what are the reasons for NO smacking?

[hermykne]

I AM CURIOUS to know, folling the other thread, as my dd is so bold at the moment nothing gets thru to her, even putting her in a time out room for 2/3mins, shes 3. she will keep on screaming and then hit something or push something over.
can last 40mins and no matter how you go over the matter with her when shes calm, she doesnt seem to learn anything,
and i suppose smacking will not make her understand either...
but what does smacking create or instill in behavourial patterns in yours opinions?

Bugsy - Some of the posts here are high and mighty and hysterical.

I'm far from perfect as a parent. My parents were far from perfect. Most parents are far from perfect...... or we wouldn't have programmes like "My Teens A Nightmare.... I'm Moving Out"!!! Thats the reality.... your post is the ideal.

sackache (not sure about your new name, btw, reminds me of symptoms at GUM clinic ..)

Oh Hunker I definitely don't think that!

Whilst I can, to a certain extent, see that smacking as carried out by QofQ and crunchie (and bloss in previous well argued posts) can be an effective form of discipline, I personally couldnever do it. I know that if I did not impose a complete no smacking rule on myself then there would be times when I would smack my children because of my frustration rather than their behaviour and try to justify it to myself. I do have a temper, which I manage (at times with difficulty and teethmarks in my bottom lip) to control, but I am sure that if I allowed smacking to be in my arsenal of parenting techniques it would be used far too often

Ack! Boundaries=smacking?!? I think NOT. I'm all for boundaries. As for loving-planned-controlled-smacking....TBH, the very notion gives me the creeps. Though I can understand lashing out and slapping a hand or leg under extreme circumstances/stress/fear - hope never to do it, don't think its the best way of dealing with anything, but that goes for a few things I've done in my life. I'd feel bad, though.

Prufrock - Very very true! My Mum smacked us out of sheer anger.

Oh come on, everyone who says they only smack 'with reason'. Want to know why I have a no-smacking rule? Well, yes, I think smacking is wrong - but also I'm perfectly aware that if I started smacking my children, I'd smack them just because I was tired, and they were playing up (ie being kids) and I was having a bad day, and all the other things that happen, in my experience, 98 per cent or so of the time when you have two children under five and not a lot of patience. I cannot count the number of times I've wanted to belt my kids, and that's not because they 'deserved' it so much as because I wanted to.

I would bet that all the most badly out of control kids in a secondary school class have been smacked far more often than those who are better behaved..

if reasoning doesn't "work" with a 2 year old ( and i am not sure i agree withh that btw, if something is explained in very simple terms) then howwould hitting her "work"? it's a genuine question. i think if i hit my 2 yo shewould be scared and bewildered and afraid but i don't see she would be disciplined as such or learn anything.
in extremis i have "shocked" her i suppose by raising my voice or removing her from a situation.

Cross-posted with Prufrock while I was deleting an over the top sentence about the odour of sanctity getting up my nose

No SackAche, my post is the way I deal with my children - not some airy, fairy ideal. I'm definitely not perfect - but I try my hardest to show my children how to be a good adult & that includes not smacking.
Sometimes, particularly with my son, it was really hard & meant alot of input from me but I'm sure the results have paid off. Now he is a bit older, he does stuff because I explain why - not because I hit him. Of course he kicks off from time to time - but he knows that I will carry out any sanction I threaten & usually that is enough to get a change in behavior.

you're right I bet zippi
and`fwiw i am very keen on discipline
smacking is not the same as discipline

Bugsy - I didn't SAY yours was airy fairy. Please don't put words in my mouth. I'm well aware that you were describing how YOU deal with your children..... I was merely pointing out that its not always the case that kids will respond as well to that.

By the way.... I have probably smacked ds's hand 10 times in his life. I don't need to do it get him to do something and I don't do it anymore, coz threatening to take toys away works now.

One extreme to another eh!! So it's either NO smacking.... or smacking everytime to discipline???? Don't fink so.

"but also I'm perfectly aware that if I started smacking my children, I'd smack them just because I was tired, and they were playing up (ie being kids) and I was having a bad day, and all the other things that happen, in my experience, 98 per cent or so of the time when you have two children under five and not a lot of patience."

I have (well had until a few weeks ago) 2 children under 5. And I've never smacked them because I was tired, or because I was having a bad day.

I HATE this idea that parents who smack only do so out of anger, or without thought, or because it's the "easy" thing to do..

"if you smack young children then you haven't built an atnosphere of trust but one of physical fear and it will come back to haunt you when you have teenage children who may decide to hit you back.."

my dad was still smacking me when I was about 13yrs old! But the thought of hitting either of my parents never crossed my mind even once! Think I was about 8 when my mum last smacked me

I said what I would do. Sounds as if Prufrock would too. Clearly you're a better person than me.

Psycho - Totally the opposite for us! Dad NEVER smacked us. But we were all MUCH more frightened of Dad than Mum. Mum would always say "Wait til your Dad gets home" and we would sh*t a brick....and all he would do was send us to our rooms after a good telling off!!!

Clearly most people on MN are a better person than me!!!! Not the only subject that makes me feel like that on MN! You'd think I'd be used to it by now.

Where on the earth does this idea that you hit a child and they think they can hit too come from???

I can count on 1 hand the number of fights I got into at school (and one of those neither of us wanted to have.....long story but it was the girliest fight you've ever seen as neither of us really wanted a fight LOL).

Yes I'm sure if a child is being beaten they may believe that hitting is "normal" - but there's a world of difference between giving a child a single smack on the leg (which doesn't even leave a mark) and beating the cr*p out of them!

but qoq do you think you would have resented your father less if he had tried harder to find effective ways of disciplining you rather than smacking

and do you think that your mother felt that she was better smacking you some of the time because otherwise your dad would do it

It hink sometimes one parent is a hrsher disciplinarian than they wish to be because their partner is very harsh

Zippi - Eh?? Nah you've stumped me with that one.

Incidentally - The last time my Mum smacked me I was 14.... stuck in a lift with her and called her a Nosy Cow. She slapped my face..... I slapped her back. The end.

oh and as for age - DS1 didn't get his first smack until he was about 2 1/2yrs old - old enough for us to explain what would happen if that particular behaviour continued, and for him to understand what we were saying when we talked about it afterwards.

DS rarely gets smacked these days (he's 5), infact one warning is usually enough, DS2 is still too young.

but HRHQoQ, do you not think that children mimic adult behaviour? I listen to my daughter parrot stuff that her carers at nursery say, that I say. I watch her tend to her baby doll in the same way that she sees other mums look after her baby.
My son does similar things, although being older uses his own terminology more.
So why shouldn't children mimic smacking too? How do you explain then that children shouldn't smack each other - but its ok for an adult to smack them?
Sorry, not trying to be sanctimonious or anything else, just can never understand why anyone would smack.