Have I just accidentally insulted another mum?

[LowFatMilkshake]

We have new neighbours with a little boy(4) who is in DD(3)'s group at pre-school. I have started chatting to the mum and we had them over today for a playdate. They had one first at their house.

I find her little boy quite precoscious(sp) dominating of his mum, always butting in with "excuse me" and when he doesnt get his own way "mummy dont ignore me" (she was'nt she just wanted him to cross the road at the crossing not near the sweet shop).

Anyway today they had been watching TV for about 10 minutes when they decided to go back into the garden. I said I would turn the TV off and DD said "no mummy" to which I replied - maybe you can have it on later. She agreed and went outside. His mum remarked on how well DD had taken my 'instruction' (for want of a better word). But I did'nt think anything of it - it's just normal behavour in our house. DD made a point I made mine we agreed and that's that. But she questioned it further so I said to the other mum I was pretty strict with DD and dont tolerate misbehaviour at home as I am mortified when DD misbehaves when we are out so set good rules for everywhere - to the point where some of my friends threaten to leave their DC's with me when they are naughty . Then I wondered if by saying this I had insinutated that she was too leniant on her DS?? Especially after her DS's behaviour at our house.

Dont get me wrong DD can be a monkey and is no angel, but while he was here he sat on my sofa picking his nose. He climed over a sleeping baby DS to get at the cat, knocking over hot tea on himself, DS changing bag and the sofa, not to mention falling on DS. He demanded a new top, which I got for him (luckily DD has some unisex t'shirts). Then when they both went in the garden got wet socks he demanded dry ones - again DD has white sports socks which I provided. I gave him crisps and a drink and he asked for more. And not once unless prompted by his mum did I get a please or thankyou. And she did'nt seem overly bothered by his behaviour.

I really like his mum, but I hate to see parents being bossed around by children and following this behaviour am dreading the next time they come round. What makes it worse is he and DD play together at pre-school and I can hear his speech coming out in her with "excuse me" and "actually" and "I'll just do XXX" and worst of all "mum" - she is 3 and I want to be mummy for at least another year or so it's driving me nuts!

Am I a boot camp mum who has insulted a new friend or would you find some of his behaviour unacceptable.

Same thought occurred to me Boysontoast

HMC - glad its not just me.

Thanks for your replies - nice to see a mixed response. Was a bit shocked to see I was thought of as judgmental - am not judging the mum, but I suspoose it's the boys behavour and his constant interuption of his mums conversations and demand for her attention that got to me. But she did say he had always been a mumy's boy and used to her 24/7 where as DH and I have been able to share care because of our jobs so DD is more indpendant of me.

Also as I said in the OP DD is no angel and we regularly have little moments. But when we are with company I expect her to show respect and use her manners. I dont for one moment think she will be a "a well-behaved rule-follower who doesnt neccessarily stand up for themselves nor ever risk anything or do anything different or exploratory in life" in fact we encourage her to think and act for herself. She can demonstrate this by way of picking her own outfits and gettng washed and dressed and getting her own breakfast and if we're not quick enough going and prparing DS's clothes for him that day too!

I love my litle girl with all my heart and know the LB mummy is the same with him, I guess it's just diffrent parenting styles and I need to re-adjust my expectaiotns of other peoples childrens behaviour.

But for the record the "excuse me" although said in the rigt context is followed by a "mummy be quiet I am talking now" - still can't get used to that and dont want DD to copy!

i have a lovely ds who would have asked for the new clothes if he got the others wet- dunno what it is but he hates being in wet clothes.
i am pretty strict tbh, but wouldn't have thought another mother would have thought to comment on the clothes thing.
He would have a melt down if the TV got turned off "randomly" without a countdown and needs cajoing inot stuff too.
I have a friend who has the mopst challeneging dd the nsame age, and i don't really think it is due to her parentling style- just her dd's personality.

It's not just different parenting styles. It's different children.

I am another one with one paragon of social niceties and one thug.

I did'nt mind providing a new top or socks, but was not prepared for him to throw a wet sock a me and say "put this in the wash" which is exactley what he said to his mum when he took his top off and threw it at her.
DD takes of wet clothes and say's oh no mummy has to wash it, but it's not an order!

personality my arse.

do as i say - i am parent.

dont interupt IT IS RUDE.

however sometimes i think some people dont parent as they normally would when i am in the room becuase what they do behind closed doors ( above) is somehow not well recieved in open society for somereason - you speak sternly to your children? !!! OMG shock horor - i thought you shopped at Boden and didn't live in social housing - ie - i thouht you were a good parent.

anyway point is - i find some parents being more lenient in the open for fear of being judged.

i always found that my kids cottoned on to this rather quickly ( ie in church was a nightmare) the cotton on to the places where you won't be cross een if they are naughty.

I believe you just have to make that nowhere.
not even in church. NO MERCY! naughty in supermarket, naughty in church naughty in living room - all same to me .

i once had a 13 year old girl interrupt whilst i was talking to her grandmother - her grandmother thought this girl was the new jesus and shat gold.

and i said " excuse me i'm talking, i will speak to you when i am finished"

the girl was dumbstruck - first time in 13 years - as was the granny

I really think you need to think hard about whether this is a friendship you want to pursue, for everybody's sake. You've clearly taken against this child and that isn't a great way to establish a genuine friendship with his mother.

I used to think that ds good behaviour was due to my wonderful parenting.

Untill i had dd

Now i realise it's just luck...like babies who sleep. i'm pretty consistent in terms of standards of behaviour with both of em. They are just have different personalities (thank gawd)..i bet it has less to do with parenting styles than you imagine.
Agree with Pruni...Think 'There for the grace'...and thank your lucky stars that you have at least one fairly compliant child.

I remember (DS1 was about 6 months) there was a big MN debate on smacking. One mum pointed out that whatever discipline methods you use at home, they must be transportable out to the big bad world. Best bit of advice I've read. The rules I make at home are the same in the supermarket etc. I do feel a teeny bit self-concious doing 'stern mum' in public, but the up side is that DS1 always knows where he stands. Unlike when he's out and about with DH, who is too emabarrassed to discipline him.

PMSL Trout

I must admit - trying not to judge here. When we went to boys house his mum had a man in the loft doing some surveying or something and LB asked to look, bearing in mind the loft ladder is next to staris, one fall and they are on the ground floor sort of thing! And she let him go up - going behind him obviously - then she asked if DD wanted to. What could I say? If I said I thought it was dangerous I would be indirectly commentingon her parental actions so i said as long as she was behind DD - luckily DD got up 3 steps and decided it wasn't for her. LB hoewver told his mummy to go up there and describe it for DD!

Later he asked to play in the front garden - which is not enclosed and is nothing more than a driveway really and again she let him and we went to supervise. He asked to do the same at our house but as I was not prepared to carry DS out and stand around while they hunted for ladybirds I said no and sent them back in to the back garden where I could see them through the window!

Am I being unreasonable in thinking that LB gets to do anything he wants, and mum makes it posibble by giving up what ever she is doing to follow him around and watch and clear-up etc etc, he seemed to treat her more like hired help than a mummy - I mean some rules are set because as IANCH said we are the parent they are the child and because safety and boundaires to a point are necessary.

Bugger off custy. I speak sternly to my children. I am not afraid of hauling them out of places if they are misbehaving. And I don't give a toss who sees. But ds takes to it more quickly than dd. That's how it is. But I'll break her yet

Bet ya wish you never started this thread, LFMS! I agree with you. I have a similar stance on behaviour and some of my friends have suggested their kids come to my house for a week to learn to behave! I looked after a little chap once, whose mother said to me 'he just wants to sit and watch tv, really' 'Not on my shift he won't, I said'! Altimately, there's not much you can do about it really, either put up with it or cut the friendship, which clearly is going to be difficult as you are neighbours! I don't think you will have offended her either. That's my opinion, but hey, I was slated last week for expecting a 3 year old to say please & thankyou!!

Mrflowerpot at you comment about taken against the child - you might have hit a nerve there

The thing is he plays wonderfully with DD - none of his attitude is directed at her at all, just his mum - and me (re the sock thing and asking for more crisps and juice etc)

• but could this be the dad's attitude towards women coming accross??

You're not 'trying not to judge'. You're having a lovely time judging - we all do from time to time.
If she wants to let him do things that you think are too dangerous, then isn't that up to her? Perhaps she figures it is better to supervise him going up a ladder than saying no and risking him trying to do it by himself when her back is turned?
Just as it is of course up to you whether you let your dd play with him or not.

I think he was incredibly clever to ask his mum to go & describe it for dd!! Most kids I know wouldn't have thought of that!!

No I would put the ladder back up in the loft! Out of reach, out of site, out of mind! The clmbing frame at pre-school is for safe climbing, as is the clmbing frame at the park!

I dont want to end thier friendship because he and DD play really well together - but if it's his dad's attitude towards women coming accross - you're right do I want to encourage it to where in years to come they date each other........

Also I like his mum when she is not working for her son!!!

Okay yes I am judging now!

Sorry, that came out harsher than I meant it to. I just feel really sorry for the little boy.
There are all sorts of reasons why he might be being like this with his mum - he might be unsettled by moving or the new pre-school, he might be having the big hormone rush that boys have at this sort of age, he might just be realising he's not the centre of the universe for the first time and trying to reassert himself. If he plays well with dd and other children then I would tend to think this is phase or a reaction to something. My ds went through a horrible rude phase at 4 when dd was born and we moved house - he was just really angry with me I think about all the changes in his life.

What's wrong with the boy asking for a drink?? Jesus!! My dd asks for drinks everywhere we go!!

I encourage her to speak up, ask for what she wants. He's a little boy, not a hand puppet.

ah, you've never had a climber then...

seriously, ds could find something to climb in an empty square room with slippery walls.

if we lose him, we look up.

can I make a massive generalisation and say boys are hugely different to girls?

when my friends come round with their boys it is like a whirlwind has invaded my house

they play differently and are more boisterous (sp?) than girls, my two make things with Megabloks (and fight), the boys throw them round the room

one is not better than the other, it just is

imo anyway

and I think you are being a tad judgemental, these are children of 3 and 4 so cut a bit of slack

ok

have read more now and will leave the thread or I may post rude words

x

Okay - firstly I have a baby boy - so could be swallowing all my words in a few years!

Secondly it's not what he does or says it's the way he does and says it.

Thirdly - yes DD is a climber and a jumper, but just because she asks to do something I see as dangerous - doesnt me I let her do it. From a climbing frame to a sponge mat or foam floor is one thing. From the back of the sofa to the floor is one thing. But from the ceiling on the second floor to the floor of the ground floor is another!

Fourthly - had not though about him in terms of accepting changes ot his life - and now feel slightly bad His mum was telling me he had never had a best friend until a couple of month before they moved.
And she had never had him in a routine where he atended any set groups and she now has him in two.

Still would'nt accept his behaviour if he was mine though - might not be able to change it but would definatley show my unhappiness at it!

I'm sure there are plenty of mums who don't say no enough to their children, and this mum could be one of them. On the other hand... children shouldn't always have to play in the same back garden over and over again and do their only climbing on safe climbing frames. Was there really a very good reason for the mum to say no to a chance to play in the front garden, other than the fact that it needed supervision and was therefore perhaps a bit inconvenient? The same goes for the ladder - it may be inconvenient for an adult to have to stand behind the child but it's an experience for the child that all goes to add a bit of richness and learning about the world to their life. I agree about the little boy being clever to suggest his mum describes the loft for your dd.

You may be right that the other mum didn't jump fast enough on her sun for speaking a bit rudely, or not as fast as the average person might, but as far as the other things go tbh I'd much rather give my child those experiences if I can.