GF: Love her or hate her? the Great Debate. Please leave all weapons at the door and NO stomping off, offended. OK?

[SoupDragon]

OK, to avoid the Great Debate cluttering up other threads where pro-GF mums are asking for help, I've started this one. It may have been done before...

If you read another thread and have nothing helpful but want to share your GF feelings, do it here!

I guess it could get heated here so please don't get offended and storm off in a huff as has happened elsewhere with other contentious issues - just avoid this thread

OK, for what it's worth, I have no problems with GF except for the fact that all babies are different so her rigid routine may not fit in with your baby. You should maybe see her routines as flexible - half an hour or an hour either way isn't going to make much difference is it? And I think that before 6 weeks is way too young to be messing with feeding routines, especially if you're breastfeeding. It can mess up your supply in theose important first weeks and I think this is why breastfeeding counsellors seem to hate her so much.

Right, I'm off to duck beneaththe parapet and let you get on with it!

I don't need to read the book to know that it wouldn't work for me, I have heard enough about it on Mumsnet !

Yes, I demand fed both DS1 and 2 for the first four months although not waiting till they were screaming. Then come four months I could see a routine emerging, especially with the introduction of solids, even now I can see DS2 salivating when we eat dinner in the evening, he doesn't get dinner yet so I pop him on for a b/f but soon he will get some solids then and since having children we do eat at more regimented times so DS2 will get used to having his meals at certain times and b/f will be at more regulated times, I don't have to wait until he is screaming to say it is 12 noon, the whole family is having lunch perhaps DS2 would like his too and sleeping times fit in more naturally round about, I don't wait until he drops off or becomes overtired either, but I don't feel I need GF to tell me when to do this.

My point is after all that ramble is that I have no objection to mums doing GF my only objection is that if you do not do GF you are pounced upon for saying look my child is OK, in a reasonable routine, there are other ways, if GF is making you unhappy then an option is to ditch the book, life may be a little more chaotic for the first few weeks but a routine will eventually come about.

Scummymummy and soupdragon - my ds was 9 weeks when I introduced GF - I was also already bottle feeding by that time (another long story that upsets me) so I will admit that I do not know how well it would have worked if I was b/fing

Scummymummy (I love the way you post by the way), you have hit the nail on the head for me ... I was having a really bad time when I turned to GF and things got better so therefore I am a fan - who knows, things might have improved on their own if I had carried on ... but I will never know that will I?

It is interesting isn't it because out of all my friends who have toddlers now, only one is a GF follower like me but all the toddlers seem to have reasonably similar routines - up around 7ish, nap around middayish and bed around 7ish ... and I do not know anyone who says to me that they can't come for tea because their child has tea at 7pm, not 5pm?

So, despite my rant earlier, I do see that eventually all children develop some kind of routine - it just depends on how you go about it.

I think that is why I am not doing what your friend is doing, susanmt, and saying that my next baby WILL follow GF come hell or high water, for a couple of reasons:
a) I REALLY REALLY want to b/f for longer next time and so I will try really hard to establish that before I get worried about a routine
b) I have to consider another child next time and what he is doing and it would be unfair to restrict him totally due to a new baby (somehow I am not sure it will be conducive to sibling bonding!)
c) I WANT to be more relaxed next time and try to do things sensibly, my way and my baby's way like all you wonderful supermums do.

BUT ... I will still stand by GF and say that her advice was invaluable to me when I needed it ... and if I feel that awful feeling of panic and feeling out of control that I had with DS then I will get my CLBB out again ... so there!

Susanmt - does your friend really think GF is better for her baby than bf?? Truly unbelievable! I'm sure not even GF herself suggests that!

No, I am convinced she thinks it is better for her. She is a bit obsessive and always has been, and I think the routine is so important because of that.

Demented - we were posting at the same time ...

I never pounce on people who tell me that they have a good routine with no help from GF ... I often feel jealous that I could not be comfortable enough with my DS to 'live and let live'. In fact I only usually mention GF to people if they say that they are having problems with sleep etc and ask how I got my DS to be in such a good routine ...

Another thing ... I remember when DS was tiny, that everyday seemed to last forever and by the time he was 2 months old, 6 months seemed light years away so something HAD to be done THEN, I could not wait what seemed an eternity to get some peace and some sleep.

Now, however, I know that 4 months in a baby's life is no time at all and I would like to think that I will be more relaxed about the timescale of things - am I making sense?

It amazes me why lots of you seem to get so worked up re GF!!! If it works for you then great, if you don't fancy it then don't do it - what's so difficult about that? We can all make choices about whats best for our own children - if I choose to take GF's advice (which I do & it's worked for us) -then what difference does it make to anyone else? I use GF's ideas as a guideline, I've never stuck to them like glue (for example, she's never fitted dog walking or watching 'Trisha' into her schedule) but she's hardly likely to come round my house and beat me with a big stick for it is she! DS did sleep through the night from about 2 weeks till about 12 weeks when he got a bit fussy with his feeding. He now has some weeks he sleeps through and some when he doesn't, because as someone said earlier he's an individual. This doesn't mean that all GF's ideas are rubbish. We all know we're just trying to work out what makes our children and ourselves happy. If GF says to do something at a particular time of day then that is her opinion, just because its printed in a book, its doesn't make it the gospel truth or anymore more important to me than, for example, Miriam Stoppard, a mother & baby mag or my mother telling me how she used to do it. I found the structured advice v reassuring when DS was tiny as I had no experience with babies at all and knew nothing. It seemed quite logical that if a baby has enough to eat during the day then he has no need to wake up through the night - that's hardly rocket science. However, if ds fancies a lie in some mornings then thats fine by me - when he's hungry then he'll wake up and let me know.
I know I've rambled on a bit, sorry, but I just think there are more important things to get worked up about!

MBB, I do understand what you mean.
I think there are 2 reasons why I get worked up about it (1) because GF made my life so unbearable when I tried it that I would hate to think of anyone else ending up in that situation - not everyone is as sensible as you, and GF herself writes in a style that suggests her every word is gospel! and (2) well, I'm the kind of person who gets worked up about anything which is important to me, I campaign on issues of debt releif, am on our local practice patient group, write letters about sundry issues, and as parenting is something I feel very strongly about (its my job!) then I am likely to get worked up about it too.
I'm glad GF works for you. But there are a lot of people out there for whom it has done some damage, me included, and that is what conderns me the most about the whole issue. Hope you understand.

Ghosty, I know you don't pounce on people, the person in question, don't want to name names only seems to make an appearance to do this and it gets on my nerves, that's all.

PS I'm far, far from supermum!

so, demented, what costume would Supermum wear? And would she have a great sidekick - Weak Willed Dad or something like that?

I reckon Supermum would wear her breastfeeding bra on the OUTSIDE of her clothes ... It would be silver and very sparkly

ROFL - now I can go to bed in a good mood!
Night Night xxx

psst ... what does ROFL mean? Is it good? Hope so cos I was hoping to make you smile!

Ghosty - you succeede...susanmt is Rolling On Floor Laughing

Not sure what she would wear, but I'm sure she would fly behind her really snazzy buggy and have a clean/tidy house full of homemade cakes and delicious meals while her brood of children sat producing little mini works of art, painting, making collages etc, burping away with the breastmilk rolling out the sides of their mouths. Her shopping would be all organic but very good value. Her DH would be worshiping the ground she flew across.

Hey, then I'm Supermum ....
bzzzzzzzzzzzzz
that was the alarm clock going off and waikng me up!

But I do like making collages!

Thanks Demented I have this really cool image flying around my head now! But I'm going back to GF I'm afraid.

Having been slagging her off all this time I thought I'd better finish reading CLBB. I have sat and read it cover-to-cover, and I am even more upset and confused than ever. This woman is quite quite mad, and that anyone can take her seriously is beyond belief

As I have said before as far as I am concerned people can use GF if they want and I suppose I can see the use if a mum is bottlefeeding. Afterall you do not want to be giving a baby a bottle if they are not hungry for it, would be a terrible waste to keep having to put bottles of formula down the sink because they were not wanted whereas b/feeding if you are unsure if your baby is hungry you can always pop them on and if nothing else a short feed will help boost your milk supply in the early days even if the baby does not really need it. As far as I can see GF or no GF most of us fall into some sort of routine with our babies at some point, I would just rather find that for myself.

Anyway must shut up now, there is something magnetic about these GF debates!

It is sad isn't it (thought I said I would shut up) but I have been thinking about this thread at four in the morning whilst doing the nightfeed which if we were doing CLB I would probably be in the land of nod at four in the morning!

It's her arrogance that gets to me as much as anything.

This debate is very interesting. I'm just sorry I've nothing worthwhile to add to it at present, and having been one of those egging you all on, I feel a bit sheepish .

Where is everyone tonight???

I'm here now. But I've said my bit!!!

Well, so have I, but that's not going to stop me!

Yes, well I do agree with you that the woman is quite mad, (although mad and probably very rich now), so we can't really debate it much can we???