How the fuck did people do this before the pandemic

[BluPeony]

Last year I had my first DC. I took my full year of maternity leave and added on a month of annual leave and I have enough left that I'm working 4 days/week until basically the end of the year.

There was a requirement for us to be in the office 1 day per week, now up to 2 days. It'll likely go up to 3 days by the end of the year. I don't know if they'll build up to full time because they're being very cagey and vague and actually we've recruited so many people that there aren't enough desks for everyone and before the pandemic the company was trialling loosening the office/WFH balance so that it didn't have to move into a larger office and pay more rent.

But anyway. My commute is 70-90 mins door to door. I go in on Mondays because it's a bit quieter on public transport and it's my partner's day off to look after the baby so I feel okay about being so far away.

I've been trying to decide which other day to go in and it's just shit no matter which way you look at it. I would have to drop my baby off at nursery when they open at 8am on the dot and I'll still be in the office after 9am - so I'm screwed if anyone puts in a 9am or early meeting. I'd have to leave work early to make sure I can pick him up when they close at 6 and I'd still be in deficit with my hours and would need to make the time up somewhere. My partner can't do the nursery runs because he has compressed his hours to allow him to be at home on Mondays and he doesn't have an option to WFH.

We're discussing one of us going part time, etc etc to try and make this work but it got me wondering how on earth people did this before/do this now if they can't work from home - do you just only see your baby at the weekend?? Do you work part time? Give up work? What about maternity pay if you want another baby?

I'm exhausted. I hate going in to sit at my desk on a Teams call with other people at their desks. I hate that I'm missing out on so much with my baby. I feel like I'm becoming a shittier mum with a short temper because of the stress and tiredness. I was just getting into the swing of things before I went back. I'm feeling very sorry for myself tonight and not looking forward to my commute tomorrow at all.

I work FT but don’t have a commute, the office is a 5-10 min drive from my house. I could earn more by travelling to the nearest city but the commute time and being far from school isn’t worth it. Honestly it will be even more difficult when they start school and I would look to move to a local employer before then. I have 2DC in primary and I’ve had to be in school for various things at least 3 or 4 times each term, sometimes this was just after drop off which is manageable but others it was 1 or 2pm and stay to finish. It helps that my manager is flexible and says just block sports day, assemblies etc out of your diary.

Commute is a big issue for you coupled with the other factors.

We made it work by:

• living 25 mins from work
• DH and I tag teaming - so he would do mornings and I would do pick ups
• having a nanny so we had no drop off and more flexibility with illness and unexpected delays to the commute

The nanny in particular cost almost the same as DH earned but it was worth it for us for the reasons above plus I felt it was higher quality childcare than they’d otherwise have had, which made it easier for me.

We have made big sacrifices to our house to live where we do - we could have something much nicer if we moved further out, but I’m saving that for secondary age.

I totally empathise with you. Having worked a full time role with a 90 minute each way commute. We found a nanny more flexible than a nursery as we could employ them for longer hours and they were more flexible. Downside that if they are ill then no immediate replacement but positives that if DC are unwell she’d take care of them.

It is exhausting combining a baby and full time work there’s no question about it. I used to nap on the commute where I could but I don’t think I was the best parent I could have been as was constantly stressed.

It is hard in different ways when they start school due to the hours and requirements to attend events etc. So do consider that in your longer term plans.

Good luck.

New job with a shorter commute would be my first aim!!?

your husband doing compressed hours isn’t sustainable you need to both share pick up and drop off

can you afford for him to work 4 days instead then you could try arrange work work to either stage later or leave earlier once or twice a week for nursery run instead of needing to do both!!

Approach your employers about flexi working OP - make up hours in the eve or weekends. It’s how most working mum in my organisation manage pick-ups etc x

In my situation we choose to have a very small flat in London and willl likely just never move to a bigger place further out a so value being cycle distance to work and nursery over more space ! Means we both can drop off and pick up and be on time for work as our commutes are 20 mins!

People did 'this' before washing machines and vacuum cleaners too. And before ipads, phones and other stuff to entertain kids

This
One does drop off one collects.
CM is way more flexible

I could NOT do a 90m commute with children.
50m -60m is our max.
It is difficult when you are both working FT
I cans see why birth rate is down and didnt fully appreciate how unfamily friendly the workplace is. Ours in particular touts itself as a benevolent company but we have "roles" nit hours so part time is basically always declined

My commute was an hour. Dropped at nursery at 7:30 as it opened, left at 5 picked up 6/6:15. DH’s job meant somethings he was easily around for pick up/drop off other times he was working away. It was exhausting, my career was fucked.

ATM you have the choice of moving to a nursery closer to work on your office days.

Your issue is going to be schools. You need to get a reliable childminder to do wrap around - have a contingency in place if you’re called to pick up your sick child - generally happens a couple of times a term. You also need to consider this with nursery.

If I was you I would start to reconsider where I was living and working

It’s rubbish OP, I feel for you. You might find that you’re able to get used to this new reality gradually. If you can’t accept the current situation then you will have to change something, though all options will likely involve some sort of compromise! I don’t think it is possible to “have it all” (this applies to both men and women) - but we have to work out how to get as close as possible to our own version of this. And that will be different for everyone.

My partner and I are both hospital doctors, so there is no option for WFH or more convenient hours. We were in London with 60 minute plus commutes when our eldest was born. Nursery in central London cost almost one take-home salary. We were constantly late for pickup due to work/train issues and it wasn’t great. Moving further out for more space and affordability would have meant childcare was impossible if commuting 90 mins plus to start work before 8am. We have no family help.

We left London. Moved to the city where I went to Uni. It’s not what I’d have chosen if I was a millionaire, but I’m not. I couldn’t accept being apart from my (now three) children all the time, so I’ve had to switch specialty to something with less ridiculous hours. We can afford to live closer to work and nursery is cheaper. If I had wanted to stay in the more full-on specialty at work, we could probably have afforded a nanny.

In truth, I miss London and I feel annoyed that I’ve had to compromise so much in the career that I’ve been building for 20 years. But, we knew that having a family was important to us, and the kids are the best, so I try and reframe our choices more positively. I think we have found a balance that works pretty well for the whole family.

It is insane, OP, I agree.

But for one day a week, it should be doable. Could you find a childminder near to your home for that one day, so you don't need to do the nursery drop, and can just pay extra if you run late (if they are okay with this?) They may be more flexible than nursery. Or pay a reliable neighbour to babysit for wraparound care one day a week, taking your child to nursery, picking them up and staying with them until you get home.

I built up a freelance career where I could WFH to avoid exactly this issue. Didn't earn much but loved the work and was always there to do those stupid irrational things like coming into school to give medication in the middle of the day because school wasn't allowed to!

Raising a child is a job. Running a home is a job. We live in a crazy world where a small family in a modest home can't afford to exist on a single salary and children are supposed to dematerialise during working hours so their existence doesn't impact on our careers. It sucks.

Everything prepped and ready for nursery night before. Dinner prepared night before. Nursery was next to the station so I dropped them as soon as they opened and arrived early at work, prayed the train wasn’t delayed coming home.

I used to travel with women who had older, primary school aged children and they would sew labels into school clothes on the train, then write meal plans. They also had five hangers in the wardrobe with underwear, tights, school shirt, hair scrunchies.

I took voluntary redundancy in early days of my third pregnancy as I knew it would be impossible plus I was sick of the regimented lifestyle and all my money going on travel and childcare.

I changed my job completely after 3rd was born, we survived financially. I wish I’d done it sooner but I thought that way was the only way to make good money, I was wrong. I just needed a new perspective.

Childminder.

Move to a smaller city with less of a commute.

In our case I did what millions of women have done before (and many on this thread) and dropped my working hours to part time.

It really isn't true that we can all have everything.

I was fortunate enough to work in a job with flexi. Dh worked longer hours months-thurs and I did drop off and pick . On a Fri dh did half day so I worked a really long day. Also my commute 20 min and childcare was a few minutes away from my house

I do find it interesting how mindset has changed since pandemic though. Before that no one considered option to wfh for most office based roles.

Kids at 28 & 30, on a salary roughly half (gross) of DH so it was all up to me.

went back 3 days compressed at 26.5h between DC 1&2 to a job I hated so much (and was treated so badly) that DC2 is a wonderful product of that. Went back after DC2 to a new job, different department of same org. Used workplace nursery with 25 min walking commute. Sometime after DC2 was born I increased to 30h but spread across 2x long days and 3x mornings which worked excellently, and when DC1 started school (switched to 1x long, 2x school days, 2x mornings).

mid pandemic I changed jobs to a new org and went back 30h a week, endured homeschool for two kids. I now work full time with two primary aged kids and it’s ok but I work for a local employer who has a strong commitment to flexibility. My career options are more limited though.

This! I had a 20 min journey into work.

When I had two kids I worked part time evenings and weekends around my now ex DH working hours. When my youngest went to school, I went back to full time.

My sympathies to those juggling childcare and full-time jobs. A long time ago now, but for us a high-paying job with bonuses became an LSA one, longer hours and more precarious employment for OH because employers are better at smelling out the vulnerability than sharks smelling blood in the water.
Joint earnings at lease £1 million below what they would have been - with the resultant reduction in pension contributions, tax system geared to two identical salaries rather than one high, one low which is penalised in a variety of ways.
So, we have one child, neighbour with seven (aged ten to mid-thirties) who has lived on benefits for the past twenty years that we've known her wonders why her 20 year-old hasn't moved out and got her own place yet.

I'd be looking at a new job with either a much shorter commute or with WFH written into the contract.

3 days a week - nursery choice limited to those open 7.30am - 6.30pm. Dropped at 7.30 on the dot at desk for 9am. Agreed I could leave at 4.50pm and had one train buffer so got to nursery at 6.10pm but could just about scrape in before 6.30pm if I had to get the next train or there were delays. It was a treadmill, you do what you have to and once things change (hopefully for the better) you wonder how on earth you did it.

No v. few couples were trying to hold down 2 professional jobs with more than an hours commute in the 1960's eg: before washing machines. What are you talking about ?

When my dc were little there was no working from home. It was office every day. So both parents working in central London 9-5.30....with a one hour commute on a good day! So childcare had to be found from 8am-6.30pm. I had no family help. I also had a child with sn and medical problems which requires lots of appointments. It was too hard logistically and financially . I gave up work and was a sahm. I am pleased times are different now but also a little bitter in all honesty. The presentee culture totally screwed women up.

I went down to 4 days a week spread over 5. Can't remember when the childminder opened, probably 8am. Similar commute to you but driving and rarely in at 9 but that was acceptable to boss. Left work at 4 in order to get back for 5pm pickup, traffic better at that time.

It was rather relentless and ended up moving closer to work. Still on a 4 day week but I'm more flexible with it and employer is ok with that.

LSA ?

And actually even before I had kids, work made life incredibly difficult. If you needed a doctor's or dental appointment, you'd have to book a day off. If you needed a plumber to come over and fix your boiler, you'd have to book the day off. If you were having some furniture delivered you'd have to book a day off. I used so much annual leave on just life shit.