If you met someone with a limp

[ilean]

would you comment on it?

Thinking of insensitive people, I had a very young doctor come to check out DD2 so we could go home after I had given birth.

He read my notes and said "Oh I see you have such and such a condition. I haven't come across many cases. Mind if I examine you for my own edification?"

So there I was, full of pride in my new DD and someone felt the need to remind me of my difference and my disability again.

DH didn't quite use the words "Fuck Off..."

For his own 'edification'?

What a prick.

I used to get paid for med students to diagnose me

Melta, I also think you're wrong on this.

I don't have a limp, but I wear hearing aids and prefer people not to comment on them. They might be unusual to you, but they're not to me, they're my "normal" and I don't have any desire to discuss them.

Yes, disabilities are a non-ignorable part of the disabled person's life. But they don't need to be verbally 'acknowledged' as you put it in every social interaction.

I'm glad you feel you can 'see past it (the disability) and see the person' But how about being less hung up about the disability altogether. There's nothing to see 'past'. Disabilities are just part of the normal variety of the human condition.

ilean my first point was chiefly referring to the 'never mention anything negative' argument upthread. Not that I want to judge how people feel about their disability! But not mentioning anything that anybody could feel negative about, sort of would stop all conversation wouldn't it?
And actually that was exactly my point, I don't want to pretend it doesn't exist.

"And to think as you do is to deny or silence the experience of the person you are looking at. Or the difference between external and internal experience, iyswim. Someone's disability is not negative per se, no, but I have no doubt that for many it is a difficult experience and one they would choose to be without in a heartbeat. It is insulting not to appreciate and be sensitive to that, as it is to unfairly discriminate, in my opinion."

That's exactly what I mean! If it is 'unmentionable', then aren't I doing exactly that, denying your reality?

I am truly looking for ways I as an able bodied person can talk to less able bodied people without either dismissing their reality, or making assumptions about it. My hunch is to ask open questions, which allow easy exits, not forcing anyone to talk about things constantly. But not making it their exclusive business either (as in, it is of no concern to me that you are in pain). That would be uncaring. I do care about other people. Nor pretending it doesn't exist.

I was unreasonably excited too! I'm normally a lurker, and shy away from posting but with a mention of the little mermaid I couldn't resist.

No, I wouldn't ask. I honestly don't think I'd be that interested. After all, it's either something someone was born with, or the result of illness or injury. I don't need to know which one.

Sorry I have to go now but will be back. Not running. I am really trying and am grateful for you to help educate me.

I have to go too, bossy britches DD is up from her nap - she certainly doesn't give a rat's ass about my limp

I am finding the thread very helpful, thank you all and will be back later

Meita I do think you are entirely missing the point, I agree entirely with drivens very well written post, I will think some more this afternoon and get back to you. But really I think it comes down to just being rude to assume that you have the right to talk about something you can observe in another person. Of course this doesn't mean it is never appropriate! but your assumption is wrong.

destructo I am usually the opposite, commenting left right and centre, I am very glad I delurked you

Depending on the circumstances I might ask if I needed to do anything differently to make the place/event properly accessible.

No I wouldn't comment or ask. I'd assume if they wanted to tell me they would.
My colleague has a limp which yes I have noticed, I've worked with her for four years and never mentioned it. What for?

Meita, you seem a little hung up on other people's disabilities. I doubt even my lifelong friends could put a name to my condition, it is just not something we generally need to discuss.

You can offer to carry someone's shopping or give up your seat without overtly commenting on their disability, any more than you would comment on their big nose.

But Meita why do you think they would even want to talk about "their reality" with you, who (like me) probably have very little understanding of it? With a close friend or family member, it would be different. But with a new or casual acquaintance, I'm sorry but it just seems incredibly patronising and condescending to me.

I have a limp on and off due to arthritis. I don't mind friends asking it even if I get in a conversation with someone but it's uncomfortable if someone I don't really know asks. It's quite personal and I feel like I'm explaining myself to people I don't know in those circumstances.

It seems as though in your desire to be "cool" and "understanding" and "politically correct" in your open-minded and non-discriminatory treatment of people, you are actually in danger of forgetting basic manners.... intrusive questioning....

I just think it's very presumptious to mention someone's limp in order to prove you don't see disability as being negative.

It would be on a par with asking someone I didn't know very well why their marriage broke up. Obviously there's nothing wrong with being divorced but I have no idea how sensitive a subject it is to them. Just none of my business.

ilean - just an idea, but perhaps when people ask you about your limp you could say something like "oh I'm so glad you noticed! It's taken me years to perfect it!"
It could be fun to see how they respond to that. But you might not want to of course.

My disability is an excellent twat detector, goes without saying.

But thinking about Meita's comments, the level at which I will discuss my disability is also an indicator of how close I am to the person.

So DP, DCs, DSis and Mum: Full on black humour with an occasional side of self pity.

Very close friends, maybe half a dozen of them: Generally a stiff upper lip but a full and frank discussion if someone suggests we do something outside my physical limits.

Schoolgate Mums, people at church: Determinedly upbeat disposition. Helpful noises of sympathy deflected with a cheery remark.

Random nosy people: Fuck off to the far side of fuck.

I wouldn't dream of mentioning another person's limp unless they brought it up in conversation.

This is quite a thought provoking thread - thank you for raising it. My ds has a hearing aid and when he first got it I encouraged him to show his/my friends as I wanted him to feel positive about it. Now it's just part of the routine and we don't really talk about it much day to day but I do often have to tell new people (e.g. he is starting tennis lessons tonight and I will have to tell them so if he can't hear them they know he isn't being rude or naughty!) At the moment he's pretty cool with the whole thing but there is plenty of food for thought for me here about how he might feel about it as he gets older so thank you.

It's also reminded me of the time I stopped in Victoria station to see if a blind woman who looked rather disorientated needed any help. She said yes I'm fine - that's very kind of you but I was just trying to listen to the announcer so I know which platform I need

Melta - I applaud you for not getting defensive and cross with us all for disagreeing with you, which is a rare talent in life on MN.

But I am genuinely perplexed why the fact of people's disabilities is so meaningful to you that you feel such a need to discuss them?

I have a friend who I think is a bit like you. He discovered that I wore hearing aids about 5 years into our friendship (had my hair tied back, unusually, and he saw them). That was a few years ago, and ever since, he seems to be utterly obsessed with them. Every time I see him (only a few times a year as we live a long way apart), he finds a way of mentioning them, fussing over them, crowbarring them into the conversation. It bemuses me. I have worn hearing aids for more than 40 years, if everyone I have ever met was like him, I would have gone insane with boredom and irritation by now. My friend is a lovely, caring person, he just seems unable to help himself or to see the reality of what he is doing.

Can I ask: if you meet someone and notice/discover they're single / divorced / gay / childless / red-haired - or any other fact that is normal, but can be perceived or experienced negatively by some people - then do you feel the need to 'acknowledge their experience' and ask lots of 'open questions'? I am curious as to why disabilities are a particular interest.

Can you not just get to know people with visible disabilities in the same way you get to know people without them (or with invisible ones)? When I meet new people I generally just chat on neutral topics. Sometimes we feel a connection and gradually get to know each other better over time, and as that happens, we both venture into more personal territory, each leaving it to the other to broach anything they want to about themselves.

But perhaps I'm strange?

I've never commented on someone's limp. None of my business.

A work colleague once mentioned that her hip would be excluded from the company medical plan - until that point I hadn't consciously thought of her as having a limp, although I was of course aware that her gait was unusual.

If I may interject with nothing helpful whatsoever.....

Unattractive due to a limp? May I point out Dr Gregory House??? Limped like a good 'en and hotter than holy hell!

I see no reason why this logic should not apply to you. Go forth and consider yourself hotter than holy hell.

As you were.

I don't think any of us limpers have said that we are unattractive.

I am only using this stick so that I have something to beat off my admirers with.

I was also going to point out that the character from ER that the OP referred to (Kerry Weaver) became a much more rounded and sympathetic one in later series but it seemed a little beside the point

Tinkly, OP did. At 12.16.