13 year old has no relationship with 4 year old sister

[Purplekittenfurball]

my 13 barely has a relationship with her 4 year old sister. They also have an 11 year old brother.

13 yo is close to the 11 yo. 11 yo interacts with, is pleasant too, and has a positive relationship with the 4 yo. He will play a bit with her on occasion, engage her in conversation, do a puzzle with her (For example) or admire her dollies when she brings them over to him etc.

13 year old rarely speaks to the 4yo. The only occasions when she will is if she is asking her to stop doing something. In a disgusted or angry tone she will ask her “stop that” or “be quiet” or “cover your mouth”.

I am not expecting the 13 yo to have the same relationship with the 11yo and she has with the 4yo. They are naturally going to have very different interests, where the 13 yo and 11 yo have more in common at the moment. But I would love for them to have some kind of positive relationship. I worry that if they have nothing now- then in a few more years they will still have no relationship and will have lost the chance at a sibling bond.

a 13 yo is always going to be very self centred. I get that. And 4 year olds are kind of annoying when they sing the same song over and over or get upset because they can’t have any more bluey episodes or whatever. But they are both wonderful people. Funny and inquisitive and lively.

am I being ridiculous to ask the 13 yo to spend 10 minutes on each weekend day interacting with her sister? As simple as colouring with her? Or playing with her with some of her old toys?

the 4yo has learnt not to bother talking to her tbh as she just gets snarled at-but loves it when 13 yo has friends over who want to interact with her. 13 yo says that 4yo doesn’t like her….but the 4yo has never had 13 say anything nice to her or play with her, so she probably feels the same- even if she hasn’t said it. Because 11yo does act positively towards her she interacts with him and both enjoy it.

just for clarity- if the 4yo is being naughty or over the top annoying we always intervene. She’s not allowed in 13 yo room. She’s generally a good kid though! ( as is the 13 yo!)

I have tried my best to ensure 13 yo doesn’t feel jealous of her sister. 13 yo has own room. She has at least (usually more)an evening a week with each parent doing activities/ watching films. She spends 1 night a week at grandparents ( which she loves) just her and them. She does extra curricular clubs and recently requested tutoring, which I got for her. She has friends over and I would say is happy in her life.

I love both girls so much and would adore it if they could be friends. I think they could potentially get so much out of building a relationship.

I would never expect or ask 13 or 11 yo to do any parenting of her. They have never been asked to watch her or fix her food or dress her or anything like that. I want them to have a sibling relationship, not a parent/ child one.

is this futile? Is it useless to insist a 13 yo builds a relationship with her sister?

should I just settle for ignore her completely, just don’t be rude to her? Loads of people don’t like their siblings and it doesn’t matter.

should I wait this out and 13 yo will come round when she’s through this tricky stage of puberty? She’ll be nice to her when she’s maybe 15+….or is that too late?

Wouldn’t expect a 13yo to be interested in a 4yo tbh. Give it a few years - it’s a big age gap, unlikely they’ll ever have a close sibling relationship but your eldest might come around as they both get older. But don’t force it, for goodness’ sake. Definitely will only have a detrimental impact on their relationship

i have a 13 year old and look after a 5 year on weekends
theyre cousins but in our culture theyre brothers
i just tell my 13 year old son to tell me when his cousin annoys him and ill take him away

You can’t manufacture a sibling relationship as much as you’d like to. With this kind of age gap it’s always going to be trickier. Best thing you can do is give it time and respect that they’re both different people at different stages of their lives. If you try to force it you’ll make your oldest resent the youngest.

They won't be able to have a sibling relationship of equals until the four year old hits her 20s. They aren't in the same developmental place.

For now the 13 year old is very much a big sister who will interact with the 4 year old in a manner much closer to adult-to-child than anything else, because there isn't any other way of bridging the gap between them.

For the moment, the four year old needs to respect her sister as an elder and the 13 year old needs to remember how little her sister is when reminding her not to do annoying things.

I don't think trying to force the relationship will help - it'll be something they get to work out for themselves as they get older.

My sister is 9 years younger than me and I did a lot of caring for her as a small child. A lot of the rewarding bits of interaction with small children involve elements of taking care of them - reading stories, baking together, helping them brush their hair, select clothes or play in the bath with ducks (and yes all of these activities can be hard / demanding when you're working to a deadline with a non-cooperative child) so I'd consider what you're excluding your 13 year old from doing as 'parenting' and whether there are elements of that which your 13 year old could try on occasion. (Whether it's 'too much to ask' is often more about the frequency / expectation than the particular activity).

My mum had my brother and sister, then 6 years later me. They are 15 months apart so when I was growing up, i always felt like the outsider. I don't blame them for it because obviously, I can see how close they were before I came. We did do family things but I was constantly trying to impress them to seem cooler so they liked me more. We have good relationships as adults, but as the lone younger child I would agree personally. It can feel so isolating when your older siblings have 0 interest in being around you yet you see them together enjoying each others company. I don't resent them whatsoever for it because now I see how close my 2 kids are (same age gap as my siblings) I get how adding a third in a few years would throw them lol.

Me and DS have a big age gap and we are really close now in adulthood even though I left home when she was still very much a kid. Don't force anything it'll likely come naturally with time and things in common

I am about to have an 8 year age gap ( due to secondary infertility) and this thread makes me sad 😞, any positive stories!?

My husband is 9 years old than his brother, who is the youngest of his siblings - he has 2 sisters in between. Naturally growing up he was closer to his sister's because they were closer to him in age. As his brother became older, my husband might pick him up from school or take him out, but they were never super close. My husband never disliked his brother, they were just at different stages in their childhood. As adults they get on, but again my husband isn't particularly close to his brother. I think the worst thing you could do is try and force your eldest daughter to spend time with her younger sister. She will just resent her little sister more. You need to tell your eldest that as she's 13, and older, you expect her to at least be nice to her little sister and be polite. Unfortunately, I suspect your eldest finds her little sister, annoying and a nuisance, like a lot of older siblings do. It doesn't mean that will continue as they become older, but you may need to face facts that it might.

Sorry to hear you haven’t got the age gap you’d have chosen- but congratulations on another baby!

As I said in a pp, I’m very aware age gaps aren’t always planned, but I don’t think that’s the fundamental issue - it’s about assumptions and expectations. The issue with the OP is that she seems to expect her teenager to want to spend time with her sibling who’s 9 years younger. She seems determined to find joint activities they can do rather than accepting that while two of her children have grown up together, the 3rd is at a very different developmental stage and they’re unlikely to have many shared interests and experiences until adulthood. It doesn’t mean family life has to be sad, it’s just accepting the stages the children are at.

I imagine you must be thrilled to be pregnant after what you’ve been through and I don’t think the age gap will matter at all if you are realistic about your expectations for family life

Probably would've been best if you did in fact give her small responsibilities when she was younger especially. So she would've been used to it, that also would've made them closer.
I have a 16 year old and a 3 year old, I've always asked my 16 year to play or watch her brother since he was born.
Only for small amounts.
I don't know why some people think of it as all or nothing, asking her to do hours a day is too much responsibility. But really, not even for 20 min a day? 10 min a day?
How does that take from their lives really?
If I ask my daughter to look after him, I also tell her if you get tired of him, then call me, simples.

You can also give her incentives?

Don worry about it. My daughter was 8 when her brother was born, so I had a 12 year old and a 4 year old.

they fought like cat and dog on and off for years (a sibling thing!)

They’re currently down the pub together with their friends on either side - he’s 18 and she’s 26. Get on great

do not panic

include the older child from the start .
Tell them how much ur baby sibling loves you, how good they are with them.
I have a 13 year age gap and I appreciate my older child so much.
And I tell her that a lot.

I will add - you cannot expect any common ground at this stage in their lives. It just won’t happen. Mine would poke at each other in the back of the car for years and squabble like mad. That’s a brother / sister thing and I soon realised would have happened no matter what the age gap!

gradually, gradually and very slowly - they got on better. She bought her own place at 23 and that was a real turning point. They message a lot, but each other nice gifts and they’re proud of each other.

Relax OP (I mean that nicely). My oldest sister is 10 years older than me, she moved out when I was really young but I’m early 30’s & she’s early 40’s now and we are close! We have been since I was early 29’s but even more so since we both had children. You can’t force these things and unless they’re particularly into young kids, I think it’s quite normal for a teen of her age to be uninterested in a 4 YO.

I would not force anything. Likely to breed resentment. But it is reasonable to expect her to be civil and kind (tone of voice and words). When my oldest was having a rough time at school he was quite mean to his younger sisters (2 and 4 years younger). I deeply regret not pulling him up for that at the time. But now as adults they all get along well although the two girls are and always have been closest. We don’t choose our siblings - and may not always be close to them. I’d be glad that your 11year old has time for the 4 year old.

Thankyou for your reply, yes obviously thrilled and have accepted the gap will be what it will be, nothing I can do about changing that! Just as more time went on the fear became stronger that I would be raising two ‘only ‘ children and this thread just reinforced that worry I have had.

Agreed. My older and younger sibling are 10 years apart. They were never particularly close. It’s a bit easier when everyone is an adult.

thankyou, yes I just know she will be an amazing older sister and love helping with baby, it’s as they get a little older, as with OP that I worry.

There is 14 years between me and my youngest sister. I didn't give a toss about her when she was born, I was more interested in my own life. But we are now really close and I'm like a young mum to her. Don't worry, it's likely because she's a teenager that she's not interested she will probably make more effort as she gets older and it will happen naturally.

My friends mom had a baby when my friend was 13. My friend absolutely detested her sister & felt she got away with everything. They are all grown up now and get on fantastic.

I was six years older than my brother OP, and found him dreadfully annoying at times. I was probably quite mean occasionally.

We’re now the very best of friends. It took until he was 16 or 17 to develop a close relationship though!

My mum on the other hand has a sibling 10 years older than her and they’ve never really got on. They’re very different people.

All children are different and all sibling relationships are different. For every child who resents the intrusion of a younger sibling, there will be others who love babies and having a younger one around. You can't predict in advance how it will work out. My older DC was very aware when I was pregnant with my little one that many of his friends had brothers and sisters and so was very pleased when his little sister arrived. It helped that he received lots of presents and everyone at school told him what a wonderful brother he was. He enjoyed showing the baby off and was very proud of her. It worked out much better than I expected and, although she's much more annoying to him now, we have a lot of private jokes about it and they're very affectionate to each other.

My Mum is always on at me, even now in my 40s, to have a relationship with my sibling.
I don't want to - sibling is nasty and made my teenage years miserable. All Mum's nagging does is make me want to talk to my Mum less. Unfortunately some siblings never get on.

But even with nice siblings, that's quite a big age gap. We have a similar gap between DC and step-DC and whilst step-DC is polite to DC they don't want to play with DC or have much interest in them, sadly. They just want to be on the phone to their mates.

Realistically, even if they both enjoy theme parks, it’s less likely they will enjoy many of the same rides together. Many theme parks except for Paulton’s park don’t have rides that are aimed at both 4 and 13 year olds.

4 year olds are irritating and also boring. I wouldn’t except a 13 year old to be interested in them, regardless of whether they are related.

Not a good idea if there's already resentment there.