Trauma or Autism or neither.

[StrugglesSadness]

Firstly, I apologize for the length.

My son first started displaying worrying behaviour when he was 1.5. Flying into a rage & not being able to calm down for hours & hours. By 3, I asked for help, I did parenting courses & learned he suffers from anxiety.

Sister born.

Age 4 me & his dad split up. He was was still around a lot, we still had family days out. My son witnessed some shouting between us. It wasn't all harmonious.

By the age of 6 the behaviour had turned violent towards myself. I'm walking on eggshells. Anything sets him off. A Caff was opened. Anxiety was noted. Advice like 'Just walk away' leading me to wander around the house carrying my 2 year old, for hours. Exhausting myself & being attacked constantly from behind.

Covid. Home schooling, if my son can see the work there on the laptop, then he has to get it done. He won't have a break or rest if he can see work there.

Age 8 2nd Caff opened. This Support worker put all of the blame on myself & I agree. Support worker tells me not to cry in front of my son as it 'Makes him think that I am weak'. I am weak.

Behaviour is now absolutely horrendous. Leaving the home, extreme violence. Talks about wanting to kill himself. Gets hold of knives & uses anything he can as weapons. My heart is breaking for my son. Violence extends to his sister.

This lovely school worker mentions Autism & PDA. (She has left now. Beyond gutted) Maybe I can finally make things better for my son... Support worker is having none of it. Constantly tells me that meltdowns are happening because my son is 'Tired/hungry/bored/it's normal' Etc. Etc.

I complain to her manager & ask for the Caff to be closed if that's all the help she's going to be. Caff has been opened for a year & a half, we get a new support worker & keep it open.

New worker is on board with the 'Possible autism'. Tells me it's not my fault.
School is a bit... 'There's a few things going on but nothing of much concern, however, we are concerned re his behaviour at home. (Also, sister is crying in class & tells them that he hurts her)

so (almost done!) Here we are now. We are having family therapy sessions & the therapist has decided that my son is suffering from trauma due to his dad leaving, & that it's nothing like autism. He's dropped this bombshell on me.

I'm not sure where to go from here. When I google, there's clearly overlaps between autism/Trauma. How do I know which one it is? (If it's any) what do I do?

Obviously the thought of my son walking around traumatised is just horrendous. How can I help him? Surely if it's trauma then he needs counselling or something?

I know that nobody on here can actually tell me, I just feel so lost.

You did well last night and put in a boundary around his violence towards you. You kept him, yourself and your DD safe.

Can you catch his teacher before school re the praise trigger and explain he had a long meltdown last night. May not change anything, but they might be less over his shoulder if they know.

His Dad is clueless. Can you get the locks fixed today do you think? Or his Dad help get that sorted today? Just thinking with Wednesday and double exam on Thursday it would be good if they were working.

I don’t know if it helps but my son was exactly the same from about 4-8/9 years old. He would have the biggest melt downs, bang his head against the wall, take skipping rope and put it around his neck saying he was going to kill himself etc. We moved him to a different school and the change happened over night. I couldn’t believe it. He is 13 now and tells me how horrific his first primary school was. I guess he/we didn’t realise at the time how much the school was affecting him. He has slowly started talking about it, eg he will casually mention how a teacher called him thick because he only got 2/10 in spellings etc. I think it was a constant negative environment for him. I just wonder if there’s something else in your sons life that could be causing him to act out his unhappiness.

Thank you for sharing that Mayflowere282 He's pretty good academically, he gets '1' on his reports which are apparently rare & the usual is a 2, but yes, there absolutely could be things upsetting him at school. It's just so hard to know.

Choconuttolata I think that I might be able to do them myself, I'm going to try. I have an idea of how to do it.
The other things that were broken last meltdown, his dad never fixed, as if he's mad with me, then he won't do anything like fix something in the home for us. It's not his job to do that anyway is it, whilst my son is with me then it's my problem.

So this is how school goes.

I go up to reception. Usual receptionist so she knows 'The situation'. 'Hello, I need to speak with somebody about my son. I also need to know if he's here as he ran this morning'.

'Ok well you will have to wait for the register to be taken so maybe half an hour'.

'Oh sorry, with my son, they normally just send somebody up right away to check'.

'Oh well I don't know about that but you will have to wait half an hour, that's just the policy'.

'I need to know if he's here or if I should head back & look for him'.

'Well as I said, it's policy to ask you to wait'.

'Can you please send somebody to check? The Senco usually goes. I need them to check now. I'm supposed to call the police if he's not here, it's on our Safety plan'

FFS. All the other parents are looking at me now. They send the Senco to check.

And then I get 'His teacher isn't available to talk to you'.

'Thats ok, LSA, Senco, anybody'.

'Nobody is available right now'.

'Ok I'll wait then'.

'You just want to wait? Who for?'

'Anybody who knows my son's situation. Either of the year 6 LSA's, or the Senco, head teacher, Safeguarding lead, behavioural lead. Honestly, anybody. I will wait'.

And then when I do get to talk to them (behavioural lead) she just goes on about how he was 'Chill & Zen yesterday' & 'There was very little noise as it's exam conditions, so do you think he was blaming 'Noise' when he's actually upset about something at home?'

I left it with 'And he didn't eat his tea or anything else last night, or have breakfast today. He has a snack in his bag but he's going to be hungry'.

I'm the worst parent in the world

I had my session with the counsellor. Sobbed/hid my face/nodded/shook my head throughout most of it. It didn't help today. I still feel really sad

I told him some of the things that my son's dad said last week, & he said that he understands completely why I'm so upset, but talking through that didn't help either.

He asked what he can do to help with my anxiety about the school meeting on Thursday. I said 'Tell me that I don't have to go'.

He always asks at the end, how was our session & I always say 'Its fine'. But today I just just shook my head & nodded when he asked 'It was difficult?'

I am glad you have opened up a bit emotionally to the counsellor even if you showed him rather than talked about things verbally.

I am now going to talk in emojis because I have no words for the the way the school staff are communicating with you and their lack of interest or support for your DS. Complete derogation of their responsibility to your son. 🤬😵‍💫🤯🤦

How are things tonight?

Hi Choconuttolata. He's very 'On the verge of'... He's crying at anything, he's sooo emotional. He's scared about tomorrow but we kept it calm (ish) & they are in bed.

I couldn't get the door fixed
I'm going to have to speak to the letting agents.

School earlier, banging on about 'Policy' WTF. If they are trying to look like they couldn't care less, then they are succeeding.

Another weird thing, instead of ignoring my update, as per usual, the Social worker answered & told me that it sounds extremely difficult & that I did well. WTF again.

Gawd, what a frustratingly stupid receptionist. She simply needs to follow any implemented plans to safeguard. You need to immediately know whether to call the police and hunt the streets or breath a sigh of relief.

And yes school staff tend to say children are fine in school, while suggesting theres some upset at home because a) they are not trained in autism presentation and b) it’s common for staff to be defensive rather then embrace reflective practice and c) staff forget the parents have much broader and deeper knowledge about their own children.

Can you speak to the safeguarding lead about the receptionist not following the plan to safeguard your son. You need to know immediately whether to call the police.

Well done for getting him into bed despite his heightened anxiety. That is worrying about the door, social care may have funds to help with this because of his safety plan although they are as useful as a chocolate teapot so not sure whether it is worth asking them.

Interesting about the social workers response, maybe there have been conversations behind the scenes between professionals about the total lack of support 🤔

I was looking through the NICE guidance on Autism Assessment and also the one for Anti-social behaviours and conduct disorders and saw this section in Identification and Assessment (in the latter).

Autism Assessment Guidance:

https://www.nice.org.uk/guidance/cg128/chapter/Recommendations#recognising-children-and-young-people-with-possible-autism

1.2 Recognising children and young people who may be autistic

1.2.2 Always take parents' or carers' concerns and, if appropriate, the child's or young person's concerns, about behaviour or development seriously, even if these are not shared by others. [2011]

Antisocial behaviours and Conduct Disorders Guidance (I know they try have tried to argue against ND assessment for this reason, but look what it says).

https://www.nice.org.uk/guidance/CG158/chapter/1-Recommendations#identification-and-assessment

1.3.11 Take into account and address possible coexisting conditions such as:

(Second bullet point) - neurodevelopmental conditions such as ADHD and autism

1.3.12 Consider using formal assessment instruments to aid the diagnosis of coexisting conditions, such as:

the Child Behavior Checklist for all children and young people

the Strengths and Difficulties Questionnaire for all children or young people

the Connors Rating Scales – Revised for a child or young person with suspected ADHD

a validated measure of autistic behaviour for a child or young person with a suspected autism spectrum disorder (see NICE's guideline on autism diagnosis in children and young people)

I wondered whether you had completed all of these. It might be worth doing them and sending them to the professionals involved with the extract from the guidance if they have not all been done already.

Child behaviour checklist:

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=www.carepatron.com/files/child-behavior-checklist-cbcl.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwjWlMynuIGFAxVoX0EAHVxgAGwQFnoECDAQAQ&usg=AOvVaw0hjV-xMwRyF1TnASJcaVEs

Strengths and difficulties questionnaire:

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=www.eif.org.uk/files/resources/measure-report-child-sdq.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwibu437t4GFAxV9V0EAHaiiB4EQFnoECCAQAQ&usg=AOvVaw3ecYrGNsj-MSWHyYzMwrtc

Conner's rating scale:

https://www.carepatron.com/templates/conners-rating-scale-for-parents-revised-l

Autism assessment:

AQ-10

https://www.plymouthhospitals.nhs.uk/download.cfm?doc=docm93jijm4n7723.pdf&ver=23626

Autism Symptom Dimensions Questionnaire (new open source ASD questionnaire for children with good screening efficiency)

https://osf.io/fd5eu

Thank you Choconuttolata for that, I'll have a look. I might wait until the meeting, when I'm going to ask if the NDD form has been sent off. It's 7 weeks since she said she will be the lead professional.

I did Google the Social workers role last week & it said 'Be an advocate for the parents' & I thought 'Well she's hardly doing that is she!'

But yes, I want to think that she sent the kind email yesterday after realising how upset I was last week when I told her that my son's dad will have them now (even though she never responded) maybe she realises that if they push me too far then I'm not going to just take it but I'm just going to say 'You Know what, he has another parent, if I'm so awful then watch him do better' (Which I did)

Doubt it though. I don't think she has a sympathetic or regretful bone in her body.

The door is a huge worry. I might bring that up (& the other damage that isn't fixed) in the meeting too. She won't help though. I told her before that the kitchen window was now unlock-able & she never responded.

I think my son is going to his dad's tonight.

Hearti I honestly just try not to deal with them. They just see it as 'Year 6 child, what's the problem, they are allowed to walk alone!'

They don't realise the difference in when he is heightened.

Usually, the behavioural lead, Senco & head teacher are on the gates, so I just ask one of those, or all 3 as I walk by, & they instantly go & look in the classroom, if they havn't seen him already. (As this is one part where they absolutely understand the importance) Me & my daughter were a few minutes early yesterday so they weren't on the gates yet, but I think next time I'll just wait an extra minute, until they are. And not deal with the office.

My son has been awake in the night, not sleeping very well. He told me that he's scared of monsters. (Or the day ahead) I wish I knew what to do to make it better.

My son got to school without incident today, he's done his sports event. He was clinging on to me, pulling my arms round him in cuddles, jumping up & down, making strange noises, playing with my jumper sleeves, acting extremely young compared to all of his friends. (I only notice because I'm aware of looking for the 'differences' right now) he's my son & he's lovely. I love that he still wants cuddles with me.

Me & his dad managed to keep things civil, although it was strained. I asked if he'd heard from the Social worker & he said 'No, I emailed her Monday & told her I'm not going to the school meeting' (first I'd heard of this) I said 'Oh. Ok. So you aren't coming tomorrow?' & he said 'Nah'.

So I'm going to have to do that by myself.

Glad it went more smoothly this morning. Lovely that he is still cuddly.

Every time you mention specifics about his behaviour it surprises me that the school do not see any signs of neurodiversity. If they were observant it is staring them in the face.

His Dad is showing himself to not be the parent he makes himself out to be then, yet again.

Busy here, my son and middle daughter are both poorly and off school. DS has been spiking fevers with a cough since Friday so DH took him to see the GP, but no signs of a chest infection at the moment, they said if he doesn't start to improve by Friday they will give antibiotics. I didn't push it because he hates taking medicine anyway so if they say he doesn't need it I won't give it just in case.

I am shattered, working, up at night with DS since the weekend and then now at the hospital with my Dad for an appointment, so won't get home until later.

Thank you for answering me Choconuttolata, when you have so much else going on! Poor you, & your children. Hoping for a miracle for your son by tomorrow! You must be so tired, Keeping everybody else going.

Do you think him seeming 'Young' is another sign? The other children were just standing with their parents (or playing with each other)

I'm really stressed out about this meeting tomorrow. I already didn't want to go (as I never do) but I was still going to (as I always do) but his dad will just cancel with no come-back from SS as he can just do what he likes.

All I keep thinking about is the Senco, Head teacher, Social worker & Family Solutions sat on one side of the table, & me sat alone on the other, whilst they criticise every aspect of my parenting
Their dad is never much help, but at least it's somebody to sit by my side (sounds pathetic I know, I just don't want to be sat alone) I feel like I do everything alone already (without adult company I mean)

The reasons I didn't want to attend is they are going to criticise & upset me & blame me for everything.

I don't know why their dad doesn't want to go, other than to upset me

Is it a TAC/TAF meeting? Would SENDIASS come (I know they briefed you preferring). Take anyone, friend, family, neighbour. You could contact the Parent/Carer Forum - sometimes they accompany parents to meetings. They just need to take notes and really bear witness to the meeting. You go in with a list of bullet points - things you wish to say. You will get emotional but the person with you will be there to take minutes and ensure you address each point.

Struggles, I completely agree with Choconuttalotta that I don't understand how school aren't seeing signs of neurodiversity as so much of what you describe screams autism or sensory processing needs to me. Yes, the 'young' behaviour sounds like a child who is trying hard to regulate his sensory system - moving to get proprioceptive feedback, making noises to calm and ground himself, hugging to get deep tissue pressure which is grounding and calming.

It seems that school are really letting him down because they're probably not recognising these behaviours as expressing a need.

imip I wrote a message to the counsellor but then deleted it as I realised that he won't be there forever & I need to deal with this myself.

I got myself in to a state & that isn't going to help.

I used to do these meetings alone (but I had the support worker & Family First on my side of the table)

I will be ok. Thank you for the ideas.

I'm avoiding all of the neighbours & my mum has offered before but she would only lose her temper & not in a way that will get results.

It's tomorrow so it's late to ask anybody. I wish that I knew before now, that he wasn't going to come.

It's a CIN meeting.

Thank you Stardust1985. That makes sense.

I was thinking that some kids are just 'Young', & it doesn't have to mean anything? He's so small for his age so that doesn't help.

I feel like his dad is embarrassed by him. I feel like he almost gets lost in his little world sometimes, holding onto me & him making his noises etc, he kept hiding his face today & it struck me that I was doing that with the counsellor yesterday. And then I hear his dad say 'Why are you making that noise?' & 'Get off mum'

& he kind of 'Comes out of it'. If that makes sense.

He will laugh & chat with his friends & that's the part that school sees isn't it.

He also said that he missed a lot of the training sessions for this sport (I didn't realise this) as he was doing his other things like lunch duty, whereas the other children stopped those to concentrate on this new thing, he carried on with his routine.

If he is not going to the CIN meeting, then so doubt he will actually have them live with him. What a rubbish Dad thinking he can not go to these. They are his children. He may be embarrassed by their behaviour, but I wonder if he is more embarrassed about being a shitty father and ineffectual in ‘managing’ the situation?

Any word on speaking your refusal to assess decision? I know it’s a long game, but the assessment phase is what you need to get the ball rolling and stop being overlooked.

i know you feel you are not getting there, but all this time you are amassing evidence of need (CIN plan etc). Why your school is not getting as an EP for an assessment as per the SEN Code of Practice, beggars belief. You could bring this up in your netting today. Say can school bring in an EO or speech therapist to assess need as per the SaeB Code of Practice. Perhaps they could make it an action if the CIN plan?

P102 of the code of practice https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/5a7dcb85ed915d2ac884d995/SEND_Code_of_Practice_January_2015.pdf

you can say you had a call with a legal charity and they pointed out SEN support. At this stage it would be concerns about lack of progress in SENH and communication and interaction (and perhaps vendors needs). Have a look at these pages. Similar will probably be in the schools website under the Saran information report. Does he have a Sen support plan, if not, why not?

say this is the legal advice you received from a SEN charity - you know my job :-)

Thank you imip. I know you are thinking that this is a meeting to get things sorted or at least get the ball rolling but they just don't go like that.

We share what's working & what's not working & then the school say that they can't do any more & the SW says what I should be doing when he has a meltdown (like letting have the run of the house, which I did the other day & he broke the front door locks)

& then it ends. I always have a bullet point list but I always come out with no answers (like NDD? No answer) so I was honestly thinking that I won't even bother with my notebook this time.

I've hardly slept & when I did finally get to sleep & I had an awful nightmare about being trapped in this building in a strange place & I couldn't get home & when I was banging on the window people were looking through me like I was a ghost. I woke up almost in tears, it was so distressing.

All good going off to school this morning.

It's funny that you say that imip about his dad being embarrassed that he can't manage the behaviour, as that's what the counsellor says about him too.

I see it differently. I see it that his dad is embarrassed that I'm such an ineffectual parent that I can't 'Sort my son out', but also he can't be bothered to do it himself.

The part that is missing from this thread is last week we both spoke to the Social worker & she absolutely tore apart everything that I've been doing for my son lately. Every single thing I do in regards to parenting him in general, & meltdowns, is wrong, in her eyes.

And their dad agreed with her & also said that my son would never behave this way with him.

The SW then said that what my son needs is some discipline from his dad as it's clearly lacking from me.

Definitely the school should be doing more to support his SEMH needs and support you with his transitions from home to school and school to home. SEMH needs are covered under the SEND code as one of the broad areas of need.

Good pdf from Leicester with a breakdown of what schools can do

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=schools.leicester.gov.uk/media/7068/social-emotional-and-mental-health.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwjb0efS_4SFAxUjUUEAHbXICnUQFnoECCcQAQ&usg=AOvVaw0sPFIcxBBXAShflzrYDSfj

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/mental-health-and-behaviour-in-schools--2

https://suffolklearning.com/inclusion/specialist-education-services/social-emotional-and-mental-health-service/

https://semh.co.uk/

https://parents.semh.co.uk/#0

Resources:

https://up.org.uk/resources/

I agree with stardust about his 'young' seeming behaviour. My son is similar when processing or heightened in a social/unfamiliar situation.

His Dad clearly has little understanding of neurodiversity and because of the views of professionals around you hasn't been encouraged to learn more about it and change his approach.

The University of Derby have a free online course that anyone (including the school staff) can access, might be worth suggesting down the line.

https://www.derby.ac.uk/short-courses-cpd/online/free-courses/understanding-autism-aspergers-and-adhd/#d.en.62044

Sorry just read your update.

The social worker is not convinced of NDD that is why she is saying that. Clearly he cannot have the run of the house because he is violent towards you and your daughter and breaks things or escapes the home. You are giving him boundaries by keeping him in his room. It is a safe space where he can calm down and regulate himself again.

My son behaves differently with his Dad to me, but I will still give him boundaries like you do for your child. The problem is in a meltdown the usual behaviour strategies are not appropriate and his Dad and the social worker are not seeing them because they are not there while they are happening.

I think with the CAMHS referral hopefully being done via the counsellor and Barbados, it would be great if you can get some video of what is happening. Maybe discreet cameras up by the ceiling lights in his room and the hallway outside so that you can record the meltdowns when they happen, you can get tiny magnetic ones that link to an app on your phone.

I like the guide you can download for free here for managing a meltdown:

https://theotbutterfly.com/sensory-meltdown-triggers/sensory-processing/

They have had to change the date of the meeting. FFS I've got to put myself through all of this again.

Choconuttolata She said that my emails make me sound like I follow him around & won't give him any space. I said has she never read the ones where he's trying to kick my feet out from under me from behind or kicking me in the back or pulling my hair from the back or trying to drag me down the stairs from behind... He literally chases me around the home.

Once I get him in his room then yes, I'm 'There with him' as in I have to hold the door shut or stop him from leaving, also he's not seeming to want space when he's busy kicking me in the head then screaming 'I'm gonna do it again. What you gonna do?'

But after all that I just get 'Ok. Thank you'.

I know that I need to get some recordings, I'm just so scared that they will be used against me. My conversations with the police are being used against me, my emails are being used against me.

I let him do what he wanted the other day purely so that I could say to the social worker 'I did what you asked, I listened, & this was the result'. Broken doors & a whole heap of violence towards myself.

I'm not going to suggest that his dad does any courses.

I need him to have the children & it's not looking likely, is it. I have nobody else to ask

Maybe get the recordings for you for the moment until you see how CAMHS approach the situation. Then you have them if you need them.

Parents being falsely accused of fabrication is a known thing in the autism community.

This organisation have resources and links to support organisations. Would be worth a read just in case. With local authorities and schools trying to save money, they will be trying to avoid their obligations by claiming it is a parenting issue rather than an unmet need.

http://parents-protecting-children.org.uk/default.asp