Breast is best - no it’s not actually.

[bubblesforlife]

I’m a new mom, my baby was born last weekend.
I followed feeding guidelines, listened to professional advice, and decided to breast feed my baby.

A few days in, my baby has developed jaundice and low sodium. This is due to dehydration and no fluids.

I gave my Baby colostrum, by breast and syringe regularly.

I asked my visiting midwife if I should supplement feeding with formula until my milk came in, she said no I am doing the best by my baby. Not unless there is a clinical need.

Now we’re readmitted for 2 nights minimum and placed on as strict baby formula feeding plan.

2 other ladies in the ward also have dehydrated babies for the same reason as me. How does this happen all the time yet no one talks about it?

Breast is best? No. Starve your baby until your milk comes in, and then hope for the best that you’re on for the lucky ones it works for.

My milk came in on day 3, a normal timeline.!

The messaging is wrong to mothers. This is so very common according to hospital.

Breast is best..... eventually.... but feed your baby what it needs, if that’s a supplement of formula, so what.

I don’t know what I’m trying to say, but I’m just so upset. No one told me I was starving my little newborn. I did my best, I tried so hard and sat there filling syringes of colostrum.

Something has to change here. The pressure placed on new mothers throughout pregnancy to breast feed is wrong.

I hope my baby recovers soon so we can go home and be a family.

@FudgeSundae I said when there is no feeding issues, if the baby is underfed, to me there is clearly a feeding issue and the brain damage was not caused by breastmilk but by the lack of lack of milk resulting in dehydration. I don't want any baby to be starving, to be underfed or dehydrated.

I really passionately believe that INFORMED is best. As long as mothers are supported, given all the information they need, are told honestly about the potential risks and benefits of both breastfeeding and formula then I think most will make the right decision for themselves and their baby.
Just telling women that breast is best without signposting them to and providing them with expert help to overcome early difficulties does a massive disservice to new mothers. It's a tragedy that so many mums who want to breastfeed end up switching to formula because they aren't supported properly, and it's equally a tragedy that formula feeding mums are made to feel even remotely guilty or inadequate for making the right choice to them.
I hope you and baby are getting the help you need now OP.

[quote cheesebubble]@FudgeSundae I said when there is no feeding issues, if the baby is underfed, to me there is clearly a feeding issue and the brain damage was not caused by breastmilk but by the lack of lack of milk resulting in dehydration. I don't want any baby to be starving, to be underfed or dehydrated. [/quote]
Apologies: agreed there was clearly a feeding/supply issue here.

You may have had problems, but thinking that filling your child with chemicals is best...just no

What do people mean when they say this? Everything that any of us has ever consumed is a chemical, including breast milk.

I agree that breastmilk is nutritionally preferable to formula but that doesn't make formula some sort of poison, for goodness sake. Formula is designed for babies. It provides them with reasonably good nutrition.

This is exactly the sort of thing that the OP is talking about.

I really feel for you op. Had a similar experience 10 years ago and it's sad to hear not much has changed. Tried to bf after a traumatic c section with very little support. I was really worried about poor supply and wanted to bottle feed in hospital, but the midwife told me I must preserve as giving a bottle was like feeding my child McDonald's! So I did, went home, she became jaundiced and very dehydrated. Admitted to hospital and put on a very strict feeding schedule (bottle as still no good supply). I was traumatised that I had effectively starved my baby. Hope you are both ok

@FudgeSundae I'm really not against formula feeding at all, again, everyone really needs to do what's best for their baby and their family and you get to make that choice. Choice is best and I hate to think mothers feel like they failed. I went through feeling like a failure for not being able to give birth naturally and it's not right, you should never feel bad for any choice you make or even have to make.

I have twins born at 34 weeks in NICU. I was shown how to express within 10 mins of coming out of the c section. I found it very hard for the first day or 2 but by the end of day 3 milk had started to come in but you HAVE to express every 2 hours with no longer than 6 hour gap at night to encourage it. My babies were being topped up with formula (but are tube fed) until I had enough supply to feed 2 - by day 8/9 they have been fully breastfed 24/7

I think people think it's it's a quick process - I've found it really isn't. But I'm lucky in that my hospital has its own breastfeeding advisors full time whose some job is to support you

@Blackdog19

I agree with the above poster that Fed is Best. Pressure shouldn’t be put on anybody to breast feed and nobody should feel bad if they choose not to/or are unable to.

This with bells on!!! I started breastfeeding my daughter, but was ordered to stop and change to formula by my GP when I developed severe PND and was prescribed antidepressants. (This was the 90's, and there were fears antidepressants would be absorbed into the breastmilk and harm the baby. I think medical opinion has changed now). I don't know if anyone judged me or not, but I judged myself and considered myself to be an absolute failure. I still regret it now, and she's 30! My daughter thrived regardless. What I'm trying to say is that successful breastfeeding is wonderful, but for a myriad of reasons it doesn't work for everyone. AND THERE IS NO REASON WHATSOEVER TO FEEL SHAME OR GUILT! Sorry for shouting

@WunWun

I was overwhelmingly pressured to formula feed by midwives at the hospital, to the point of getting into an argument about it.

Snap. I was pressured to much on day 2 and my midwife pretty much took my baby from me (bewildered first time mum) and poured formula into her mouth from a cup whilst I was sobbing saying no. Formula has been the absolute expected norm for generations before this one which is why breast is pushed so much- trying to reverse the formula mindset of a population is a monumental task

Fed is best is such a trite phrase and in my view in the western world a really petty and injured response to the fact that in the vast majority of circumstances and scenarios Brest milk is of course a superior “product” that cannot be replicated by formula. Poor breastfeeding support, postnatal medication, lack of time to learn, poor hydration/ nutrition stress and incompetent inexperienced professionals are behind 95% of reasons why breastfeeding doesn’t work out. Not lack of milk, too small or big breasts, etc etc.

Why women start bitching about it when it’s not their “fault” is beyond me.

There are a tiny tiny number of women who are unable to produce enough milk to breastfeed.

Furthermore fed is best in terms of formula feeding is actually not best in many developing or underprivileged areas of the world where lack of sanitation and hygienic and formula prep facilities means many young babies are killed due to deadly formula feeding practice .The formula companies should really pump some of the millions they make into improving facilities and quality of life for women to breastfeed in where it is safer to do so.

Also as an aside a woman can be on the verge of malnutrition and still breastfeed a baby as the body produces amount of milk based on frequency of the baby on the breast and not whether you had three square meals a day. Longitudinally the quality of milk in terms of proteins etc might become compromised but a baby would not be dehydrated.

@bubblesforlife

I am sorry to hear about your experiences but your opening post is incredibly ill informed. Why are you so angry about breastfeeding and breastmilk.?be angry about the factors behind why this happened to you. That is not the act of breastfeeding or breast milk.

This is such a complex issue.

I understand why the NHS is pushing "breast is best". Nutritionally, breastmilk is better than formula and this has not in the recent past been widely accepted or understood.

BUT every mother is different and every baby is different and establishing breastfeeding is bloody difficult for many! The NHS doesn't have the capacity or resources to keep all new mothers in hospital until breastfeeding is properly established. I think there's a move to set up more out of hospital support - feeding hotlines, workshops, and visits from lactation consultants - to try and provide the necessary help in a more cost-effective way.

At the same time, it's important that support for breastfeeding doesn't stigmatise the use of formula. New mothers have enough to contend with without experiencing guilt or judgment for feeding their babies.

*and of course tongue tie in babies either posterior or anterior resulting in ineffective latching and milk uptake as well as agony for the mother.

@imisscashmere

This is such a complex issue.

I understand why the NHS is pushing "breast is best". Nutritionally, breastmilk is better than formula and this has not in the recent past been widely accepted or understood.

BUT every mother is different and every baby is different and establishing breastfeeding is bloody difficult for many! The NHS doesn't have the capacity or resources to keep all new mothers in hospital until breastfeeding is properly established. I think there's a move to set up more out of hospital support - feeding hotlines, workshops, and visits from lactation consultants - to try and provide the necessary help in a more cost-effective way.

At the same time, it's important that support for breastfeeding doesn't stigmatise the use of formula. New mothers have enough to contend with without experiencing guilt or judgment for feeding their babies.

I agree it is a complex issue

However, all this judging stuff is a bit 🙄

who in real life is judging anyone? Really?
I’ve never been judged for breastfeed in public. I’ve never been judged for pushing my toddler along in buggy while he or she chugged a bottle of milk. I’ve never been judged by anyone for buying a bottle of ready made aptamil and giving it to my child.

People need to stop obsessing over the relevance of their decisions to other people in terms of feeding their bloody babies and just get on with their lives. Stop caring about what your choice might say about you to someone else because when the chips are down that person doesn’t give a shit and has no jurisdiction over your life in this context anyway.

I'm sorry this has happened, I remember the early days well and feeding is so very stressful.

However, like another poster I was also really pressured into feeding my baby formula by the midwives who visited me at home, as baby was not gaining weight. As it was my 2nd baby I held firm (actually had to lie to them that I was giving formula!) as I knew it was normal for a dip in weight. Over a year on and I am still BF.

Having said that - don't get caught up in the whole 'breast is best' thing. I think it's a toxic narrative and you do what is best for you and your baby. I bottle fed baby number 1 after 3 months and it made zero difference - apart from better sleep!!

I promise that in a few years time when you look back at the debate between bottle feeding / BF you'll think - what was all that about?! It becomes completely irrelevant after a few months.

All the best with new baby!

I'm a paediatrician and sadly this is not rare. Most babies are picked up by the day5 weight and don't come to serious harm but a few can do. (I have seen seizures, Strokes/blood clots and high jaundice level brain damage).

Breast milk IS nutritionally and immunologically superior. However there is a BIG benefit in going from starved to formula fed and only a SMALL EXTRA benefit from formula fed/mixed fed to exclusively breast fed. Early malnutrition has life long impacts on metabolism.

The first few days can see a mismatch in supply/demand. Most babies will be grumpy but ok, some won't. Before formula an established mother in the community would support and perhaps feed the baby if required. Now we would use formula if the baby is compromised. There are downsides in terms of gut flora and also that once off the wagon people can lose the will to persist with breast feeding but some babies need the formula (or donated milk). Some babies with medical conditions also need eg higher calorie milks.

The honour badge of "exclusively breast feeding" and guilt from not doing this is becoming really damaging - have seen so many distraught readmitted mothers who were made to feel like failures.

(Personally - Breast fed for a year but gave 2 bottles in early days due to jaundice borderline for light therapy and expressed and gave breast milk in a bottle once a day from early on so other family members could use bottles if I was unavailable at any point prior to weaning - eg back to work at 7m or if ill).

DS was checked for tongue tie, more than once. Our feeding was observed over and over for days. The latch was good, the position was good. When we were readmitted I was told to express so I did. I was producing good volumes so that wasn't the issue either. I physically could have continued to express.

The first time they topped him up with formula I sobbed and sobbed, I had absorbed a lot of toxic opinions, primarily from Mumsnet. I cried to my husband that DS "wasn't a cow and shouldn't have cows milk". I felt like an absolute failure. DS however was content, for the first time in the first week of his life his tummy was full and he wasn't hungry. He slept happily in his little plastic cot. I then turned into a milk machine, expressing every 2/3 hours and storing the milk in the fridge. Then taking the pump apart and sterilising it for next time. I had a small amount of sleep before we got up to do it again. To save time we were advised that DH should feed DS my expressed milk.

I didn't feed my son for days, I just produced milk that DH fed to him. Practically it made sense as it was the only way we all got a little sleep. Emotionally it was devastating, I'd gone from being the only person to feed DS to never feeding him. I came home and continued to express, it was so hard. My mum came over one night and I just broke down, she promptly (but kindly) told me to stop being ridiculous, how I fed DS was neither here nor there, so long as he was happy and fed that was what mattered. It still took another couple of days of soul searching until I decided to make the switch to formula.

I suffered horribly with the guilt, that I had failed him, that I was lazy and had given up too easily (fuelled by comments like the ones on this thread).

DS is now 14 months, looking at him and the other children at his nursery I could never tell who was breastfed and who wasn't. I'm recovering counselling to help me with a lot of feeling stirred up by the birth of DS and the guilt that I didn't do the right thing is still there.

I had problems breast feeding too DS1 would not start feeding at all I was in hospital 10 days with him and he had to be fed by tube into his stomach as he would not suck he ended up in the special unit, once he began breast feeding i was constantly worried that my milk would dry up as he would not take a bottle it was very stressful. DS2 started feeding very well but had a pyloric stenosis and needed surgery at about 2 weeks my milk dried up because i was not regularly feeding and was not advised to express. DD1 again would not take to the breast and was not interested in sucking this time i was discharged after the birth and sent home so i just used a bottle as i was so stressed about her not feeding well and got no support. All my babies had jaundice. Looking back i wish i had made more effort with feeding them myself but i don't think there was enough support given to me, they are grown up now and are all healthy.

Breast is definitely best BUT. I was pressurised by midwives and health visitors for 3 weeks. After emergency caesarean and complications (2 weeks in hospital) I had little milk and baby lost far too much weight. Took my dr to say stop being an idiot and bottle feed or you will both be back in hospital. Depressing to hear mums are still being bullied.

@peasoup8 if the shoe fits?
Everyone is entitled to their opinion. There is some lazy mums out there, then there are the mums that don't unfortunately get the support they need. Not saying the Op is either of these.
It's very important which milk a baby drinks I think and with the right support the majority of mums should be able to breastfeed. Whether they want to or not is indeed another matter.

@bubblesforlife have you requested to speak to someone from infant feeding team?

I really urge you to do so as they are a great help and are the specialists in spotting tongue ties which can effect milk transfer.

Posterior tongue ties are very often missed only a specialist can identify them. Infant feeding team or equivalent run the clinics and are experts.

Keep expressing, offering boob and top ups your doing fab.
I have been there myself with feeding issues I had to be pretty insistent (I even refused to be discharged til I saw infant feeding team - my son had a 90% TT)

Breastfeeding is hard to set up. Nothing wrong with FF either if it's what you want to do or combi feed but need to be careful with balance. If they haven't told you you need to do 1 pump session between 1-3am it's the golden time to increase supply and you get very rich milk as well as around 6/7am. Milk supply and makeup changes through the day.

Sorry this happened to you. The same thing happened to me (I had my baby during the first lockdown) - he ended up dehydrated and had to have phototherapy for jaundice - it was horrendous.
If you do want to continue breastfeeding you can do. Once we were home and my milk had come in, we stopped topping up with formula and he's now still breastfed at 8 months old.

No point getting over emotional about it. Do whatever's best and forget what anyone else is doing.

For what it's worth, my milk took a while to come in because we were on antibiotics. I topped up with formula and then weaned her off it to be EBF. I would have carried on FF if that hadn't worked. No need for drama either way.

People get so weirdly het up about feeding.

Breast milk is a fantastic source of nutrition for a baby and mum. This is undisputed.
For many, breast feeding works without experiencing a situation like mine. For others it does not work.

I’m pro breastfeeding. I read the books, watched the videos etc etc. Nowhere did they tell me to keep an eye out for signs of dehydration. Or that breast fed babies tend to have jaundice more than formula babies (the stats are out there if you want to look that up).
It’s apparent to me now that my baby is jaundiced and this may be partially because colostrum, while amazing for babies, does not meet a hungry baby’s appetite. It does not hydrate them. To improve jaundice you need to give baby lots of fluids to flush it out of their system. My milk came in on day 3, yet my baby already has lost a pound in weight...
Had the risks/signs that I should have looked out for we’re talked about more, perhaps
I wouldn’t be in this hospital bed.
I believed the messaging when they said I was doing the best for my baby. It is why I wasn’t identifying issues with my baby immediately, because I knew no different.

The issue here is not to breast feed or not to breast feed. It’s what do you need to do to ensure your baby’s health needs are met. I’m an example of where breast milk did not cut the mustard immediately. I’m happy to take medical advice for the health of my baby. I need to give my baby a specified amount of milk to hydrate and nourish. That’s all I care about right now; my babies health.

What does breast is best even mean?
Many posters here have different perspectives on it.

Breast is best to nourish your baby?
Breast is best to hydrate your baby?
Breast is best to benefit mum?
Breast is best to enhance babies immune system?
Breast is best to keep baby healthy?

I could go on.

The goal for any mum is to feed and nourish their baby. If that’s breast milk alone, combined with formula or formula alone that’s fine. As long as baby is getting what it needs.

This needs to be talked about more. It’s too serious, babies lives can be on the line here.
Some amazing stories coming through of brave women sharing their experience. If this post alone educates 1 new mum about the other risks, hooray!

I hate how these threads always end up BF versus FF as though there are two warring camps.

I used formula after 6 months for my DDs, but chose to exclusively BF to 6 months. I then continued to around 2 years each time. I'm not against formula and certainly am pro breastfeeding.

What I am is against is the fact some people are so against BF mothers who do it successfully. I can only assume they think they judge others for not doing the same or something. I can say hand on heart that I couldn't care less how someone else feeds their baby, as long as it is done safely.

There is a lot of unresolved guilt and actual anger here. I would say that no one makes you feel guilty, not breast feeding mothers, not midwives, not forums. Only you can make yourself feel that way. Please make peace with the decision that was right for your circumstances and dont let it hang over you.

Yeah I had a weird experience too. Desperately wanted to breastfeed because it's associated (key word) with positive health outcomes further down the line, but my poor baby screamed and screamed and fed and screamed and eventually even the midwives couldn't get her to stop after taking her off me one night - until they have her formula. She guzzled it and was then content. I left hospital determined to keep bf and the same thing happened. Even got a private lactation consultant out and everyone was telling me to keep going but my daughter only seemed satisfied after formula. Then when I stopped trying to bf when she was about three weeks old, j was told to prepare for swollen engorged boobs - didn't happen at all. I think I had a supply issue but no-one was willing to see the obvious they were all so determined for me to bf. Once we started giving formula regularly that's when my baby started feeding and seeming satisfied.