The Motherhood Delusion

[SantaLucia]

A thread to safely house all the thoughts that you are ashamed to admit. Example:

Why did we have children?

When does it all become worth it?

The day my child was born was NOT the best day of my life (it was my wedding) and I absolutely remember the pain and the boredom of being in hospital.

I can't be bothered reading about child development.

The health visitor is not worth a trip in the rain with a sleeping baby.

Thank goodness I'm over that "newborn" stage. Roll on year 5!

Oh and I was also unprepared for how mind-numbingly DULL housework is. Just so boring. Washing cleaning tidying is not interesting at all.

And how little respect there is for mums, whether you work or stay at home. I am so unimportant now it makes me want to weep. Thank heavens for the cats, to whom I am still number one!!!

While I totally agree with many of the posts here and could have written a good number of them myself, I don't think it's fair to blame "feminism".

For a start there are many different feminists who take opposing positions on work-family debates. Many feminists have banged on incessantly for at least 50 years about the inequalities in the system, and the way in which our social structures and expectations mean that women often have more trouble than men with combining parenthood and their other concerns (including paid work and careers). From Betty Friedan onwards there's been a long stream of feminist thought on these issues. Very few feminists have said you can be supermum and supercareerwoman, along with being sex goddess and popular chilled out socialite. That's a media concept, not a feminist one. Many contemporary feminists working in this field are far more likely to harp on about the importance of men revising their ideas on parenting and work, or on employers or policymakers changing working conditions to improve the chances of gender equity. For example Swedish feminists have a long campaign going on pushing a 6 hour working day as the norm. Rather than insisting that women should work long hours and also be mothers.

Yes some days the endless, mindless, grinding, thankless repetition actually takes my breath away; I stop and think 'I really can't do all this again now, and then again later, still be up doing stuff at 9.30 at night (granted whilst slurping wine - just carry bottle and glass with me to whichever room needs the most work!!!) and then again tomorrow ad nauseum.....just for that split second I feel as though my head will explode if i don't just walk away and get some peace for myself....and then I take a deep breath...swallow and carry on.

Like many, it's the peace I miss. Much as I love my dh, he is disabled (and needs quite a bit of looking after) and is around pretty much 24/7 (along with a constant stream of his mates who come to keep him company....you should see my food bills...hairy bikers have huge appetites!), but on the occasional nights he goes to see a friend and ds is in bed I sometimes just wander around the house listening to the quiet; I crave it; want to gulp it down and hold it inside myself for the next time i feel as though if I don't cram Wallace and bloody Grommit up Bob the feckin' Builders fundament I will have to start slowly and deliberately banging my head repeatedly against the nearest hard surface!

Man...thanks for the rant! That feels better.

I don't know Fennel, I grew up in the eighties and there were all these posters saying 'Girls Can do Anything!' and it was expected that we would be at the top in our careers and also have children. Now I have realised that I can't do 'anything' and I don't want to try!

For me that means cutting back my work hours (I am lucky that this is an option for me) and hopefully! getting a cleaner when I return to work.

I don't know if it is right to blame 'feminism', but I sure feel like someone sold me a lie!!!

I find the "being the one who thinks of everything" role the hardest.
I'm currently packing to go on holiday and I just realsied that every time the family leaves home I am the one who has to remember: wipes, tissues, food, drink, sun hats, sun cream, umbrellas, change of clothes etc etc.
If anything ever happens when we are out DH turns to me and says "where are the tissues/wipes etc?" like it HAS to be me.
Can't partenrs remeber this stuff too? My mum, thinking about it, did exactly the same. So if you forget anything, it's a failure, but the other half not ever doing anything somehow isn't.
Last week I packed God knows what for a day out, got there and realised I had forgotten my walking stick...not much of a day out for me that.

Only since being a mum have I realised what a bloody thankless and good job my mum did all those years and how my DH (and actually all the DHs I know and my dad and brother) never concern themselves with domestic stuff much.

I thought we had an equal relationship till DD came along, now I realise I do 90% of the housework and tidying and all the planning and organising. The other 10% is my cleaner.
DH will do things if barked at.

Running a home and family is so hard and no one gives you awards, they just point out when you forget things, and running the domestic lives of several people is hard and time consuming and thankless...I do wish someone had prepared us for this at some point!

Ohh miggsie. Are you me?

I also HAAATE being the one who has to remember everything!! This is a bugbear of mine and when I lose it occasionally and try to explain to DH how I feel about it he looks at me blankly.

He just doesn't get it. Sometimes I feel I have no brain synapses left with having to remember everything about home, school (primary and secondary) and hold down a very responsible job too!

And its not just the big things. Its the little things like clean PE kits, not running out of toilet roll, taking coats on a day out. I have to leave EVERYTHING in full sight or it gets left behind.

Some weeks I feel like all I do is just move STUFF from one place to another. STUFF that no-one else notices until it isn't there!

Don't get me wrong, DH is very willing to pitch in BUT only when he is given specific instructions (that I have to remember to give him!!) ARRGGGHHHHHHHH.

WinkyWinkola "Motherhood is totally undermined in the UK, I think"

So true. Was back with my family last week. I am EXHAUSTED - DS 20mths, DD 3mths. Up all night feeding etc etc.

My BIL (who has no kids BTW) was laughing at me about going upstairs for a nap when the kids were asleep. He simply didn't understand how it could be difficult "sitting at home watching the Olympics"......mmm

olympicsnotfederer - so true. You move things around to make sure everything is in order. But of course noone notices until it isn't done. And it drives me MAD that I have to remember everything as well. The other day we all went out in the car and down the road I remembered that I had forgotten DS's water and snacks. I just lost it that DH hadn't thought of it (everything else was in the car) and he said - well you didn't tell me!! But that's the point - you have to remember it to tell them to do it...

I would be interested to know if ANYONE's DH is responsible for this kind of thing.

I am accepting at the moment that while we are both off work (school holidays) and DH is doing DIY/building work outside every day I inevitably cook, clean look after the kids etc.

But why does this "thinking of things" HAVE to be me?

It's not so much division of labour, DH is never idle, but as you say, always being the one "responsible" for the kids and everything to do with them.

This is where I feel feminism has lied to me personally.

I truly believe there is no reason for it to be ME, yet why is it?

Do people with sah partners (men) NOT have to think about the minutae of the children's lives?

I really want to know this.

I put stuff on the bottom of the stairs in the hope someone OTHER that me will take it up...
Nope, still there after 6 weeks...!
The cat will have destroyed it before anyone other than me takes it upstairs.

I did a blast off last week that DH buys clothes, then comes in, leaves them in the plastic bag in the hall and never actually takes them out of the bag or takes them upstairs let alone hang them in the wardrobe?

Why oh why does this tedium devolve to me?
High IQ, lots of qualifications and responsible job, nope, sorry, you're a woman...do the tedious crap day in day out!
ARG!

I love DH and DD but they drive me mad sometimes, at least DD has the excuse she is 4, what is my husband's excuse...?!

Whoops, must remember to get milk and toilet rolls...family life really is so mundane most of the time isn't it?

It also annoys me that women's mags seem to have only 2 approaches to anything which are: "solve your frustration by knitting and cooking" OR "feel inadequate while reading about someone who has enough money to delgate the tedious shit to someone else".

Fennel, I don't BLAME feminism - I am a proud feminist (weirdly, so many women I know today say they aren?t which always shocks me). But, the whole ?women can do anything men can? and are equal to men is what made me think I could conquer anything in the world and at work. But since becoming a mother, I have found out that I?m not equal actually. And in my experience, having a child has made that clear to me. As a mother, I find myself in a role similar to those held by women in society pre-feminism. And it is a role that (having grown up in a world post-feminism) that I am ill prepared for. Therein lies the problem for me.

Perhaps we need some kind of new feminist movement, 'post-post-modern-neo-feminism' which takes into account where we are today and addresses the issues faced by women who have grown up in a culture imbibed with the feminist successes of the 60's and 70's? We have advantages, privileges and experiences that women for thousands of years could only have dreamed of, but we now have a new set of problems that need to be addressed.

Anyway, hijack over. Motherhood is hard!

It's great being a woman and a mother, but you have to change as your life changes.
You need to grow and meet the needs of your dependants unflinchingly
Your husbands are not dependants
You need to make it clear that you expect certain standards from him
Many women do the mothering' oh, don't worry, I'll do it' and then complain when husband and children grow up taking her for granted
Miggsie- sounds to me like you are making these problems your own.
His clothes that he bought, for example, it's up to him if he leaves them in a bag

Penona - I am in SE London.

This has got to the frankest and most interesting thread i have read for some time. i love dd and ds and count my blessings that we conceived easily, i sailed through pregnancy and am unscathed by childbirth (apart from the stretch marks). DD is 2.5 and delightful (most of the time) and DS is 4 months and giving me the cutest gummy smile ever.But I can't help but feel cheated. I spent 4 years training for my job. I have been educated to degree level and just assumed i would have it all. The truth is as soon as I announced I was pregnant it changed. I began to be side lined at work and no longer sent on courses, etc. I returned PT after DD and continued to be side lined.Whenever DD was off sick it was me who took the day off. I did all the running around to and from nursery. the majority of getting up in the night and 99% of the housework. I am now on mat leave with DS. If I go back I will effectively be earing £70 per month for nearly 2 years due to travel and childcare costs. At the beginning of mat leave i was sure i wouldnt go back but I just dont know how much longer i can take going to playgroups, chatting endlessly about schools and following the never ending circle of wash, wipe and clean.If I go back i will feel frustrated by the way i am treated and the pitiful amount of money i would earn. DH works long hours nearly 2 hours from home and we have no family help.

Ok - his clothes his problem.

But what about a day out with OUR kids?

If you don't bring the stuff you come across as point-scoring and petty and the day is ruined by lack of essential stuff.

If you do bring it, it's YOUR fault DH hasn't because you are letting him not do it.

Is there any way out of this?

It's not about fault!
Doesn't your DH ever take them out on his own?
If so, he surely packs a bag first?
Therefore, through experience, either of you should be capable of doing it

It's having to TELL them ALL the time to do things that gets me...he can't ever notice it himself.
My friend's DH is even worse it has to be said as he puts on odd socks and forgets his keys all the time.

I just can't cope with buying clothes and leaving them in the bag for 5 weeks, I mean, why did he buy them in the first place????

I notice however that if he buys a new set of wargame figures he's whipped them out of the bag and out of the packaging the minute he gets home...and leaves the packaging on the table until I say "throw that rubbish in the bin"
!!!!!
The choice seems to be: do it myself, or constantly be telling someone to do things, then I feel like a fishwife, then I think "but he should be able to do this, he is a grown man" and then I think "would it be easier to say nothing and just do it myself?"...a bit like tidying up the toys really, I have the same circular argument there too.
Oh yes, and then I get guilt that I am annoyed, because therefore I am failing in my motherly duties...!!!

But your cleaning up after your husband is not a motherly duty!
Sit down and have a frank discussion instead of 'nagging'

In the last couple of years I have forced encouraged my DH to take the kids camping while I am at work (I work one weekend out of four).

I have made it clear I will do NOTHING to help in the preparation for these jaunts. I leave nothing out for him to find, I remind about nothing and I do not pack ANYTHING for ANYBODY.I stick to it.

I sit on the sofa with a glass of wine while this is occurring. If anything major is forgotten, I will not remind/bail out.

I then happily go to work but come home in the evening to my cosy home, safe in the knowledge that somewhere in a field they are shivering(forgot coats), dirty (forgot changes of clothes), cold (forgot sleeping bags) etc etc etc.

This is my revennnnge mwah-ha-ha-ha.

I don't know how many thank yous to write here, maybe a million. I had been feeling so guilty that for a week or so now, every day I have wanted to just walk out and keep walking, and up until now I have felt so alone.
My DS is 19 months old and a happy and confident wee boy. He doesn't sleep well though, never has and I feel in some way that sleep deprivation has contributed to how I feel. My DH is lovely, great daddy, but he comes from a culture where women don't talk about their feelings with men, and so gets surprised when I moan and complain a lot, especially as his mum had six children in 8 years obviously with a smile plastered across her face the entire time.

I am now back to work and that feels better, as a stay at home mum I was lonely and quite depressed. But there are still days when I long for a sleep in, or even sleep where I know I am not going get woken up every three hours. And a break from the housework! And my pre-pregnancy body! Those lovely black trousers I used to wear sit in my wardrobe, reminding me that my butt never used to be Mt Everest.

And I have only one DS too. I don't know how some of you have 3, even 4. I am honestly considering just having one. In a small way because of everything I have written, but in a big way because I really think that for me personally, one is enough. I have absolutely no desire for another child - my DH wants at least one more, but the thought fills me with horror. Maybe in a couple of years I will change my mind, but maybe not.

So thank you once again MNers, you have made me feel better, and if I dare say it a bit more positive about things.

my dh is great round the house, he easily does as much as me (and if he didn't I'd tell him to get his finger out)

but when we go out its me who always carries the money, he's like the queen, never has a penny on him!

TBH some of this thread I don't get and I think it might be because I'm a bit older at 41? or maybe the fact I worked in childcare before having the kids (as well as other jobs). I can't understand the posters who say they were sold a lie when they were told they could have it all. I grew up, left school, got qualifications, travelled, ended up in a good job, where I earned decent money, was treated with respect, really enjoyed......BUT when I had a baby I knew someone had to look after him and as I didn't want him going into full time care (we have no family support at all), I gave up work and looked after him. And its really hard, I totally agree, but why would I think I caould have a great job and still spend all the time in the world with my baby, I knew something had to go and for me it was the job. What I'm trying to say is I'm a bit older, was the girls brought up after me told you can have it all and they believed this? Is this what so many posters on here mean? I genuinely don't get it, was having it all a media invention? I don't remember anyone saying to me you can have it all, it was just expected you had what you had at the time and that was that.

Further to the points about having to become the Queen of Remembering Everything.

My Dad was widowed when I was a baby. He had a lot of help from my aunts but never engaged with the minutiae (sp?) of child rearing/running a home.

I'm always reminded of this when posters advise that if you just leave things the husband will pick it up/clean it etc. You would be surprised (and possibly appalled) at just how long that could be!

I don't think I was sold a lie - but nobody, absolutely nobody warns you how hard it is going to be. I think most of us would have still have had kids despite these warnings but we would have been a bit more prepared. The closest I ever came was when my sister said the first three months were going to be sh*t. Just the first three months?

I love my DS so much that sometimes it hurts, but it's been unbelievably difficult trying to maintain a sense of self, some kind of sanity and my composure. Sometimes too difficult, and I retreat to the bathroom where I sit on the toilet lid and fantasize about a tropical island, a book and a large vodka

I got fed up with family outings meaning mummy packs a bag for ds so..

the night before a family day out I waited till dh was in bed. I packed ds's bag and put it in the boot of the car under some junk that was in there

I never mentioned it.. we left for the day.. with dh never noticingI didnt have change of clothes/ wipes/ juice etc

we got to our destination and little one says I am hungry.. do you have an apple and I have a runny nose .. dh looks at me and says oh no his bag.. what are we gonna do .. he has paniced look

smug mother produces bag and says.. just as well one of us thinks a few steps ahead

I have to say .. dh has remembered to pack bag ever since

agree nobody tells you how hard it'll be but even if they did, would any of us really believe them? I used to work with girls who had young children and worked part time (oh, part time, lucky them, they only work sometimes!), if they complained I hadn't a clue what they were on about (I worked full time, had a lot of pressure, they only came in, did their work and left, why were they always moaning???)

I really and truly hadn't a clue! And if they'd have tried to tell me I wouldn't have believed them

Motherhood is something you only find out about yourself when you do it and how you deal with it all depends on your mental frame and your circumstances. It's probably always been like this, we just think its only us dealing with these problems.

I think we should all spend our Child Benefit on cleaning ladies.