans 10:9

This.

Separate out what the scripture says from the rules and rituals created by people.

If you have faith you will be saved.

I have just read a biography of Martin Luther who back in the 1500s caused an uproar by suggesting that faith is all you need. All the manmade stuff surrounding it is a red herring.

Vitalogy · 05/11/2018 13:43

And what happens to all the souls that have never heard of Jesus Knitwit101

Knitwit101 · 05/11/2018 15:48

And what happens to all the souls that have never heard of JesusKnitwit101

Then they won't believe in Jesus or salvation or the afterlife and they will be dead and that's that. If you don't believe then there is nothing for you to worry about

Vitalogy · 05/11/2018 16:55

Then they won't believe in Jesus or salvation or the afterlife and they will be dead and that's that. If you don't believe then there is nothing for you to worry about Oh right.

Jason118 · 05/11/2018 22:43

Noego
*I agree. I can imagine a spiritual dimension and I can choose to believe imagination or not.
I am also aware that my mind can imagine. But what is it that is aware of the mind and imagination? It cannot be mind as that would infer that I have two minds.
So there is something that perceives the mind. In fact it perceives the mind, body and the universe.

What would that be then? *
Of course it can be mind - it's called self awareness and needs no mumbo jumbo claptrap to explain it. You've too much time on your hands to think all this stuff up, but although meaningless it's entertaining

TooManyPaws · 05/11/2018 23:19

Jason118

If you don't have too much time on your hairy hands, then why are you hanging around the section of the site that deals with what you call "mumbo jumbo claptrap" in order to troll?

Jason118 · 05/11/2018 23:25

Nothing wrong with philosophy in my book. Just off to shave my hands :)

noego · 06/11/2018 07:47

@Jason118

Of course you are self aware. I wouldn't expect anything different. You are self aware of your body and mind. After all you have spent decades creating it. It has been programmed and conditioned by family, education, religion, politics, society, media, circumstance and you believe it to be true and you believe it to be the self. Are you that closed to the possibility that there could be something within in you that is aware that all of this is illusory? An entity that perceives all of this.....................
After all the ocean creates waves, but the ocean isn't a wave, it is still the ocean.
I understand that from your standpoint you believe this to be mumbo jumbo. I can assure you it isn't. One day you will have the same realisation. It may be on your death bed whilst you take your last breath, but you will have it. The realisation it is all a dream!!!

@TooManyPaws

Whether they are trolling or not. They are being the conduit for the Truth to come out and are in exactly the right place at the right time for this to happen.

Vitalogy · 06/11/2018 07:59

They are being the conduit for the Truth to come out and are in exactly the right place at the right time for this to happen. Love that.

Jason118 · 06/11/2018 19:29

Not trolling, I just have no empathy for the flowery use of words and Truth with a capital T as if somehow that makes it a thing. Others have and that's OK but other worldly stuff doesn't do it for me without some logic attached, or at least something I can see as a possibility. I'm open to the fact that there might be a something, but my conviction threshold is very high. Peace.

PurpleAndTurquoise · 06/11/2018 21:19

These people are absolutely brilliant. I found them so helpful. They answer any question however hard.

christianity.org.uk/

DioneTheDiabolist · 06/11/2018 21:24

Maybe Jason is right about himself and his life. Maybe some people don't have souls or any spirituality.

speakout · 06/11/2018 21:31

I agree with Jason's view on "Truth".

Not an idea that is meaningful to me.

Vitalogy · 07/11/2018 00:07

The truth not being meaningful, well ok then. Confused

leafbud · 07/11/2018 08:11

The truth is simply correct. We might perceive it, we might not. It can be elusive to people, difficult to interpret hence the capitalisation because truth becomes somehow more precious. Once truth is perceived other unexplained things often fall into place.

Our brains have to interpret all of the information all our senses detect. When there is missing information the brain can bridge the gap. When there is anomalous information the brain can dismiss it. We refer information back to past experiences and the influence of those around us. What we perceive might not necessarily by the truth.

Spirituality to me speaks to what is at the crux of things. It can be a thing that influences how we perceive and experience actual truth. Such as the way being around negative critical people can influence how a person might interpret their own abilities.

leafbud · 07/11/2018 08:11

Be the truth, I meant to type.

speakout · 07/11/2018 08:17

leafbud

What us "Truth " though- give me an example?