Why are gender roles viewed negatively?

[reddragon7]

I read and see so many threads and real life examples, where men and women feel the need to be “equal.” The man about to become a father, refuses to become the main earner, even when he has the means, and insists that his wife also work and contribute financially. Doesn’t this seem imbalanced to anyone, and that society is being brainwashed to accept this as the norm.

I have nothing against a woman wishing to work post-children, however, I don’t understand why society and some men put pressure on their wives to work, if she would rather stay home with the children. This has now become and expectation. If a woman is contributing financially, it is never really 50/50, as she is also doing most of the domestic work.

People condemn gender roles as though they are ancient, but seem to forget that, biologically and psychologically, women are naturally better caregivers to children. They are the ones pregnant, produce all these hormones, and better equipped to raise a child than a man. Of course, there are exceptions, but as a general fact, people seem to ignore this.

In view of all this, I believe more men should offer to be financial providers, giving women the option to not work after children, as childcare costs aren’t exactly saving them much anyway. Otherwise, it feels we are moving away from our gender roles, which may actually be more helpful in a marriage, than people make out.

But you were asked to post links to back up your theory that women make the best primary carers.

you posted a link that actually contradicted your hypothesis.

so come on, where’s the research that backs you up?

Doesn’t it seem obvious, disregarding the minority, where men are better parents than women.

Again, show me the evidence that proves this to be true.

Generally speaking, women are better equipped biologically and psychologically. Why else do they have wombs, changing hormones, and why are they the ones who can carry the baby in utero, and not the father.

Women are equipped to be pregnant, give birth and breastfeed. That doesn't make them better parents or more equipped to care for children once you take breastfeeding out of the equation.

I am not saying the father should be absent, but that most women tend to children more, ruling out expeditions.

That isn't due to biology though........

Oh God, I hadn’t seen the first link as it didn’t come up as a hyperlink.

that’s even worse 😂😂😂😂😂 it’s just some waffling from a single mother about how she does the work of both parents.

this is why when people say “do your research” i dislocate my eyeballs. Most non academics don’t have a clue on “research” or how to critically appraise work.

But…you were trying to find something that supported your theory? And instead posted an opinion piece that disagreed with a man whose theories are outdated and widely discredited.

You clearly didn’t read it and stabbed at Google, read the title, and shared it.

I know!! It's so awful........

I happed to be an academic in Education - i don't specialise in early years but I'm familiar with the research and i just KNEW that Bowlby would get a mention. So predictable.

What did you take last night? Because whatever it is, it clearly hasn't agreed with you. Hope you feel better soon. Stay hydrated!

I think that’s all the op was saying though. If that’s what you want why is it looked down upon?

Feminism Isn't trying to deny biology
It says biology is important for sone things ( like getting pregnant) but isn't important for others things ( like how caring a person you are )

Guess that's just too complex ?

From the conservative here we get feminists are denying biology and from the transactivists we are told feminists are trying to enforce a biological narrative

No she's saying that women are better parents and that mothers working (but not fathers) is a bad thing.

Going part time can also be problematic as it can reduce career progress, pension pot etc and contributes towards the wage gap between men and women.

I also don’t agree that a woman should be doing most of the childcare and housework. It doesn’t have to be that way and isn’t something I would ever accept.

It is possible to share all working, childcare and house responsibilities and that, to me, is the ideal and to completely move away from gender roles because they are damaging and set a bad example to children.

Not once did I say it’s a bad thing, jeez. I repeated and said in my original post, so many times - there is nothing wrong with a woman working. Even I work myself. Just that women should have the option to become full time mums, should they wish, and men should support this.

No. She is saying that women have the right to demand to be a SAHM and men should just accept that.

I didn’t post to do conduct academic assignment. If that were the case, I’d have written a critically appraised article beforehand. Seems like it’s too much for modern feminists to digest that some women actually like to take the nurturing role and from personal experiences, I have seen that this has worked favourably.

Oxytocin is an important hormone that helps in nurturing children. This is higher in females than men. Research points towards this being an important factor in their care.

Oh you want to be blinkered?

No femininit is objecting to you doing what you want

We are objecting to your assumption that what you want is natural and right

I am just saying why are these roles views so negatively and outrageously, if women WANT to do this. And why shouldn’t women have the right to choose to be SAHM, without facing financial pressure from work.

I didn’t post to do conduct academic assignment. If that were the case, I’d have written a critically appraised article beforehand. Seems like it’s too much for modern feminists to digest that some women actually like to take the nurturing role and from personal experiences, I have seen that this has worked favourably.

Nobody has asked you to write an academic assignment but you should at least have checked the sources you were attempting to use to prove your point. You shared something that nothing but a single mother ranting about her own situation.

There is nothing wrong with women choosing to take on a nurturing role at all, people just disagree that parenting come more naturally to women and that women have a right to demand to to be taken care of financially by men.

Oxytocin is an important hormone that helps in nurturing children. This is higher in females than men. Research points towards this being an important factor in their care.

Yes, and research shows that the more nurturing and caring you do the higher your oxytocin levels - there is evidence of oxytocin increasing in men who are heavily involved in caring for their children ( particularly newborn babies)

In the politest possible way, you are in no way intellectually qualified to write a ‘critically-appraised article’. Or even a bit of lazy journalism headlined something like WE HEART BEING PUT BACK IN THE KITCHEN SAY SURRENDERED WIVES. Or even a bad first-year undergraduate essay in Sociology 101.

Yet again another statement with nothing to back it up.

No one is saying that women shouldn’t take on a “nurturing role” if that is what works for their family.

what we are objecting to is that women have the right to be financially supported by men, and that anything other than the traditional gender roles is against nature and somehow detrimental to the children.

you can talk about biology and oxytocin all you like. But until you can produce some actual valid research that states that traditional roles are the optimum, then it is just your opinion.

i agree with your review piece that says women as primary carers in traditional roles isn’t always the ideal. So far all you’ve done is confirm my view that any human can take the lead role in raising children, or it can be done by a number of humans, regardless of sex.

Jeez, simply because I hold personal traditional views, I’m deemed as stupid. Each to their own. You clearly cannot grasp that I feel women have a right to be financially provided for, and hold the opinion that women do well as the primary caregiver.

OP, you have embarrassed yourself a bit with your link, as you clearly have no idea what you're talking about. I am cringing for you tbh.

You sound quite ignorant and naive. Your argument seems to be based on dodgy links and refrains of "surely it's obvious".

But it is not obvious because you are fundamentally wrong about this.

You can assert your "right" to be a SAHP all you like. Hopefully, for your sake, your partner will be happy to support this. I just hope that you don't pass on your awful antiquated views to any children that you might already have or hope to have in the future. The next generation deserve to be free of these stupid stereotypes, and you will be doing your children a massive disservice if you pass your prejudices on to them.

No, that’s not what you said.

you said women have the right to give up work and expect to be financially supported by a man. And tried the “but science says” line to back your theory. Which is clearly bollocks as you can’t find the science…

The only time I mentioned science was when someone demanded I find proof that women are better caregivers, when this was my opinion to begin with. I still believe it to be true, yes, in most cases. Not all the time.

If a woman wants to take on that role and her husband agrees to it, on an individual level that's fine. Where I disagree is your opinion that women should be able to demand it and how negative gender roles are for society as a whole.

Oxytocin levels rise in men when they care for their babies, during skin to skin contact etc.

I know exactly what I’m talking about. I admit, one of the links has been as oversight, as I said I was in middle of sleep, and it’s not a topic I have extensively researched scientifically. But seemed like common sense from real life stories.

In what way have I been prejudiced by stating that traditional roles can be advantageous?

People aren't saying that you sound stupid because you hold traditional views. They think you sound stupid because you are unable to articulate a coherent argument in support of your views and because you can't actually substantiate any of your silly claims with evidence.

We are absolutely able to grasp the fact that you think women have a right to be provided for and that you consider them to be better caregivers. It isn't that we can't understand that that's your view, but rather that we think you're completely wrong and that your position is unjustified.