My baby is 4 months and I still hate being a mother

[LittleAmy]

When is this going to change? Will it ever change? I'm at the end of my rope.

yes, but her GP is mistaken if she has been told that there is only one AD she can take while breastfeeding, because that just isn't true!!!

so, she does have other options, that's all I am saying and of course it's ok for her to move to formula and take a different AD if that's what she wants... it's just that from what I have read, that isn't what she wants!

as other posters have said, taking them for one day and having insomnia may just have been coincidental. and if it does have that affect then it may be that simply changing the time of day that it is taken can help.

it's complicated.

I would also like to reiterate that you are not wasting anyones time, MN is a great source of support.

I agree with Robynlou, your DH should go out with DD when he is looking after her. Perhaps he could put her in a carrier and go for a walk? Then you could spend some time looking after yourself (shower, mud pack for your face, straighten your hair, a bit of make up), even if you aren't going anywhere. Or you could go to a cafe yourself to get a bit of time away.

It might be controversial for MN (not sure what the general opinion of them is here) but have you tried a dummy on your DD? My DD finds it really comforting, although I know they are not to everyones taste

well that is what i think, clearly. but presumably everyone was saying this to her when she posted a month ago, and she still hasn't given in. i do understand that doggedness, personally, whether or not i agree with it at this stage.

it can be hard getting the same advice from everyone and just not feeling like you can take it for whatever reason. a bit of formula, however, is not giving up. i wonder if you would consider a bottle at night amy?

agree aitch,. a bottle of formula when you really need a break will not hurt. there is middle ground

thisisyesterday - you don't know her medical history - it may be the only one she can take while BF. I missed the bit where she said she only took it once? (is that what you are saying?). Anyway, I am leaving this thread now, for the same reasons I left the other one.

i guess sometimes you need that one thing to cling onto as well?
when it feels (rightly or wrongly) that everything else is going bad you can cling to that one thing that is "right" and it helps in some strange way.

anyway, i am off to bed now as am knackered, but LittleAmy I do hope you feel you can still come back and update/moan/cry/rant about it all. but get some real life help too! please!

yeah earlier on this thread she said she just took the one. so it's probably worth persevering with just in case it was a one-off weird coincidence

Seriously, stick the kid some formula. There is no point carrying on EBF if it's making you miserable. Stop it. It's not going to do her any harm it all. It's not good for babies to have depressed mothers. You're the only person who can actually do anything about this.

gah, i really am going i promise!

but yes, you are right, it may be that for some reason this IS the only one she can take. But it's definitely worth another trip to the GP, or a different GP if the first one wasn't that helpful, to confirm this.

I felt exactly like you do when DS was 4mo. He was waking constantly, I felt glued to the sofa, still felt like I couldn't leave him for more than a minute, never had time for a bath/shower/anything. Constantly eating cold food and missing the end of TV and he woke up SOOOO much. I truly found this the most awful time of being a Mum.. really.. I thought it was meant to get better at 6 weeks. It didn't. I waited til 12 weeks, it had got worse.. I was going literally insane from lack of sleep and other human contact.

Is there anybody that you can see on a semi-regular basis, even if it's just a mum and baby group.

The things that helped me:

Citalopram - the insomnia was shite initially, but after a week or so that eased and they helped ENORMOUSLY

Getting out - I'm an anti-social cow, but get yourself out of the house every single day without fail. If you are trapped in the house you will only feel worse. I found that the easiest way to do this was to get a shower as early as possible (after the first feed was the best time) and get myself ready so I could leave the house at a moments notice.

Counselling: I was extremely lucky to be referred to counselling by my GP, and honestly it changed my life. I'm a different, calmer, happier person because of it. I was extremely reluctant to do it, I put it off for weeks, but it changed the way I saw my role as a parent.

Also, don't feel you need to EBF, she is 4mo, you have done brilliantly, and if this is a major contribution to you feeling as tethered as you currently do, then perhaps it's not right for you and your DD.

Re-visit the anti-depressants. They can be awful for the first week or two but are life-changing after that.

HTH

By the way - DS is now almost 3yo and an incredible little boy.. it WILL GET BETTER, honestly :) xx

It sounds like you may have PND. Please speak to your HV team who should be able to help you work through how you feel xx
I felt like this at 4 months and didn't speak to anyone, it lasted 9 months because of not asking for help.

So sorry for what you are going through. I agree with the posts that suggests PND. My HV asked me how I was feeling every single time she came to the home, she had a pretty long questionary to check if the mother was suffering from depression and was bonding properly with the baby. I think your HV is not acting properly, in your posts your mention many of the points in that questionary. Go back to the doctor and say it as it is, do not be afraid of their reaction, that is part of their job, they have seen countless times, baby blues are awful, and having them for so long unbereable. going out will make you good, and it will get so much easier with time.
With the breastfeeding, I was exactly same as littlewhitewolf, she was crying on the breast more than eating, we learnt later that i had yeast infection, and milk will not come out at the beginning, so poor little one became crazy crying. Best wishes

and if your husband is doing more hurt than good, you can do without him, at least until everything is sorted out for you and DD, the most important thing now is that you feel well again, and then you bond with the little one

Afair, LittleAmy is in Tyneside.

A couple of points.

I've never taken ADs - but all my friends who have tell me they take a couple of weeks to settle down. LittleAmy took one. Just because she didn't sleep well that night doesn't mean that they cause insomnia and cannot be taken. I don't think she wants to take the anti-depressants and it would be hard enough persuading her in RL, rather than on here. Which is a shame as I think they're the only proper answer here.

Secondly - I am concerned that we don't all assume the worst about her DH. People say dreadful things in extremis - and given that she's said in this thread that she just wants to get away from both of them, I can definitely see a scenario where in the heat of a row, the DH responds by saying fine, fuck off then. I did ask whether that was the case and didn't really get a straight answer. LA, if I'm wrong about this I apologise.

Amy come back over to the meet-up thread, we are more than happy to meet up, chat, rant, offload or just spend a little while talking to actual adults.

God I've re-read my thread and it sounds a bit harsh. Amy - I'm hugely sympathetic and desperate to help. But I'm not sure things are as black as they seem and the thing is, if you're stuck in a hole and there are tools to hand, the only sensible thing to do is pick one of them up...

Amy, I felt like this at 4mo. For one thing, DS wouldn't take bottles so I was stuck with the EBF whether wanted it or not. However, I didn't know that just a few weeks later, at 5.5 months, DS would be gobbling puree and I would suddenly be free. The difference for me was miraculous. He still slept really badly, he still had to be held constantly, it took years to repair my marriage... but I suddenly wasn't needed every single minute of the day and the relief was immense. From then on it got better, and after the year was just enjoyment.

I hope very much you'll feel a change like this in a few weeks' time. However, it sounds like things have got bad enough for you that you really should have the support of your GP and HV and effective ADs. I hope you'll be able to go back to them and get them to listen and treat you effectively.

Hey again LittleAmy.

Firstly I would say carry on breastfeeding. When I felt shit, and considered stopping, even giving a bottle of EBM made me feel like a failure. I felt like you, that breastfeeding was the only thing I was doing right, and the idea of stopping made me think "Well what's the point of me being here then?". So for now, keep with it. When you are more stable then reconsider if you wish. Its also proven that BFing mums have lower rates / effects of PND, partially due to the extra sleep they get when chemicals are released at night feeds. Any extra sleep for you right now is a bonus.

Secondly I would tell you to get to your doctor. There are several ADs you can take when breastfeeding. Also the side effects on the first night or so do not stay at the same level constantly. Its normally the first two / three days. What time did you try taking them?

Thirdly I'd sit down with your DH and have a frank and honest conversation about how low you feel, and how you need his help right now. He is perfectly capable of entertaining a 4mo for a few hours, even. You may need to give him a list of things to do the first time, but you will also need to tell him and yourself that he is capable to deal with your baby if they start to cry. Shut the door and turn up some music so you can't hear. He will find a way of soothing and distracting her pretty quickly.

Try to get out of the house for a few minutes every day. Even if it is just to go and buy some milk from the local shop. Communicate with people. Try to get to some local groups. The more you are trapped inside, the worse you will feel. Do you have a forward facing option on your buggy? It won't do you any harm to turn it away from you for the day.

Speak to your HV about postnatal depression support groups. Knowing you are not the only one struggling and feeling like this may help.

Lastly, give yourself a break. Not everyone falls in love with parenting instantly. And that is okay. Its such an upheavel, everyone finds it stressful and upsetting to some degree. You need to get some support to help you through a difficult time. You're not Super Woman; you're just a human being.

Take care of yourself.

I'm on the waiting list for counselling (to anyone thinking I don't seek help - I seek it all the time!) I was on the waiting list in the 2nd trimester of pregnany. I finally got to the front of that waiting list last month but the counselling people said I couldnt take DD to any of the sessions, and with her being EBF I couldnt go (I can't express much). I explained this to HV and she said I need to go back to the doc and ask to be referred for community counselling where the counsellor comes to you. So I did this. Now I'm back on the waiting list.

I also saw the doc about anti-Ds. He gave me Sertaline (after lecturering me about how most women are happy to have a new baby). I took one and had terrible insomnia that night. Not even 30 minutes sleep. I was an absolute wreck the next day. And I had to look after DD the whole next day for 11 hours with no help from anyone. I simply cannot do that for 2 weeks (that's assuming the insomnia will wear off after 2 weeks. If you research Sertaline, as I did, you will read that insomnia is a common side effect. It might only wear off when you stop taking the pills). If you think I can look after DD on my own full time with ZERO sleep for 2 weeks you must be insane.

My marriage is at rock bottom. We hate eachother, and let eachother know about it.

We used to have a great relationship. We have endured many things together: e.g. my fathers death. We used to laugh at least once a day. We used to play video games together. We used to have conversations.

Now we don't even sit on the same sofa. Some nights we don't sleep in the same bed (because DD is demanding attention so one of us goes on the sofa with her so the other can at least get some sleep in the bed). We don't talk anymore. We certainly don't laugh anymore. We NEVER have sex or kiss or touch.

I am so, so lonely.

I attend 2 baby groups a week now and also a weaning course (which I organised alone off my own back before anyone says I'm lazy in seeking help).

Those things just seem so formal and stiff. Nothing meaningful.

I really miss having a meaningful adult relationship. I'm lonley. My hours are spent with a 4 month old who won't let me go to the toilet. Who won't let me go 6 foot into the kitchen to get a yoghurt out of the fridge.

If this was an employment situation - it would be illegal. To go for weeks without even an hour brake.

I RESENT my husband. He says "we have it equally hard, just different". He is talking BULLSHIT. He gets adult stimulation, a wage, career progression, respect, praise, at least an hour brake per day. FUCK HIM!!!! I hate him.

"after lecturering me about how most women are happy to have a new baby" you really need a new GP, right there.

there was a really interesting doco i saw once, where a woman with kids was wired up to all sorts of monitors, and so was her estate agent husband. it proved definitively that she worked harder, expended more energy and experienced more stress than he did.

re your dh, though, a lot of this stuff sounds like it would be sorted if you got help with the depression.

can you go into a bit of detail about your determination to 'exclusively' breastfeed? what is your thinking there, at this stage?

"Firstly, your husband - he needs to take the baby OUT. he needs to take her OUT for that hour that you need to have a bath and do your hair. You won't relax if you're waiting for her to squeak, so he needs to take her away and let you have the whole damn flat to yourself for an hour. She will not starve in an hour. feed her, hand her over, and say to him "Go for a walk and do not come back until X o clock unless you truly think she needs a doctor."

I rhink that's a very good idea. Would he think I was selfish if I asked him to do that? How often do you think it would be reasonable to ask that?

I think I mentioned on tha last thread that once every 8 weeks I get my hair coloured. I am away for 2 hours. Each time DH has sent many texts saying how DD is howling, she's starving, wont settle, etc. So I have spent that precious alone time worried sick about DD. (despite EBM in the fridge and freezer).

"try a different antidepressent"

There's not many you can take whilst BFing. Also ones that don't cause weight gain (don't even go there. I'm hideous enough as it is. If DH and I end up eplitting up. No man will even look at me. Disgusting fat face and saggy wrinkly stretch-marked tummy. I used to be quite good looking with lots of male attention. I'm absolutely disgusting now)

"have a think about whether or not you would be happier if your daughter could be fed without your breasts having to be involved."

Believe me I think about it all the time. But I would suffer a lifetime of guilt. Whereas BFing lasts 2 years.

Also I am the only BFing mother at my baby group. All the other FFing mothers watch with interest when I BF (yes I've started doing it in front of them, needs must). I feel like a champion. No way can I let them see me fail. Call me selfish. Call me stubbord or just proud. I need BFing for my self esteem. In a group of competative mothers, I know they can never trump me on that (they are nice women btw lol)

"being a good mum does not mean sacrificing yourself for your daughter. "

It sure feels that way! DD is like an extension of my body. I am her personal slave. There's probably an imprint of her body on my lap.

"I was in a similar way at 4 months (think many people hit a wall then)."

I've been this way since her birth (pregnancy was tranquil and awesome).

When is it supposed to get better?

"every little helps"

Not re: the virgin gut.

"you are already doing so much for your DD and you need to start giving yourself credit for this. "

I'm not sure what things im doing? (And Ive started reading What Mothers Do, but I still dont know what i do other than bfing that is decent)

well the virgin gut (not a credibly established fact, btw, just a theory) will certainly not be virgin when you start weaning, so you could look towards giving her some formula then. it's not bad stuff, btw, it's just not as good as bm. but hey, you will come to realise in time that good enough is good enough, as a parent. perfection is unachievable.

re dh calling, texting etc. that's not fair, he really shouldn't be doing that, she should be fine to be left without you for a while. do you think that he has bonded well with dd?

also, do you have dd in a sling? (not a babybjorn, a fabric sling). and does she nap? is she a constantly crying baby or does she just like cuddles, iykwim?

What time does DH get home from work? at 4months you could have DD ready for him to take out for an hour walk every evening when he gets in.

You NEED to force yourself to leave DD with DH for a couple of hours at least once a week, if he's never alone with her then he'll never get the chance to figure out how to settle her - the way he does it will be different to you, but it will be fine, it's actually v important for fathers to be given to chance to prove to themselves they can care for the baby alone, without instructions.

turn your phone off. the baby will not starve, the baby will be fine, she is with her other parent.

I really really do know how you're feeling, I could have written the same things 3 years ago.

It is reasonable to ask your DH to be in sole charge of DD whenever he is home. It is only unreasonable to ask him to be in sole charge of her when he is at work. He is her parent too.