I want out

[MrFriendZone]

I just don't want to be a parent or husband anymore. I know we're "not meant to say this" but it's how I feel, but the usual convenience traps of money, options and of course offspring (!) are making me miserable as I have no options with my own life.

Let me explain my situation - I'd love to hear opinions on whether I'm right/wrong in my thoughts.

I'm the husband in this relationship (married, 10 years). I have a very busy and demanding job Mon-Fri whilst my wife is a stay at home mum, managing the kids and the mental load. We're both mid-30s.

We have two children, 6 and 8. The 8 year old is a chronic whinger, the 6 year old is an endless ball of energy.

As always in your 30s with two kids, money is consumed by them and the house/cars/growing bills/after school clubs/clothes etc. We do alright, but I'm always having to watch it (to be brutally honest, it makes me resent having kids a bit).

In terms of the relationship with my wife, due to the kids, day-to-day stress/BS and zero local family support, our relationship has dwindled down to "good friends" aka we get along but there's zero romance, and no physical element. This is a huge problem for me, whereas my wife doesn't seem that bothered.

Midweek I have to be pretty dedicated to work, so I'm mostly in an adult/professional environment for 5 days straight....then BAM I'm hit with kids and family stuff every Saturday morning each week. It's really not easy to adjust to the whinging, demands, noise and other negatives that the kids present immediately - so I have a very short fuse with bad behaviour, which then makes the kids worse plus my wife starts having a go at me. She doesn't understand that I'm not used to this as much. I'm also a stricter parent which I believe is the right way (standard clash of parenting styles).

There's also the issue where she thinks having a job is easy and that she has more of the 'load'. I think this is a fairly common argument. I think it's pretty equal - I get to escape the family stuff BUT I have long commutes and need to answer to someone/produce results. I'm not just going to the pub with my feet up! Equally I always make an effort to be really show my appreciation for what my wife does - she keeps the house and kids running (and she does get her own break in terms of post school run I know she chills for a bit, no problem with that). It feels equal to me.

So combine my dead relationship + arguments about parenting + whinging kids + no support + financial irritations......well, I'm just wondering why anyone would do this to their life?!

Am I wrong to want out? Am I being an idiot?

I agree

I had 3 kids, worked full time as did my exdh, I looked after them 80% of the time, 90% of the housework and mental load.

She has loads of downtime, perhaps she needs to go back to work, rather than expect him to keep her.

They can then share the childcare 50/50

And the costs for the childcare, of course.

They can then share the childcare 50/50

With someone who can't even be bothered at the weekend? Sure.

Thanka for the further comments. I don't like all of them, and that's probably because they're making me wake up and realise where I'm going wrong with things.

I wasn't here looking to be defended, and I'll happily admit where I realise I'm in the wrong. This is why I posted, for opinions, others feeling the same, people who have been through it etc.

I'm going to have a talk with my wife tonight once the kids are in bed (yes, despite the haters here, I'm always the bathtime parent book reader on weekends and I enjoy it as I help them pick fun books from the shop and it's one of the few things that are like 'our thing'). I'm going to tell her about this post, where I think I've been a dick, explain why I feel unhappy (why I wrote the post) then see where she's at with things/feelings/needs (and yes I have to 'go first' here to explain the background of why we need to talk, get off my back angry posters!).

Thanks again everyone, this had been really eye opening. Turns out I might just be a shit DH...kind of...I'll figure that out tonight 😯

The answers on here taking the piss out of the OP are just stupid and sexist.
Personally, I think the 'dad works full time + SAHM' is fraught with problems for all parties. Everyone gets resentful and feel increasingly isolated from each other. Not surprising, you are living totally different lives and can't relate to each others lives. Plus the dads are a part time, walk on, bit part, to the kids. In a more ideal world, parents would share all the tasks more evenly. In this case, is there any possibility of OP reducing work hours and his DP working p/t?
It's the extreme difference in lives and different responsibilities that causes the problem I think.

How much do you really do with your children or know about them? And do you really think the way to fix the fact you don’t fit into family life is to avoid it even more?

you need to follow your wife’s lead regarding parenting - she is there 100% of the time for your children. Be kinder to them, stop shouting at them, show your interest in them and be prepared for the fact that the weekends aren’t going to be the chill out time you want it to be.

unless you like the fact your children are scared of you

She definitely needs weekend breaks as well - and maybe get a babysitter on a week evening as she must need timeout of the daily grind as well I understand that but I just think some of the replies here are completely missing the 4-5 hours that she has in the day.

OP I think there is an element of suck it up and I'm sorry but she is the main parent I think I would be very resentful if you started being stricter with the kids at the weekend I think you should follow her lead on that.

It gets easier once they start secondary and you'll be looking for them to spend time with you.

Well of course

Try being more proactive, less reactive.

Build yourself a ‘toolkit’ of how to deal with commonly occurring complaints from your 8 yr old. Spend some 1-1 time with each of your kids (they sound very different), to learn what really makes them tick.

As with anything, you get out what you put in, and with respect, you don’t sound as though you’re putting in much positivity at the moment.

I thought the same as @windowtothestreet - she gets a break from the kids every day for the better part of the day. Sure there's housework, sick days etc but that gets done even when both parents work, so I wouldn't over-egg the load she's saddled with. That's the deal being a SAHM. If it's time to rebalance, then both partners get employed and share out the kids/home jobs.

I understand the feeling, OP, and it's not limited to husbands. Raising little kids gets exhausting and I definitely reached a point where the shine had all gone and it was a grind to get through, but it does get better if you stick with it. Once they're in secondary, all being well they get much more self-sufficient and you get your life back. The first time you can go out without babysitters is incredible. Whole new era!

If you split before then, you'll of course have more time to please yourself, but there's massive downsides with its impact on the kids, finances, heartbreak, and complexities of future relationships, so it's worth hanging on in there and keeping communicating with your wife to try to get through this tough bit together, constructively, without recriminations. Fundamentally, you need to be on the same side, facing the problems together and trying to resolve them.

Libido-wise, it's subjective of course, but I found mine came back in my 40s, perhaps partly because the kids were older, but also hormones and all that. If your wife's on hormonal contraception, that can flatten the libido, so worth considering the snip and letting her feel the freedom of that. Especially as you definitely don't want more kids by the sound of it!

Remember that they won’t be primary aged for much longer. In 5 years time family life will look very different. In 10 years time it will be unrecognizable.
In the meantime, you need to tweak your routines so that you have more time feeling happy and less time feeling resentful. Sometimes this doesn’t require massive changes but just tipping the balance slightly.
It sounds like you really want a bit more time to wind down at the weekend, and more time alone with your wife. I think you also really need to build in some time with your kids doing something that makes you all happy.
Some suggestions;
Can you and your wife have one day each every weekend to sleep in till 8-10am while the other goes out with the kids? To do the shopping/go swimming/park/sports or whatever.
Can you combine some weekday evening time to yourself with kids activities? So you drop off child at basketball practice and you have a swim/gym time/cycle at the same time? Or you take one child to dance practice and have a coffee and read a book for half an hour?
Would your kids like to try your sport? Is that something you’d enjoy teaching them? If that doesn’t work, pick something different. It could be just taking one kid at a time out for icecream every other weekend. Something that you and they both enjoy.
To get some time with your wife is going to take a bit of organisation. Fair enough that she’s not keen on random babysitters. But a regular babysitter you get to know well could be a different story? Or trade favours with another family with similar aged kids - you could have one date night a month each and the kids go to the other family’s house for a movie night with popcorn. So the kids get a movie night with friends every other Friday, and you get a date night once a month.
Or enlist family when you visit. Either get grandparents to spend an evening/afternoon in charge of the kids while you have a date, or trade time with siblings with kids so all the adults get some time off.
Another option is to pick holidays with kid’s clubs.
Sibling bickering is annoying but just shouting at them to stop arguing is never an effective strategy. Even if they know you’re in charge and really want to please you, children are not always able to reign in their emotions instantly like that.
Better strategies exist. First you have to understand why they are bickering. Is it a long-standing area of difficulty? Sharing console time, going in each other’s rooms or similar? That kind of conflict can be reduced by having set in stone family rules for that issue. So when they bicker, your solution is always the same and eventually they learn to follow the rule without needing a parent to officially make the decision every time. Siblings also bicker about nothing much when they are bored. This is kind of conflict where you can tell them you’re not interested in such a silly argument and either send them to different areas of your home to play alone or change the pace and get them to do something different - time for chores works well because they’ll stop bothering you about arguments they themselves know are silly because it results in you remembering it’s time for them to tidy their rooms! More structured weekend routines helps this too because they don’t get bored so much.
Sometimes they argue about things that are really important to them. And it might seem silly to you, but to them it really matters. This is when you have to sit and listen to them and let them both know that you love them both equally and whatever the issue is needs to be solved/accepted/put in perspective. Eg. Older sibling keeps winning because they are stronger/faster. Reassure younger that they will grow and things will be more even. Or explain to both that games are more fun when everyone has a fighting chance and suggest a different game where the age difference is not going to be such an issue.
Solving sibling conflicts might not be very fun for you, but establishing a good relationship with your kids now is what is going to matter later on, when they are teens then young adults. It’s worth making the effort even when you’d rather be doing anything but.

I actually think you sound like a decent person and a nice guy. Just the fact that you're willing to take some of this on the chin and want to make a change is a good start. It sounds like you still love your wife a lot so that's a good starting point. I'm not sure telling her about this thread is the best idea you've ever had though. She might hate that you're saying this stuff to random strangers on the internet even if it's anonymous and she will probably be hurt by some of the things you've said if she reads it.

You need to prioritise your relationships. Your kids are just kids. They might be shit sometimes but I'm sure they are wonderful too. I think it's time to get to know them all better. You've got a lot of options open to you and all is not lost. I would imagine your wife would also like a more fulfilling relationship with her life partner. Find a way to make it happen otherwise your kids will leave home and you will realise your marriage can't survive anyway because you haven't invested in each other.

Other posters have suggested your wife goes back to work. Fine if that's what she wants and can reasonably do having taken a massive career break but I think you need to be crystal clear that if she goes back to work you need to be taking up a corresponding share of the mental load/housework/childcare.

I would suggest investing far more time and effort with your children, rather than trying to get away from them. Build up your relationships

I think a starting point could be to have a proper discussion with your DW about discipline and rules and try to come up with something that's more consistent.

Is there any potential for negotiation on getting a babysitter? It's all well and good her not wanting to but it sounds like you're both getting burnt out and there are consequences to that.

Hope you can at least make some small changes even if the biggest picture is a tough one

After school club only, or she could work p/t 9.30-3pm, as I did for a few years. It can be done. Plenty of women juggle work with school runs.

I don't think he's brave and I don't admire his honesty. He's simply doing what men often (always) do which is reserving the right to fuck off if he feels like it.

He's actually said "I've tried to get more into my sport and other things to give me stuff to escape with". Whatever his wife does or doesn't do this is an appalling way to think

The OP made it clear that they resent the expense of their children already, so adding another expense, like after school club, doesn't seem likely to improve the situation - unless this is meant to come solely from the wife's wage, so she has to shoulder the whole cost of going back to work.

The OP also made it clear that the responsibility for the DC during the week falls to his partner. Who will continue to do that with both parents working? Who fields calls from the school, finds the outfit for world book day, attends the school events held at inconvenient times, all of those little things? Is he going to start taking on any of that, when he's currently by his own admission profoundly checked out five days per week? And will OP be equitable in taking time off when the DC are ill, when the teachers strike, when there are inset days - or will the wife be expected to make time in her schedule for that because she's always done it as a SAHM?

Cost is actually the least of the worries but it ties so directly into the OP's first post that it makes a good starting point.

Also is it worth trying to get a job without so much commute or is that not possible in your line of work?

I’m shocked you’ve posted this on mumsnet….
you need some relationship counselling and date nights. Also know that you can’t ‘get out’ once kids are born.. ok you can divorce no prob but you do know your kids will still exist?? And what a shit to dump on your wife. You will still have to pay for your kids through maintenance payments and also you’ll still have your kids with you some of the time and without your team mate present. There is no ‘out’ really… kids are people and will live (hopefully) long lives…
You and your wife need to reconnect if you want to keep your family together. You need dates. You need to get that resentment out that you both feel. You also need to change your mindset imo and see that you are v lucky.. you’ve got a good job, income, two healthy kids and a supportive team mate who you love/d. That’s a lot of wins. What is it you want out of life?? You sound like you need to refresh yourself a bit and get some energy back. You’ve already got a family, a future generation, a marriage, a career. What’s missing for you?? Start doing some serious thinking about what you want in life and how to get that and your spark back with your team mate.

Remember that your wife is also working hard…. If she had written this post what would she have said? Would she want ‘out’ and how would you and your kids feel if your wife just walked out??? Don’t assume
That you’re the only one who can just get up and leave. She also could but she doesn’t. I bet she wants to sometimes aswell! I also think the only reason you’ve got headspace to think about all these things is because your team mate is so strong in her job within your family that it’s thanks to her that you’ve got the ability to even think of all this. Many people never meet a partner to spend life with. Don’t take that for granted. Good luck to you..buy your wife a lovely piece of jewellery and take her out for dinner. No one wants to get into bed with someone whose moaning and threatening to abandon you! Xox

Selfish awful man. You made a commitment, you thought it was going to be all fun and games? Improve yourself then re evaluate

He's actually said "I've tried to get more into my sport and other things to give me stuff to escape with". Whatever his wife does or doesn't do this is an appalling way to think

Really? We're always telling women on here to find something for themselves beyond work and kids, always telling them to develop hobbies, go to the gym etc. And yep, it's helpful for everyone to have an escape from the domestics. I don't see what's remotely appalling about thinking in this way. Few people do well being 100% focused on family life for years on end.

Also don't see what the big deal is about childcare costs for a 6 and 8yo. If she got a job, the costs of afterschool club, a few holiday clubs, and even a cleaner would hardly eat up all her wages. It's all just reasons to not change anything and clearly something needs to change.

This is why so many people choose not to have children. Because all of this and that just does not appeal - and it's a very valid choice, being a parent is hard and gruelling and if you don't actually want to do it it's even harder.

Unfortunately you didn't make that choice, you chose to have a family and you need to try. So many men go through what you're going through when they realise being a parent isn't the long stream of lovely Kodak moments they expected. The good ones adapt and overcome. The shit ones bail and try to relive their life before kids, alone. Do try and be one of the good ones. Your children didn't ask to be brought into this world, you did that, you have more of a responsibility to them than yourself now. That's parenthood. Even if you and your wife choose to co-parent apart, that's better than just jumping ship and deciding you don't want to be a parent anymore.

Good luck with the conversation with your wife, I hope it goes well for you both.

I know the OP has explained that he doesn't consider leaving ..
but still, the title: I want out

Oh my goodness.

It just confirms, once again, that men have that option. They do, they always have. The vast majority of women don't, they are left holding the baby.
They are left holding the whinging one, the one that's a ball of energy, the surly one, the aggressive one, the one with learning difficulties, the one with special emotional needs, the one with mental health issues.
We need to do it all. And we do, thank goodness we do, because someone has to.
There's no a get-out clause.

Can someone please explain this to the divorce lawyers in this country who are feigning ignorance , and pretending that we are equal?

I second the PP who said showing your wife this thread might not be a good idea. She might not be able to get past the initial “wanting out” or sharing details with strangers on the Internet. Just have a proper read back trying to put yourself in her shoes before doing it. Good luck!

It's all well and good to escape the domestics, but the OP doesn't participate in the domestics full-time already, by his own admission.

So the wife is expected to pay for the cost of caring for the children and household out of her wage - which you're speculating would be enough, as the OP doesn't share his wife's earning potential anywhere - alone? Or does the OP share in that, which he admits to resenting having to do already?