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Why are gender roles viewed negatively?

866 replies

reddragon7 · 04/04/2023 20:32

I read and see so many threads and real life examples, where men and women feel the need to be “equal.” The man about to become a father, refuses to become the main earner, even when he has the means, and insists that his wife also work and contribute financially. Doesn’t this seem imbalanced to anyone, and that society is being brainwashed to accept this as the norm.

I have nothing against a woman wishing to work post-children, however, I don’t understand why society and some men put pressure on their wives to work, if she would rather stay home with the children. This has now become and expectation. If a woman is contributing financially, it is never really 50/50, as she is also doing most of the domestic work.

People condemn gender roles as though they are ancient, but seem to forget that, biologically and psychologically, women are naturally better caregivers to children. They are the ones pregnant, produce all these hormones, and better equipped to raise a child than a man. Of course, there are exceptions, but as a general fact, people seem to ignore this.

In view of all this, I believe more men should offer to be financial providers, giving women the option to not work after children, as childcare costs aren’t exactly saving them much anyway. Otherwise, it feels we are moving away from our gender roles, which may actually be more helpful in a marriage, than people make out.

OP posts:
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Karwomannghia · 05/04/2023 09:27

That’s a reach don’t be ridiculous. If you’re going to start trying to say I’m homophobic to win points you’re not worth engaging with. My DS is gay. I’m speaking about trends in society and women are oppressed by men. I’m not saying men are incapable of parenting.

riotlady · 05/04/2023 10:18

Karwomannghia · 05/04/2023 08:45

It’s funny how all the females of the species in the animal kingdom are somehow socialised into child rearing as well. It’s men who need to be actively socialised into parenting usually and on the whole that seems to be a long and arduous task. Just read any thread on here.
The first few months of a baby’s life are absolutely crucial for their development - language and cognitive and in their understanding of relationships. They’re not a ‘blob’ that any old adult can keep an eye on occasionally.
Research has shown that women are still doing more of the domestic chores on top of more work and more child rearing and yet it’s somehow their fault! It’s mainly women who sacrifice their careers out of choice to be with their children (I wouldn’t have swapped my time with my babies for anything) and their time is not recognised or valued in the divorce courts, in pensions or in benefits. Loving effective child rearing and caring for others is a crucial in our society and should be valued as such, not just working for money.

Really? All animals? Male emperor penguins don’t look after the eggs until they hatch while the females go off to look for food? Male seahorses don’t give birth? Marmosets don’t share duties?

Crazycrazylady · 05/04/2023 10:52

For one parents to stay at home, both parents need to be completely on board. We both work and at this stage one of us could stay at home and be a stay at home parent but it would mean loosing all the extras including nice hols etc and more importantly it would put all the financial load on one person in the house which unless you're absolutely ok with is really unfair .

Interested in this thread?

Then you might like threads about these subjects:

MrsBennetsPoorNerves · 05/04/2023 11:13

I'm so grateful that, despite having had the traditional SAHM/WOHD set up themselves, my parents didn't push this shit about gender roles to us as children. I am grateful that they had enough vision to see that there were better ways of organising family life than their own set-up, that they taught us that men and women were both fully capable of earning a living, caring for children, cooking and cleaning etc, and that they encouraged us not to limit our aspirations. I feel sorry for kids - both boys and girls - whose parents have such blinkered perspectives on gender roles.

SouthLondonMum22 · 05/04/2023 12:00

reddragon7 · 05/04/2023 04:18

This is why I would still advocate education so a woman still has something as a back-up, which would make it easier for her to transition back into work etc.

Women get the choice for simple reasons, they are the ones who carried the baby and gave birth. Men don’t go through the process of pregnancy and childbirth, do they.

Advocating gender roles doesn’t mean ditching the other completely. In times of need, a woman would still help her husband financially. And a man, still help his wife domestically.
Just seems fairer imo, for a mother to be free of financial expectations, should she wish to be.

It isn’t fair at all if they don’t agree and would cause resentment.

No adult is entitled to be provided for financially.

reddragon7 · 05/04/2023 12:17

SouthLondonMum22 · 05/04/2023 12:00

It isn’t fair at all if they don’t agree and would cause resentment.

No adult is entitled to be provided for financially.

I guess I believe a wife has that right

OP posts:
digshallow · 05/04/2023 12:19

I guess I believe a wife has that right

Just a wife?

Half expecting you to say the husband has a right to sex in return...

Antiquiteas · 05/04/2023 12:21

digshallow · 05/04/2023 12:19

I guess I believe a wife has that right

Just a wife?

Half expecting you to say the husband has a right to sex in return...

Quite. I’m really quite sad that a 29 year old woman holds on so firmly to these backwards beliefs.

Antiquiteas · 05/04/2023 12:22

Where does the OP stand on same-sex parent families? Has that been touched upon yet?

I noticed that the request for the source of ‘women are naturally better caregivers’ was not forthcoming.

Shutte · 05/04/2023 12:26

Take sex out of it, what you’re describing is an imbalance of expectations in a relationship. You’re describing a situation that I don’t see regularly in real life or on these forums.

SouthLondonMum22 · 05/04/2023 12:29

reddragon7 · 05/04/2023 12:17

I guess I believe a wife has that right

They are supposed to be a team. A man or woman doesn't get to dictate anything that involves the other person, they need to both agree.

reddragon7 · 05/04/2023 12:32

Antiquiteas · 05/04/2023 12:22

Where does the OP stand on same-sex parent families? Has that been touched upon yet?

I noticed that the request for the source of ‘women are naturally better caregivers’ was not forthcoming.

I’m still not fully awake right now as I’m not in work today. I haven’t had the chance to respond to everything yet, but will do when I can today.

OP posts:
midgemadgemodge · 05/04/2023 12:36

On the bright side this looks like OP is in a minority and her arguments have yet to make anyone publicly declare a change of heart ...

TearsforBeers · 05/04/2023 12:37

I guess I believe a wife has that right

No, just no.
An adult does not have the right to dictate that another adult provides for them financially.

Delectable · 05/04/2023 12:38

reddragon7 · 04/04/2023 21:57

I am not trying to force anybody. I am genuinely curious as to why it’s becoming an expectation for women to work after maternity leave, even if they don’t want to. Just feels like a lack of choice.

Another puzzle to solve is those who in their pursuit of equality divide the total expenses into two and then require 50/50 responsibility even where thr man earns 80k and the woman 40k. Makes no sense at all.

MotherOfRatios · 05/04/2023 12:38

Gender roles perpetuate/reinforce the patriarchy which is impacting young men and boys and adds to them being misogynistic. As what they see at home impacts the way they view women.

TearsforBeers · 05/04/2023 12:46

Another puzzle to solve is those who in their pursuit of equality divide the total expenses into two and then require 50/50 responsibility even where thr man earns 80k and the woman 40k. Makes no sense at all.

Most couples don't do this though. Equality doesn't mean everything is 50/50 all of the time. My DH earns more than me but he is 11 years older and has longer to establish his career. So we organise our finances appropriately.

Antiquiteas · 05/04/2023 12:47

reddragon7 · 05/04/2023 12:32

I’m still not fully awake right now as I’m not in work today. I haven’t had the chance to respond to everything yet, but will do when I can today.

Right…

Laurdo · 05/04/2023 12:56

Sure, because a man can just walk into work and say "I have a kid to support now and I don't want my wife to work so you're going to have to double my salary". It's not that easy just to earn more because you want to. I'm sure most people are doing their best to earn what they can. And a lot of women earn more than their partners so why would they give that up and then expect the man to just find the extra cash.

If you're both working full time but the woman is doing all/most of the childcare and housework then you have an issue. Don't assume that's the norm, plenty of men do their fair share of childcare and housework.

Brefugee · 05/04/2023 12:59

I have not RTFT because i value my blood pressure.

Read the entirety of Mumsnet. Especially the SAHP threads, the Work threads and the FWR board (chat probably)

I’m genuinely curious. This is not a joke.

Can't you work it out? (ok here we go: I didn't want to look after children, the idea of being at home with anything other than adult company bored me shitless. I ended up SAHM for 3 years and got to the point when offing myself was something that i thought about every single day. Gender is bullshit. Gender roles are bullshit. Stereotyping is bullshit)

MrsBennetsPoorNerves · 05/04/2023 13:19

reddragon7 · 05/04/2023 12:17

I guess I believe a wife has that right

But why?

Why on earth would a competent adult have the right to demand that another adult should financially support her lifestyle choices just because she is female?

It's fine for families to have a SAHP if they can afford it and if both partners agree that that's how they want to organise their lives, but there is no inherent right for the woman to opt out of earning her keep and there is no inherent duty on the man to provide for another adult. The default position is that both adults bear an equal responsibility for earning a living, taking care of any children and managing any domestic tasks. If they choose to split those tasks between them in a particular way, then that's between the two of them, but neither has a right to demand anything other than a 50/50 split across the board.

It is truly depressing that a young woman can still hold such backward views. Hopefully, people who share your views are becoming increasingly unusual.

bossonext · 05/04/2023 13:21

reddragon7 · 05/04/2023 12:32

I’m still not fully awake right now as I’m not in work today. I haven’t had the chance to respond to everything yet, but will do when I can today.

lol you've written a couple of paragraphs this morning and suddenly your just too tired?

reddragon7 · 05/04/2023 13:54

bossonext · 05/04/2023 13:21

lol you've written a couple of paragraphs this morning and suddenly your just too tired?

Jeez no, a couple of paragraphs are simply quick and don’t require me to bother much. If I am to show research to back up how i feel, I’d rather them be more credible.

OP posts:
reddragon7 · 05/04/2023 13:55

bossonext · 05/04/2023 13:21

lol you've written a couple of paragraphs this morning and suddenly your just too tired?

I’ve been responding as I was in and out of sleep 😂

OP posts:
Mycathatesmecuddling · 05/04/2023 14:00

It’s funny how all the females of the species in the animal kingdom are somehow socialised into child rearing as well.

Apart from the fact this is incorrect 1 in 3 mammal species can be seen to eat their young. Funnily enough we have managed to evolve past that but men looking after babies equally is suddenly not possible due to our biological nature's 🙄