what are the reasons for NO smacking?

[hermykne]

I AM CURIOUS to know, folling the other thread, as my dd is so bold at the moment nothing gets thru to her, even putting her in a time out room for 2/3mins, shes 3. she will keep on screaming and then hit something or push something over.
can last 40mins and no matter how you go over the matter with her when shes calm, she doesnt seem to learn anything,
and i suppose smacking will not make her understand either...
but what does smacking create or instill in behavourial patterns in yours opinions?

Message withdrawn

Have a no smacking rule now (have smacked in the past) for same reasons as Prufrock and MI - I'd be smacking all the bloody time if I allowed myself to be a smacker.

not at all zippi - my dad was known to smack us AGAIN for things mum had already smacked us for! In addition to that it wasn't just the smacking that made my relationship with my dad pretty sour - I used to hate the way he shouted at mum when they had fights (mum would shout back but that never bothered me) and to this day I still have my suspicioins that he may have actually hit her at times.

Even to this day dad still never discusses how and when he smacked us (or even why). Mum quite freely talks about it, because she actually remembers what sort of things we got smacks for because she never smacked us out of anger......and as most of us know you hardly remember things said/done in anger.

Oh and dad worked away a lot/night shifts - so a lot of the time mum was the sole child carer. She's ALWAYS done things differently from him and never let his way of doing things influence her. She still thinks smacking is ok if done in a "in control" way.

so are you trying to say that children who aren't smacked don't hit other children, or grow up to get into fights when older???

No, I can conclusively say that HRHQoQ, but I don't think that is a very strong arguement for smacking children either.

my personal reason is that if I can control a class of 30 children without hitting them, then I can do the same with 2 children.

I wasn't making it an argument for smacking - I was merely asking whether children who have never been smacked grow up without getting into any fights, or without hitting other people??

Are were all the yobs and violent criminals in our jails smacked as children???

Agree with MI and Prufrock - if you have a 'no smacking' rule then you can't abuse a smacking policy, in the most testing of times.

Children definitely mimic what adults do. I've seen ds playing with dd's doll, doing a pretty accurate impression of the way I am with them.

HRHQoQ - in an earlier post I cited my mum's experience with me - at 12 months 'when spanked I hit back'. QED.

Ah now Puff.... thats very true! But there is no way I could control a class of 30 without using a cattle prod.

I not totally pro-smacking, but I still think the arguement can get a bit hysterical!! BIG difference between tapping the back of the hand and hitting so hard that there are handprints!! Sometimes people use the extreme in their argument to make it sound more dramatic!

typing disorder today - should be "No, I can't conclusively say that ....."

lol SackAche

Funnily enough in reply to all those who are scared once they start to smack they would do it more and more (yes you MI ) I found once I had smacked a really limited number of times and I swear it has been THAT infrequent, then the threat of a smack was enough. Now as my kids are older we are able better at communicating and reasoning, naughty step, star charts etc all work better on them. But between the ages of 2 ish and 4 ish smacking worked for me and our family.

Considering very few kids have a long term memory at that age I am not a bit concerned that they will remember a smack an start hitting me back when they are a teenager

BTW I remember ONE TIME when my dad smacked me, it was just after I had smacked my mum. I was 13 and it scared the hell out of me that I could do such a thing actually, and I deserved a clout that my dad gave me Never did it again, I knew the boundries and although I pushed against them, I never stepped over them again. And I got up to ALOT as a teenager

It doesn't mean that a child who doesn't get smacked won't hit or be violent when older, but to my mind, as toddlers when many deep ingrained 'ways of the world' are laid down, if your parents, your ultimate role models smack, then it's going to be in your culture that 'smacking/hitting is ok if the person does wrong'.

beatie, I'm not trying to say you are airy fairy but there is no way on eath I would stand in a car park because my child wouldn't get in a car seat. You are giving in to what they want, which isn;t going to stop the behaviour at all.
I can accept that the car park might be too busy to leave a two year old outside. I don't see why you couldn't push her down? A two year old isn't that strong.

Those parents who don't smack I'm interestedto knwo what is the last resort then, when a child repeatedly refuses to do as they are told.

Tortoiseshell - But everybody I know in my age group was smacked as a child!!! Have the rules suddenly changed??? Me and my friends didn't grow up thinking hitting other people was okay!

I think smacking has its place to be honest

oh and just to add fuel to the fire - before working in a school in Zimbabwe I was horrified that they still use corporal punishment - but am now convinced it works......but not in the "teacher throwing the chalk duster at the child" or "rap 'em over the fingers with a ruler way" - like my views on smacking if done properly, and in a way where the children know what will happen for particularly bad and repteated behaviour it works

And on that note I must go and make some vegetable soup

Kelly - for us, last resort is either going to their bedroom, or taking a favourite toy (usually a train) away for a day. Or some privilege like listening to a record during Saturday breakfast. Ds is 4 and we've not reached the 'ceiling of last resorts' yet. And not smacking has the benefit that if he is rough with us or another child we can always say 'it's WRONG to hit' without expecting the reply 'but you hit me'.

I HATE the fact that I was smacked as a child, both in hot temper by my mother and in cold blood by my dad. One incident I remember vividly, as a 4 or 5 year old I wouldn't put my shoes on, and they smacked me, and I cried SO much I was sick, to which they smacked me again for making a mess.

Rules haven't changed, children are still children, but doesn't mean things have to stay the same. I was smacked at school - I would be LIVID if ds was smacked by his teacher. And my brother (as I said below) did go through a phase of hitting me and my mother, I'm sure because he was smacked.

bundle, the smacking is slowly being cut down and down, it isn't necessary anymore. I hope at the latest it will stop at 8. By that time I hope she has that maturity to be able to understand other forms of discipline and it won't be necessary. Plus, I can remember feeling humiliated about being smacked when I was older, and I wouldn't subject my kids to that. I did already mention that.

Does that really work tortoishell? How do they react? If I took a toy away from mine they wouldn't care less. They've got plenty of other toys to play with and don't really have favourites as such.

Kelly, I find a choice works really well. So, if I have asked my son to put his shoes on twice and he still doesn't do it I simply go up to him to be sure that he can here me & tell him that if he doesn't put his shoes on now, he will be walking to the car in his socks & I tell him that it is his choice. He knows I mean it, as I have done it before. Obviously, when he was younger the choice would be much simpler: we are all going to have fun in the back garden playing with xxx, if you don't behave or do xxx - then you will sit in here on your own for 5 mins while we have fun - your choice. If you always carry out the threat at a loss of compliance, it works well.

Exactly Tortoiseshell! Our generation were smacked and we didn't grow thinking it was okay to hit. Thats me point..... why would OUR children grow up thinking its okay to hit coz they were smacked..... if WE didn't grow up thinking that way?
Your memory sounds horrible by the way.... i have similar memories of being smacked repeatedly for spilling juice on the carpet. It was an accident FFS! I was so angry. I would NEVER to that to my children..... so in fact my parents smacking me out of anger had the opposite effect on me. It made me determine NOT to do that.

if you use smacking as a punishment then what do you do in the supermarket, at the beach, at the swimming pool etc, are you happy to smack in public?

Agree with Crunchie - -have smacked very infrequently and the threat of a smack still works effectively in our house (haven't smacked either of them for months/years?)

I have never lashed out at them, just used it as a last resort after warnings and particularly bad behaviour to reinforce the seriousness of the offence (eg ds2 tring to drown ds1 in the swimming pool)