Those four young men who died in Wales

[Choirsinger7]

My heart breaks for them and their families, they looked a looked a lovely bunch of young men, with bright futures and just wanted a bit of independence and fun as they should do at that age before it all went horribly wrong. My DS is a similar age.

Don't be a twat. That is one of the most rubbish comebacks on here. Have a cup of tea and a biscuit. Again, not very intelligent.

Did you even read my other posts?

You don't need to comment on the thread if it's not your jam. No one is forcing you. People are free to express an opinion, I have not said anything offensive and have said it's an absolute waste of four young lives, in a similar vein to others.

Read the room yourself and stop looking to be offended which in turn just creates a toxic atmosphere and shuts down views from a wide variety of people on the forum.

Much in agreement with you here.

You have no idea what these parents are going through.

You can act superior of how you are going to stop your child from driving. I don't think it would be good to stop my DS having driving lessons. His friends are all having them and it's the next step of a young man's life. So we are paying. He will gain experience.

I worry a lot. All I can do is give him advice.

I think we can agree to disagree. Waiting a few more years learning to drive for some young people isn't necessarily a bad thing. Cheaper car insurance is an added bonus.

As if a thread about the death of teens is the appropriate place to express this opinion

Taken in isolation I do agree. But as I was responding to another poster as to why she is allowing her DS to drive at 17 and I am not with my own DC, it's something that naturally led on to my comment. It wasn't to deliberately cause upset. Looking for offence when there's none.

So tragic. I also would like to see restrictions on young people taking passengers. We don’t know what happened here but young men in particular perceive risk differently

@BeethovenNinth I agree, I drive on similar roads and just having passagers in the car makes the way the car is balanced differently. Add weather and probably a 60mph limit even though 30mph is probably more appropriate on these roads, add in taking your test in a flat urban environment and it is not hard to see how an inexperienced driver can go off the road in rural areas.

Taken in isolation I do agree. But as I was responding to another poster as to why she is allowing her DS to drive at 17 and I am not with my own DC, it's something that naturally led on to my comment. It wasn't to deliberately cause upset. Looking for offence when there's none.

I agree with the pp, the desperation to justify your point means you’ve come across as ‘this won’t happen to my child because I’ll make better decisions.’ How disgusting.

Good luck making decisions for your adult child, most of us realise that we can’t tell our adult children that they’re only allowed to use the bus up to age of 21 because mummy and daddy said so.

If your posts weren’t on a thread about tragic event, I’d say much more. Please think before you type.

Is this aimed at me? I'm certainly not looking for offence. I wasn't the original poster who told you to be quiet on this thread.

Even though I think you should go away and start your own thread about your beliefs.

Nobody here is appropriating grief that isn’t theirs. It’s called empathy and compassion. And yes I am qualified to give my opinion on that as unfortunately I lost my son to cancer at 14 and have seen firsthand what grief hijacking is. I appreciate other bereaved parents may feel differently but I actually took great comfort in that a lot of people thought enough of my son to care and express condolences even if they didn’t know him well. I found the comment to the poor person whose daughter knew the boys particularly harsh and horrible. It also doesn’t matter what you do or don’t mind, mumsnet clearly disagree with you.

It's actually more to do with cost. The bus pass for young people is fine for them getting around. He can save up for lessons if he wants, unlikely he will be able to afford it until he's a lot older. As an adult I am sure he can do what he wants. It's no worse than those forcing their DC to take driving lessons aged 17...Stop nit picking at posts to cause an argument. By twisting what I have said to suit your own agenda that is actually worse!

Agree with this post.
I feel comforted by how much people care about others. It is the best of humanity that all our hearts go out to the bereaved families of the boys, and their grieving friends.
I have also lost a young family member in tragic circumstances, I know how this feels, I don’t want anyone else to go through it.

I think that the majority of people posting here are horrified and sad by what has happened to those boys on the cusp of their adult life, not judging or vampire grieving. Unlike The Times columnist posting a picture of her beaming sons and writing a column pontificating on how awful it is and aren’t sons just precious. Didn’t even wait until they’re buried.

That's incredibly insensitive. Haven't seen the article but really just shows complete lack of tact.

Sadly, you're not on your own and no qualifications are needed or asked for. There's a line between empathy and grief appropriation which, if you've seen for yourself, you understand. I've been here a while and the number of posters who 'know' the people involved in various incidents is really unlikely. Doesn't mean that I voice that but I don't buy into it either. You do as you see fit.

You took comfort but others don't necessarily feel the same way about it, we're not some homogenous group and Mumsnet doesn't agree or disagree with anybody. This thread isn't about my views either so I'm going to leave it there.

Nobody here is appropriating grief that isn’t theirs.

A PP literally inserted herself in the tragedy by volunteering that her daughter’s best friend was a girlfriend or something, and accepted a condolence from another poster.

Cringe.

This really affected me.

I grew up in a large city where me and all my friends could drive, but rarely needed to.

My now DH grew up in a more rural town and one night we met his old friends in a local pub and then went back to one of their's afterwards.

On the way they mentioned about four instances where peers or acquaintances had died in road accidents. It really shocked me.

Definitely this. I grew up in an area where the bus service was lamentable and driving at the earliest opportunity was the key to freedom. Same for DH. The amount of fatalities and near misses (bike or car) was scary

"I'm not going to allow my son to learn to drive".

Hmm so how are you going to stop him getting in a car with one of his mates who can drive?

That logic doesn't work.

Especially if you live rurally.

At my son's sixth form leavers' assembly, the head said, 'And please, drive carefully. Every year I say this. And most years I go to a funeral.'

Really unhelpful comment.