Overly strict uniform policies in secondary schools - does anyone want MNHQ to run a campaign about this?

[TooStressyForMyOwnGood]

So many secondary schools now seem to have super strict uniform policies. I feel this results in:

Low pupil morale
Parents having to spend a fortune on the latest uniform
Almost impossible to find a black school shoe that is appropriate and yet actually fit for purpose
Exclusions, isolations and detentions for flimsy reasons

And my personal favourites:-

Blazers have to be worn all summer even if children faint
Measuring school skirt length
Pupils not allowed non-school shoes even with a hospital note

I’ve asked MNHQ if they want to run a campaign and they suggested I post here, so here goes.

Personally I am in favour of uniform but would like a common sense approach, which many, many schools achieve with few problems.

Fully expecting posts from people in favour of the rules too.

[RiverTam]

I always think that excessive uniform rules in state secondaries are academies desperately trying to ape private schools - most of which have far more relaxed rules.

DD is at a non-uniform primary and we are are dreading the move to unformed secondary (all the secondaries round here have uniform whereas a few primaries don't). She is able to wear practical clothes (usually leggings, t shirt and trainers) that suit the day's activities and the weather and her. She has very sensitive skin that's prone to coming out in rashes so she doesn't wear anything with embroidered embellishments on it etc. She is also thin with long legs so we don't have to worry about shoehorning her into stuff that won't fit properly. Tights are useless, never fit properly -but it doesn't have to matter.

Brits are obsessed by uniform and seem to think that a non-uniform school is the equivalent of non-uniform days in a uniform school. It isn't.

[Raspberry88]

I would also support it. I'm a way off having a school age child still but it's always bothered me and it's something I dread.
And shoes!! why on earth can't they wear trainers? They're much better for their feet and backs.
This...I find it incredible that schools prioritise smartness over comfort and support for growing feet! It's so important to look after your feet!

[Raspberry88]

It also bothers me that schools seem to be placing so much value on the idea that all pupils will need to be wearing similar in their future workplace. I think it teaches children that jobs that require business attire are more valuable than manual or messy jobs. They should be teaching children that there are lots of ways to succeed

[TooStressyForMyOwnGood]

YY Raspberry.

Weetabix, thanks for that explanation, that makes sense. Sadly it also explains everything I hate about academies.

[Weetabixandshreddies]

TooStressyForMyOwnGood

You're not alone in your hatred for academies. Sadly the trend now is to force acadamisation onto any school refusing to go of their own accord.

It is an absolute scandal in my view.

[Racecardriver]

@mysparklingpersonality once you have exhausted whatever official complaints procedure you can launch a JR. the grounds you are looking at is irrationality. You can look at the Begum case for uniforms.

[MaisyPops]

Also, they are turning our children into uniformed robots. stamping on their creativity and personal expression.
This sort of ridiculous hyperbole is what limits debates around changing uniforms and reform.

Wearing a uniform for part of a day doesn't remove someone's personality and creativity, unless their sense of self is so unbelievably fragile. It's not going to prevent them expressing themselves as an individual unless they've got zero personality or original thinking skills.

Some of the most witty, critical and good in an argument students I teach are the ones who wear their uniform properly. They dont need to bitch about how unfair it is wearing a school jumper because they know they have lots going for them and that part of life and affecting change is knowing what and when to challenge.

[BoneyBackJefferson]

Has anyone given a definite answer to what is a "sensible" uniform policy?
We have what I would consider to be one

Black leather shoe like footwear, no logos or coloured flashes
Trousers black, anything other than skinny.
white shirt.
tie (meh)
Blue jumper
polo shirt (summer)
Dark coat

we do have logo'd stuff but it is cheap.

yet we still have those that will brake the uniform rules.

[Cachailleacha]

We have

Black leather school shoes (no trainers or similar)
Black trousers (not jeans style)
White shirt
Tie
Black jumper (optional)
Blazer (with logo)
Polo shirt (with logo, summer, optional)
Coat (any colour)

I'd prefer the polo to be an option all year, but otherwise I think it's sensible

[SnuggyBuggy]

I think a school tie and some sort of top, I don't mind blazers in of themselves but they shouldn't cost stupid money.

Trousers or skirt of a reasonable colour like black, navy or grey that aren't too short or revealing.

Plain black shoes which can be weather appropriate, plain socks if visible or optional tights for cold weather. No one learns better with bacterial vaginosis or thrush due to compulsory tights.

Ordinary bog standard shirt or polo shirt can be bought in a supermarket.

Plain shorts or jogging bottoms and t shirt for PE in a reasonably available colour. Optional sweatshirt or zip up in plain colour for cold weather.

[RiverTam]

Why on earth does any child need to wear a tie??? What is the point of that?

[SnuggyBuggy]

I don't think anyone needs to but on the other hand it's not something that I would strongly object to. They do seem to be dying out in the workplace which is a shame as it was always a potential Christmas present.

[redsummershoes]

tie?!?
really?!?

I would be happy with a sensible dresscode.
body covered by clothing elbows to knees.
shoes suitable for walking 5 miles.
no writing or logos on clothing or bags.

[Cachailleacha]

Our blazers are about £35, and you would usually need two in five years, so works out at about £14 a year. There is also the option of buying the badge to sew on a plain blazer, or buying second hand.

We have both a rugby kit and PE kit, which I think should be replaced with just polo shirt and shorts. These are single supplier but great quality, and like the blazer, you would usually only need two sets in five years.

[RiverTam]

The only rules at DD’s school are no vest tops and no flip flops.

Like I said, most kids are in jeans/leggings/joggers and a t shirt, and trainers. Shorts and dresses when it’s warmer.

Yes, some kids are more interested in fashion but certainly DD has not once in 5 years mentioned what anyone else is wearing except to say if someone has the same item as her, which she likes. Clothing is an absolute non-issue, and can be as cheap or expensive as you like. The only thing I spend money on is decent trainers (not designer or sports brands but not supermarket ones either).

[Trish10000t]

DD wears blouse, tie, jumper & blazer, and skirt/tights. The jumper and blazer are both generally worn at all times. I am okay with this. It teaches discipline and respect. She is used to it, having worn it for several years, and does not complain. I’m sure she does get hot at times, but I don’t know that a uniform needs to be comfortable all the time. When it’s really hot the school will allow them to take their jumpers/blazers off in class.

[redsummershoes]

It teaches discipline and respect

how?

[Cachailleacha]

The jumper and blazer are both generally worn at all times.
That must get incredibly hot. My DS has never worn his jumper, only his blazer, which can be removed in class.

[ivykaty44]

A common sense approach to clothing for attending education for all regardless of background - wonderful idea

[Trish10000t]

I don’t believe that the boys are required to wear the jumper.

[Gileswithachainsaw]

I’m sure she does get hot at times, but I don’t know that a uniform needs to be comfortable all the time. When it’s really hot the school will allow them to take their jumpers/blazers off in class

Wow how kind of them

Shame my dd would have shredded her arms and probably got them infected while they decided it was warm enough to remove them... while they stood there in thin blouses or short sleeved shirts or their sunner dresses

[TooStressyForMyOwnGood]

Giles, it’s just batshit isn’t it?!

I should say that despite how it might seem on this thread, I have met a great many brilliant teachers and I have had a good (I hope!) relationship with my DCs’ infant school. I have never once not supported any discipline or rules the schools has had with both my DCs.

I sure as shut will not be supporting anything as downright uncomfortable and potentially dangerous as shoes in the snow or blazers all summer though. At some point you have to draw a line. Mine is where children are at risk of skin damage and fainting.

Really good point by a PP though of looking into why children’s feet hurt in shoes just in case there is a foot issue that needs investigating.

[TooStressyForMyOwnGood]

Autocorrect is politer than me! Meant to write sure as shit.

[Cachailleacha]

I don’t believe that the boys are required to wear the jumper. That makes even less sense. Why do girls require a jumper but not boys?