Please stop writing "gotten"

[Oldjustold]

That's it really.

Maybe they're just well-educated people with a good understanding of the vocabulary of their language - and they're not like some teenagers who think that you're only allowed to use words or phrases that were first said in the past five years, or that they use on Love Island?

It's ironic how many people rightly embrace the rich legacy that Shakespeare left us, with the many new words and phrases that he introduced or brought to wider usage; but then they scoff at other standard words that he also used - ones that have never stopped being in continual use by English speakers everywhere - and denounce them as 'obsolete' or American, just because they don't regularly use them, or because they first heard them on a US TV series on Netflix.

You might as well insist that we shouldn't use the words 'to', 'be', 'or' and 'not' - because Shakeapeare used them (so they must be archaic) and Americans use them (so they must not also be British English).

Some people just don't seem to understand that, whilst there are indeed a lot of words and phrases that are used in (English-speaking) North America but not in the UK and Ireland, and vice versa, the vast majority of our language is the same.

Nobody will convince me 'gotten' isn't a word. Just like you won't tell me 'yous' isn't, just because you don't say it on your part of the uk. I'd often be corrected by my mum though when growing up. You'll probably find that a lot across Scotland in, like a pp said, working class backgrounds where people were aspiring to be/sound richer. Probably why her father and surrounding family don't use it and it's perhaps dying out in places along with a far more diverse society now. It's definitely still alive and well in places though - and absolutely nothing to do with America!

The use of gotten was normal in Britain and was in use when the British were colonising large parts of the world where it is still in use.
The use changed in in some parts of the UK but not all. This is normal - language evolves.

We now hear gotten again irl and on MN from posters in other parts of the world (some very close like Ireland) and in the UK.
Some British people are evolving the language again to gotten. Why should English on MN get stuck on that first change, why is that correct and must be maintained?

I was reading to DS last night and Enid Blyton uses gotten, so it hasn't been out of common parlance for that long.

Lots of things have gears not just cars

Surely an excellent example of how "gotten" can be used perfectly well within British English?!

I use gotten at times, and have done my whole life. It's not a new habit I've picked up from greater exposure to US English.

I understand some people bristling over how US English is becoming the norm and replacing British English terms. However, that doesn't mean we should stop using perfectly acceptable words that we have been using in British English for a very long time just because they also become popular in the US.

I find the differences between different global versions of English fascinating. I don't just mean the different words we use or spellings, but the whole structure of a sentence - for example, at the weekend vs on the weekend etc.

But it never stopped being used by a great many English speakers.

just because somebody uses it prominently in a popular book/song/TV programme, that doesn't mean that they personally have single-handedly 'brought it back' into usage.

Just awful 😏… it’s not even “short” for something
….and it’s not H-aitch either

That would be OK if the people who’ve said “got” all their lives and suddenly start saying “gotten” could prove it’s because they’ve been reading historical books, not because of watching Netflix !

Lots of things have gears not just cars

I know, but do you ever hear them being ground other than in a manual car?

Undoubtedly some people only hear a word for the first time on Netflix and then start using it themselves, but it doesn't mean that many other people haven't been using it all along.

Children especially learn new vocabulary from books, programmes and listening to others - but we all learn new things (to us) all of the time.

Well you do if you work with those things day in and day out

Whereas me personally have never ground gears in a car because Im an automatic driver, as is my OH.

Shakespeare, Richard III "With much ado at length have gotten leave, To look upon my sometimes royal master's face."

Really ? It is used in regular chit chat amongst all the Scottish people I know .

Gotten is a legitimate word, language especially on chat sites evolves it's a shame you are so rigid Op maybe chat forums are not for you.

Yes! It used to be "gotten" and gradually morphed into "got". I'm not a fan, but it IS correct English too, historically speaking.

I feel that I am able to be pedantic here as I am in a pedants safe space. I humbly submit that something is either correct, or it is not, irrespective of the reason for its use.

That said, I do agree that the use is not driven by the user's need to reawaken middle English vocabulary, and that you are right in your assertion that it is more a result of Netflix etc.

I used to LOVE Enid Blyton books - I read them all during my childhood, repeatedly. Absolutely brilliant. Out of interest, what were you reading to your DS last night?

I wonder if Enid Blyton is one of the reasons that gotten is a regular part of my vocabulary?!

YES, PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE STOP IT!!!!

I hate it. I’m still reeling from a post that had the double whammy of ‘should I of gotten…’

I had to have a lie down.

That said, I do agree that the use is not driven by the user's need to reawaken middle English vocabulary, and that you are right in your assertion that it is more a result of Netflix etc.

That depends on where the user lives @HappiestSleeping.

As it’s grammatically correct and is correct English it’s just a pet peeve and not wrong so what’s your point exactly? People don’t use the correct word because you don’t like it?

Very true. I should have included the caveat of them being UK based. As has been pointed out earlier, we are on an international forum.

I did see a documentary about language, and how American English has changed less over the years than British English has, and thus could be argued as being more English than British English is. I can't find it though. That would set off some considerable debate, I'd wager 🤣

Northern Ireland and Scotland are both part of the UK.

England really is an outlier on this one.

Also true. I am geographically challenged this morning it seems. Also, until this thread, I hadn't realised that the word was in such common use in NI and Scotland. Every day is a learning experience.

That poster was very impressive I thought, and was dignified when scores of posters corrected her grammar. Some made fools of themselves by correcting "gotten", which was used correctly. And others made fools of themselves by correcting "of", as if knowing it's "should have" is somehow makes them look like geniuses.