I have just tipped my 3yo Dd1's supper over her head.

[Orchardbeck]

Not one of my finest moments, I have to say. I'm certainly not proud of the fact. She refused to eat it so I calmly tipped it over her head, gravy, the lot.

Dd1 has been refusing to eat meals for some time, I know it is a control issue as we are having other problems (tantrums, ignoring etc etc). I also have Dd2 who is 9 months and eating well (same meals just mashed or chopped well). She just sits there and either makes cheeky comments or shouts over me. I am at the end of my tether.

I make meals that I know Dd1 loves - she was previously an adventurous eater but now just picks and takes hours to finish a meal, and only with coaxing and threats of no pudding etc.

Tonight was sausage casserole, made with home raised pork and vegetables out of the garden, so not only do I feel bad about doing this, it was particularly painful to see it go to waste like that (DH's face was a picture, but he backed me up whether he agreed with it or not , bless him).

She has now been showered and sent to bed with nothing more to eat. She is very eloquent for her age (3 1/4 yo) and has been from age 1, she used to be so well behaved and a joy to have around.

Obviously I was worried about her reaction to dd2, but she loves her to pieces. She just takes other people off to one side to get their full attention - it can be overwhelming for them sometimes.

I know she is rebelling because I have to dedicate attention to her younger sister, plus my OH is a farmer and works all hours so it's just me looking after them. She goes to pre school 2 mornings per week.

What can I do? Is it a phase? Have I crossed a massive line?

SquigletPie no one is "abusing" the OP (a poor choice of word in this circumstance). Criticism has been levelled, sympathy expressed and advice given and the OP is hopefully sitting there (presumably without a plate of cold dinner dripping down her face) taking a long hard look at herself and the situation. She might regret posting on MN (I hope she doesn't) but she is probably regretting her actions a LOT more which is how it should be.

'rabbitrisen' sadly some posters feel that unless you pile the OP with abuse and negativity you're not taking the issue seriously

Oh I see. Oh dear.

She might regret posting on MN (I hope she doesn't)

That is a bit the rub.

Who is going to want to, about this sort of issue, after this thread.

I think this thread has reached its natural conclusion. Most people have concluded that the action was fairly bad - some people are appalled, some less so - some helpful advice has been given to the OP, and a lot of speculation about abuse and arguing about it has gone on. Is that about it in a nutshell? Not sure what anyone can add that is helpful. I think the OP will have got the message about this being an unacceptable thing to do tbh While I agree with some of the comments made regarding concern about others minimising a fairly awful way of treating a child, I Think The Point Has Been Made. Perhaps we should move on, or stick to offering helpful advice, or delete the thread??

getanotherloan, Is it a poor choice of words? I'm infering from your post you think the OP has 'abused' her child but verbal insults don't count as abuse because the OP deserved it (in your opinion)?

I can't help but think that struggling to cope with a child's behaviour could be seen as a mental health issue: stress, anxiety, depression and anger management.

But isn't that the thing: we recognise depression, stress and anxiety and exhibit sympathy but people find anger management issues distasteful so don't see them as mental health issues but rather just being a bad person?

aargghhh!!

Behind a wall of anonymity on an internet forum an anonymous poster has been criticised for doing something that she herself knows was wrong and that she herself obviously regrets.

She volunteered this information I presume, to receive FEEDBACK. At no time did she prefix her OP with "please only post if you don't think what I did was that bad". She was big enough to admit what she did on a public forum so I assume she was big enough to take what came. No one has called her "evil" or a child abusER but people have said, at worst, the act itself was abusive and that she needs to get some outside help.

The OP is obviously isolated, feeling trapped and under pressure and I think she posted to get some reaction that she's not getting in real life. This reaction is appearing as words on a computer screen from people she will never knowingly meet and who don't know her from Adam. She has received HONEST responses and not just a stream of meaningless platitudes. I think that's going to be uncomfortable for her to read at times but mostly useful.

Job done. MN doing what it does best.

What she needs now is to digest what she's read and speak to someone in real life who can give her the help and support she and her family needs.

I have experienced this first hand my dad pushed my face into a bowl of mashed potato as I was fussing and not eating dinner ( I was a fussy eater apparently), I was 4 and remember it well he didn't let my mum wash me before I was sent to bed. The humiliation will never be forgotten I only hope your daughter forgives you as I haven't forgotten it or think I ever will (I'm 32 now btw) hope you don't think this is something to do regularly and if you feel out of control like that again maybe leave the room for a few mins and take a breath before subjecting your child to this absue - and yes it is abuse btw.

so I assume she was big enough to take what came.

But what about those that are not?

The op has been very brave to post what she did.
Most people are not brave, and will not come anywhere near this forum on this sort of issue, based on this thread.

What becomes of them and their children?

A sad story mrsprinceharry

My dad done this to me when I was 5 with a plate of spaghetti and my mother just sat there saying 'we'll you should have ate your dinner'. Reading this thread makes my eyes sting remembering how humiliated and small I felt. You should be ashamed of yourself and so should the people who think this is no big deal. If people on this thread have made you feel even worse then good, you should feel bad. My own two year old son is a terrible eater, he will literally go all day only having a yoghurt. As much as I get frustrated and despair I would never dream of doing this to him. And if not humiliating my child because I can't catch a grip of myself makes me one of the 'perfect parent' brigade then it's a badge I'm happy to wear. The sheer hypocrisy on this website is astounding, swap the word 'child' for 'partner' and you'll have no end of people telling you to leave the bastard, but swap the word 'partner' for 'child' and you'll get a merry chorus of people crawling up your backside telling you it's ok, you're stressed, be kind to yourself and your child will forget all about it In the morning.

SquigletPie what i meant was that the word "abusive* has been bandied around on this thread and no one can agree on what it is and what it isn't so perhaps it's best avoided?! There is no agreement that what the OP did was abusive, the actions of an abuser or that any of the criticisms levelled back at her were abusive IYSWIM??

I wholeheartedly agree with you that anger issues are on a par with anxiety, stress, depression etc. The important thing is to recognise when you are ill and to get help. The nature of the beast is that sometimes the person themselves does not accept or recognise that they have a problem and never gets that help.

I don't know enough about the OP to say anything other than, what you did is not acceptable, you sound like you are stressed out and you need to access some real life help, sooner rather than later.

OP apologised to her DD. No-one who has had a similar experience to OP's DD has mentioned that their parent apologised. My best guess is that the OP's DD won't be damaged by this, given all the other things the OP has told us.

My, usually gentle DM once made a horrible remark which stuck with me for a long time. Nevertheless I'm glad she was my mum - she wasn't perfect/made mistakes but she was a good mum.

So difficult to decide when a one-off incident of abusive is symptomatic of a need for help or when it's a symptom of the reality of parenting- ie that all parents make mistakes.

'You should be ashamed of yourself and so should the people who think this is no big deal'

Couldn't agree more. Some people on here don't seem to have any empathy whatsoever with children. Pretty terrifying from a bunch of (mostly) parents. And this example absolutely is abusive behaviour. The people talking about 'what real abuse looks like' need to take their blinkers off.

OP, this is something you need to get a grip on. Now. Never mind what your DD did, you need to focus on what you did and why you had to ask the question about whether or not you drew a line. As other posters have said, please speak urgently to your Health Visitor or local Children's Centre.

My concern over this isn't so much the incident itself - although I do think it's very far from OK, I guess we could all do something out of character at any given moment. It's the fact that OP's post was almost entirely about her DD's behaviour, eg 'is this just a phase?' If I had done this I would be mortified and my child's behaviour would not be my main reason for posting on mumsnet, my own behaviour would.

FWIW, my DS is an extremely fussy eater and his behaviour at the dinner table is very hard work - he and my DD are similar ages to OP's DCs. I have shouted at him in the past about it out of pure frustration, and I felt terrible and apologised to him and explained that it wasn't his fault. My DH finds it difficult at mealtimes and he sometimes can't sit with us because he finds it very hard to follow the approach of ignoring the non-eating.

A large part of fussy eating is attention seeking, IMO (along with a genuine fear of new foods sometimes). If you get emotional about their eating, you are rewarding them with attention and will make it worse.

OP I think you need to get some professional advice, not about your daughter but about controlling your own temper.

I agree, Jemima.

To the person who said three year olds have no concept of humiliation I was 3 or even 2 (can't remember) when my mum got angry with me for wetting the bed and smacked me with the wet sheet. I can still remember that episode as she rarely got angry and if I say so myself I was a good child and toddler (apparently I was fine as a toddler, rarely tantrummed). Having said that my mum had an alcoholic husband and not much support from her family. she was so concerned about this behaviour she went to see doctor who said nothing was wrong in doing it but I think she and the doctor had a good long talk. But yes, I certainly had a concept of humiliation at 2/3. I knew I'd sort of done something wrong and was terribly ashamed at wetting the bed.

No need for me to put the boot in with OP but it IS child abuse in my opinion but speak to Health Visitor, doctor etc if this behaviour concerns you, and the other comment about having mini daydreams about behaviour towards her is deeply concerning in my POV. Hope you get over this and feel better soon OP.

OP, I have read pretty much all of this thread.

What I haven't seen on it:
Is this the first time you have lost it like this?
What was your DD's reaction to you tipping food over her?
What was your reaction after you'd done it?
Have you ever done anything else similarly overreactionary?
Have you been assessed for PND?

While none of these will really mitigate what has happened, I do think they are questions that could do with answers.

I also think that the non-eating is a phase that she will eventually grow out of if you stop making it a battle. My best friend in this country has 4 DC, the youngest of whom started a beige food-only campaign when he was about 3. Prior to that he'd eaten everything, but his next in line brother had food allergies and other complicated development issues, that meant a lot of attention was focused on him - we think that may be why the youngest started this food-refusal campaign. He is now nearly 5 and has just started to come out of it, so you may have a long way to go with your DD1.

You say that she is lovely with your DD2 - and she might be, but it's possible that her outward behaviour and love for her sister are masking a hidden resentment at the amount of time her sister is taking up. You are obviously very busy, but do you have time, can you make time, when it is just you and her? Find something to do together that the baby isn't involved in, so that she feels she still has something of you all to herself.

I will add this - I have 2 DSs, DS1 is 6 and Ds2 is 18mo. My expectations of Ds1 have, at times, been ridiculously high simply because he is not a toddler, but because he is so much bigger than DS2 I expect him to behave in a far more grown up way, forgetting that he is still a very little boy at 6. I feel bad when I do this, it's something I have to control in myself, and constantly have to remind myself that he IS only 6 and that I mustn't get frustrated with him. Worse, I must not take out my frustration with the 18mo on him, something else I have been guilty of - can't tell the 18mo off as he doesn't understand, so I pick on DS1 instead. Bloody awful thing to do, and I know it. I have made great efforts to have time alone with Ds1, so that he knows I still have time for him as well as the very demanding 18mo.

Ah I see, sorry makes it all better doesn't it. And adult losing complete control with their 3yo is ok as long as they sorry

What a load of bollocks.

say sorry*

I have a 3 year old. Food is a constant battle with her. I panic sometimes before meal times as I don't know how she's going to react; tears, tantrum, plain refusal.

But I could never tip food over her head. She's sleeping on my lap now. She's a baby.

You're so in the wrong, if I knew you I would call SS.

Jesus.

Apologies, haven't RTFT.

My first thought is that it is not your DC that has control issues. It is you. I do not say that to stick the boot in, but because releasing yourself from the need to control is exactly what you need to do. The minute you enter into a battle of wills with a 3 year old, you lose.

A 3 year old will not starve themselves. Shrug your shoulders and clear away. Unless dc is so underweight they are of concern to doctors etc?

I do hope that you can forgive yourself and move on. It is shocking to read though, it is an abusive act. But you know this.

Well OP and specially the minimizing brigade:

How about your child tipping YOUR dinner over YOUR head.

Would you still feel the same.

Listen to all the people with REAL experience of similar ABUSE happening when they were children.

I keep wanting to leave this thread, but I cannot.

I , and I think it is the same for some of the others, are not minimizing, but putting it into perspective.

This thread is also on mumsnet and in the news at the moment.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/in_the_news/2064760-200-missing-Nigerian-schoolgirls

It doesnt take much stretch of the imagination to imagine what those girls are experiencing.

That is no way makes what OP did right, or indeed has anything to do with it

"I punched my child".

"Oh well thats ok..inother pkaces children ate being tor