On holiday with 4yo and it’s awful - is this normal??

[SatelliteFish]

On holiday with 4yo DD and it’s awful.

She’s loving the fun bits, but if she’s not eating ice cream, swimming, bouncing on a bouncy castle etc she’s having a meltdown, mis-behaving or moaning. Won’t eat a single meal nicely, won’t go to bed nicely, won’t do anything nicely unless it’s a fun activity.

Epic (and I mean epic) meltdown today because I wouldn’t buy her a lollipop because her behaviour had been terrible. I said no and explained why & stuck to my guns. I do try to be strict and have some discipline but just feel like a failure.

It’s our first holiday abroad (Europe) due to Covid and DH and I are seriously thinking it will be our last. It’s not enjoyable. I’m looking at flights to leave early.

We’ve looked forward to this holiday for literally years, saved up etc and after this week it’s back to work / grindstone for the next year.

Is this normal? What age do holidays with kids get better??

Please no sarcastic comments. I’m sat here on my hard-earned holiday (first In four years) in tears. If you don’t have any supportive words please kindly pass by this thread.

Oh and DD doesn’t have any additional needs as far as we are aware.

She attends a very good pre-school and they speak very highly of her.

Only let her have treats if shes behaving herself. Kids can be demons at times and will push buttons to see how far they can manipulate you but you need to stick to your guns. Is she normally like this? She might be over tired and playing up. If she won't go to bed etc tonight explain there will be no ice creams etc tomorrow and stick to it.

We’ve only been abroad once, when ds was coming up for two and it was ok, but the first holiday we went on after the lockdown in 2020, so he’d have been 4, was honestly awful. He’s usually such a good boy and I used to take him on little mini breaks all the time pre covid, but something about his age or the lockdowns really upset the Apple cart! To make matters worse, it was in a camper van. The first two days were honestly hideous and his behaviour was appalling.

he is six now and is much better, but I found that the key was LOTS of explaining what would be happening. We can’t surprise ds with a getaway because he won’t cope. If we go away now, I start prepping him a few weeks before - pictures of where we are going etc. We talk about what we will do, what we might do, whether he will have a bed or a camp bed, we make sure to bring things he’s familiar with.

I feally think lockdowns have done a number on our young children, most of DS’ peers seem to be similar.

Maybe use the ipad as a bargaining tool. Only allow screen time for an hour a day and if she's been good

Could you create some sort of visual timetable for her, so she knows what activities she is doing each day. Leave the fun thing to the end if possible and then you can tell her that if she has a tantrum or misbehaves, she will not be participating in that activity?

My 4 YO went through this phase. Its not fun and even less so on holiday. Its a short lived phase and by 5 holidays were fab. Sorry you got hit with this on holiday :-(

We had this last year when DS was 5. Honestly it was hellish. Just no fun at all.

Now he's 6 it's mostly better? There's still been meltdowns and refusal to put on shoes or get dressed or brush teeth so we can go and do something HE wants to do, but definitely better than last year.

Tips - always take something in your bag for them to do when waiting for food/an activity. I have a little (half a4) wallet with some paper, coloured pencils, stickers etc. build in some time in the accommodation where they just watch tv/iPad/colour/play.

There's still been moments this holiday when I've thought, why do we bother though!

We did a few holidays while they were little and it was always incredibly difficult and more then once we seriously considered coming home early, to the point of pricing up flights. It was always because we were trying to do to much, best thing is to dramatically reduce your expectations..keep going...

The best holiday we had at that age by far was one in a hotel with pools, a little garden with a hammock and hot tub and the beach on the doorstop. We had a buffet breakfast, went in all the pools, lunch in our little garden, being close in age and tired out they would both nap for THREE HOURS?! while we took turns going for a swim by ourself / lying in the hammock reading or also napping, afternoon at the beach then a dance and shattered ready for bed. Every day ! No idea why we've tried loads of city breaks since then, makes no sense 😅

Ah yes, same shit different place at that age. I had 2 under 3 and found self catering the best option, as can control routines. Explaining ahead of time as people said. We need to queue it’s going to boring, we will be in the car for 2 peppa pigs etc. it does get better!

We’ve been away twice recently with our 3.5 year old, once just us and once with friends with similar aged kids. 10x easier when he had other children to play with/distract him.

So sorry OP - that’s so hard. I have been there (I have a 5 and a 2 year old). I wouldn’t say holidays are enjoyable - but there are precious moments which (in time) will rose tint everything. A few tips - my son was very similar when away last week;

• Avoid all meltdown triggers - particularly associated with shops / treats - ie don’t take her into shops etc if at all possible (I carried mine out of one screaming last week)

• Abandon any ideals around food / nutrition - let her eat / not eat whatever she wants - genuinely, letting go of that is a must to get through the week. Just try get fluids in so she doesn’t get constipated

• The moaning, tantrums etc are probably a combination of things - but her seeking a connection to you that she’s not feeling might be contributing. Are you fully present with her (no phones, interested energy in her, her ideas and what she wants to explore)?

• Lastly, keep your inner child in check. I have found myself saying ‘you’re so ungrateful blah blah - I never got all this’ a few times. Especially when we’ve done a wonderful thing and they are straight on moaning for the next thing. Children don’t have our frame of reference and to impose ours onto them is totally unfair. Just a thought.

You are in a relationship with your child - ultimately, you can’t control her. Maybe try a go with her flow day - what does she want to do and in what order. Can you enable it whilst maintaining boundaries around bedtime etc?

Loads of luck - holidays with young children are a bloody roulette and often don’t live up to expectations so don’t beat yourself up. Also, children change and next year might be different. X

Perfectly normal OP and total sympathy. You want a relaxing time and no doubt deserve one, unfortunately kids don't get the same script the parents get.
Try and take a deep breath and lower your expectations if you can, I say that gently.
Hope you can get some enjoyment, look after yourself.

Have a glass of wine and relax. You need to lower your expectations. I’m guessing you don’t normally spend 7 whole days together so she’s winding you up more than the usual few hours you see her each day? She’s 4. she’s never been abroad before. The food, water, weather, bed etc. are all strange and different she’s bound to find some aspects challenging. Did we mention she’s 4 so she’s a massive diva testing boundaries all over the place. She would do the same if you didn’t buy the lolly at Tesco at home don’t worry! Don’t try to do too much or expect too much. Don’t make not eating her dinner a massive deal just pick your battles you’re all on holiday does it really matter if she goes to bed a Little later or won’t eat the strange toast?
I’ve taken mine kids abroad from being 3 months old we’ve been all over the world and they are the happiest memories I have. I spent a month in South America last year with my 3 year old and it was amazing. She definitely acted like a 3 year old and a tired one at times. There were things I desperately wanted to do while there but just couldn’t because they weren’t child friendly or we had to stop to get her a snack or go home early because she was tired etc. but we both had the best time and she’s constantly asking to go back. The trick is not expecting everything to be perfect all the time and not overreacting to their dramas.

My DD was on holiday recently and DGD age 3 wouldn't eat - I phoned and pretended to be Ladybug and made up a story about a baddie eating all the food in the world - worked a treat. I've pretended to be Disney Princesses for my other DGDs too for different reasons - works every time.

Honestly? I don’t think that’s normal four year old behaviour. It sounds utterly miserable and more like a toddler.

Is your DD an only child? Staying in a villa with no kids clubs and no siblings/other kids to run off some steam with is always going to be tricky.
A resort based holiday is less stressful with a child that age with kids clubs and activities and sone down time for you. I was an only child and I remember being quite bored on holiday when I was young and remember my family had to take me to do lots of activities to occupy me.

They'll have other kids their age to play with and
people who get paid to be fun and entertaining. A good kids club is great for most children and breaks up the day. They can go for either the morning or afternoon and then spend some time with their parents in the other part of the day and will hopefully make friends who they can play with in the pool.

My lovely son was a horrid little turd on one holiday (aged 4-5) so maybe it’s a developmental thing? They tend to go through periods of having a good push of the old boundaries then being nice for a while. Empathize with your kid’s feelings without giving in and feeding the beast eg I can see you’re angry and sad and it’s hard but it’s bed time and that means you have to go to bed. Also two choices eg when you go to bed, would you like us to read this book or that one? Good luck! It will pass!

That's what OP has done and that's why her kid is being a nightmare. Kids need some sort of loose routine and boundaries to feel safe and happy.

I’m so sorry you’re having a hard time!
It’s totally normal though. I remember being so frustrated that I couldn’t relax and enjoy my holiday because my then 4-year-old was losing her shit (plus super-early waking).
It gets much better when school starts, I promise!

I feel you OP. My 4yo was very angry on our holiday and we were only in the UK! Tantrums over everything, only happy when he was doing something he liked... The worst was random point blank refusal to do things, even things he loves. For example, he loves mazes, there was a maze, he got it in his head he didn't want to go, he went bananas. It was obviously something else (hungry, tired, overexcited, etc) but he just stood there screaming "I DONT WANT TOOOOOO!"

I tried to stay calm with him because he didn't mean it, but boy was it hard! We did everything we could to stick to normal bedtime and mealtimes, and that did help a bit. Overall I can't say I enjoyed our holiday, despite having a great time last year. The 8yo was an absolute superstar and I hardly got to spend any time with her because I was constantly dealing with DS. When we got home he was an angel for three days straight. Not one tantrum. A different child.

Hope you manage to enjoy some of your holiday, OP!

We found an itinerary with times on helped hugely with communicating times for things. Does bed have to be a strict time? I would also imagine that you've enthused so much about the trip that they are expecting continual fun.

Not surprised about the meltdown with the lolly, a 4 yo can hardly connect previous behaviour with a lolly NOW. She’s out of routine, she still needs playing with, reading to etc while you probably feel you want to sit down and relax. If your temper is getting shorter, she will have picked up on that, and perhaps that it’s about her. Holidays with young children are not holidays away from the young children, you are still parents.

I had this when I took my DD to Disney Land Paris at almost 4 years old. We only went there for her, she was awful from the moment she opened her eyes in the morning. I think it's being over stimulated from all these new things.

You might find, when she’s older, she has issues with sensory processing. Too many messages going in and can’t process them all, hence the excitement but can’t process it all, resulting in meltdowns. She might not being deliberately difficult. She is finding it difficult. There are probably websites that give good advice.

I feel for you all, life is so hard at times. You all need a holiday and the trouble is with a 4 year old in tow you can't just switch off and chill. You have the demands of a 4 year old who is all out of kilter being away from their normal routine. I hope you find a way to enjoy it, fingers crossed for you.